The buck limit in 2006 was touted as producing healthier bucks, a healthier herd and better bucks.

Fifteen years later, are we seeing that? Are we definitively seeing more mature bucks, more "wow, hey, something's working!" bucks and a population? Not just in spotty areas or where QDM-style managmenet has been in place for a while. But overall, in our state, after 15 years of a 3-buck limit, are we better off in any way that can be proven biologically and not just anecdotally?

Or will we have to wait another 10-15 years after the checking system data is in, and thus 25-30 years after the buck limit, and probably with more regulations and mandates in that time, before we hear if the buck limits and check system and anything else is working?

But, "do something" so we can be progressive like all the other states. Gotta get in lockstep.

Additionally, there is a push nationally for "data" with wildlife. I'm seeing it with check systems for other animals and not just big game. Someone is pushing this, or something's going on in regard to data collection and requirements being placed upon the citizens.

Yeah yeah , and it all means doodly sh!t. We counted some dead deer

I think the numbers are way lower than actual kill total. I know some farmers that laid several does down last week of the season. No reports. I'm sure they're not the only ones. One of these guys laid down 9 deer in one afternoon a couple years back. He considers deer a pest eating his crops.

I'm willing to bet the illegal kills, night hunting, totals are equal to the reported kill totals.

None of the totals even add up correctly, how is that?

Each year also has "Unknown Gender" totals, which I didn't copy here.

State # has gradually gone up 1-2 deer every day . Folks finding ones they lost ; folks just getting around to reporting them ; anyone know the answer ?

I always figured the illegal kill was pretty near the legal kill numbers

It increased daily for at least 10-14 days the last three seasons, too.

I definitely believed that at one time, not sure any more. People are too lazy to poach.

I think there are just as many or more not reported as reported. I have heard of several people that don't and wont report deer. They are legally killed not poached and within the limits but not reported. Believe it or not there are a lot of people out there that have private land that manage it well and kill as many deer as they want/need to and don't report them. Doesn't hurt a thing IMO. If "they" are going to use data to do whatever it is "they" are trying to do then use the data you have whatever the number and stop changing how you much you get by guessing how many are not reported. that number simply doesn't matter.

[] "I think there are just as many or more not reported as reported." []

5 years ago *obviously* - but clearly not now.

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There is no way that illegal kills are as many as legal kills.
That would mean that THIS SEASON about 450,000 deer were killed, which would be bs.
And it would mean that in those years where the hunter survey estimator/statisticians estimated 400K-450K deer kills there were
really 800,000 to 900,000 deer kills, which is also bs.

I am confident at this point that there are about 220k to 230K maybe 250K tops deer killed in this state.
If that is only half the actual number of deer killed then there wouldn't be many deer in this state as they would be wiped out.

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The real question is, now that they have good accurate stats and numbers, what more bs are they going to force on the hunting community?

"The real question is, now that they have good accurate stats and numbers, what more bs are they going to force on the hunting community?"

I agree with this 100%

The thing is they will never be able to control the deer or turkey kills. Ppl will do whatever they want and when they want to do it. For what we spend every yr the last thing we need is more bs to go by. We as hunters can control ourself better than any government. Heck look at the white house. The president dont know if his wife is his sister or really his wife. Everyone will have their own opinion on hunting and how it should be done and thats fine its your opinion but dont let your opinion and ways ruin it for others. Nearly every club I know of and have been a member of have ways they manage their own club and thats how it should be. We shouldn't have to buy a permit to hunt over a darn corn pile. We shouldnt have only 3 bucks to kill. If they are worried about ppl killing way to many deer then why in the he'll do we have the entire season open to kill does???

We hunters are de facto agents of the department's management plan to help keep the population in check. That's one reason for the liberal doe seasons.

We need more GWs, plain and simple. Of course, no one wants to pay for them, so we won't get them.

The solution to what we are facing in the future is not a simple one......There's actually a LOT to be considered in the decision making process on how we should do things.... more so than what most of us take into consideration when we want to bitch about how something is being done......I'd love to go to a more bow hunting oriented system but how does that effect the $$$......While we like to make $$$ out to be evil all the time the fact remains that it does matter in the decision making process.......You want to shorten the season??.....How does that effect folks economically??......It matters.......No one hardly ever talks about habitat loss and land use changes but those are major drivers that have effected wildlife management in our state too and will continue to have an even more dramatic impact if we do not begin to look at alternative ways of managing the land that reduces continued fragmentation......All of this number counting won't really matter and won't do anything other than tell us what we already know.....

We use to stack them up on dog drives in the 70’s and land was $2 per acre to lease. I’m not so mad with them now and kill maybe 2 a season but this year I didn’t kill a single deer. Not to mention I believe they’re less hunters now. So what’s the big deal. It all boils down to $$$$ signs.

I don't think there is any real problem that needs any so-called "solution" or any further government intervention.

I am thankful for the buck limits that were instituted long ago.
Perhaps there are some places in the state that need to further limit doe harvest - and that has been discussed before.
But at this point I think the DCNR just needs to leave things and hunters alone. Just encourage people to practice QDM.

The state has run at a GW deficit of about two dozen officers for at least 25 years, and probably longer. It's a never-ending issue.

The solution I'm talking about will come after our current endeavor. When folks get tired of all the additional hoops we have to jump through just to go hunting.....I dont think the way we're doing things now is the best long term path.....It may be the one we take anyways but....