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Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3199809
08/24/20 09:48 PM
08/24/20 09:48 PM
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Earth
TDog93 Offline
Booner
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Booner
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Earth
What CNC says prob work great - Fishboy - you could Also spray and those fields Stay dead for Good while and all u hav is the thatch - wait for good rain then plant just before rain - should be good. You can get good 25 gallon sprayers for around $250 - $350 that go in back of ATV or ranger


Hunt the wind - leave it better than you found it - love your neighbor as you love your self
We need prayer for our country now more than ever
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3200561
08/25/20 08:26 PM
08/25/20 08:26 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,813
Awbarn, AL
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Dances With Weeds
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Awbarn, AL
So circling back to the discussion on the possibility of dog fennel being a keystone specie……If you look at the early successional plant communities and the change in species composition from one successional stage to the next…..grasses tend to be what I'd call the foundation plants ….They tend to be deep rooted plants that hold the soil intact and supply the food chain with carbon….In the first successional stage crabgrass played this role in my field…..Now that my field has progressed out of that first stage and onto more fertile conditions with more stage 2 plants….the crabgrass has slowly disappeared……

So what is now taking its place as the “grass” component of the summer mix……dog fennel. Eventually there will likely be things like switchgrass, Indian grass, big blue stem, etc…..that will come in and make up the grass component when the field reaches more of a climax condition…..However, during this time in the middle between the true pioneer species and climax species…we're (talking about repairing soil now keep in mind)…the dog fennel is our foundation plant …..When I look at it growing in my field I see it from an engineering standpoint. It looks to me like huge pillars that’s holding the soil intact as well as being one of our main carbon producers…..just look at the root masses. Not only that but its transitioning us away from the solid mat of grass like crabgrass and into more of a bunch grass type situation where other plants species have room to grow in its understory…..as well as allowing wildlife room to move around and be sheltered underneath it.

Another key role I think dog fennel is playing has to do with helping the whole plant community with soil moisture management. If you’ll watch when we go through a drought….dog fennel will be the last thing to suffer....if it ever does. I’ve seen us in severe drought where everything was brown yet the dog fennel was still green. It apparently doesn’t require massive amounts of moisture to grow or either its tapping into deep reserves. I think it does two things to help with moisture management. 1) I think it forms a symbiotic relationship with the other plants through m. fungi which allow the other plants to access the moisture that the dog fennel is pulling from the soil. I know I’ve seen some kind of definite relationship between dog fennel and clover. 2) The other way in which I think its helps the other plants is simply through providing shade.

I’ll stop there for now so as not to get too long………



Last edited by CNC; 08/25/20 08:31 PM.

We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3200619
08/25/20 08:54 PM
08/25/20 08:54 PM
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 18,093
North AL
A
AU338MAG Offline
Old Mossy Horns
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North AL
Originally Posted by CNC


I’ll stop there for now so as not to get too long………



That ship sailed long ago...


Dying ain't much of a living boy...Josey Wales

Molon Labe
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3200635
08/25/20 09:07 PM
08/25/20 09:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,813
Awbarn, AL
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Dances With Weeds
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Dances With Weeds
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Awbarn, AL
I touched on this just briefly in the last post but one of the final reasons I believe dog fennel is an important species is because of the type of biomass it provides for the soil. If you look at the stem of dog fennel its dang near like a small tree sapling. There are very few…..if any….of the other early successional species that provides the system with this type of woody biomass. I think its this type of biomass that likely helps to transition the soil conditions onto the next level by bringing in a fungal component that the other plant species likely don’t do.

I think that one of the reasons folks dislike it so much is its tendency to dominate their food plots during the summer. I think much of this though is due to our over use of nitrogen and the excess amount that’s present in the soil. If a more balanced approach is taken I believe that dog fennel wouldn’t be nearly as aggressive and it would be more like the "foundation pillars" I described in the last post…..with one here and there across the field allowing room for the other species to grow underneath it. I think it’s a misunderstood species that’s hated without really any knowledge of its true role. This is just one person’s opinion so take it with a grain of salt.

Last edited by CNC; 08/25/20 09:08 PM.

We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3200667
08/25/20 09:33 PM
08/25/20 09:33 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,813
Awbarn, AL
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Dances With Weeds
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Awbarn, AL
Y’all like music……I like music……I like to throw out a song or two every now again in my threads just to keep it entertaining…….Here’s one now…..I think they call these “guilty pleasure songs”….. blush



We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3203346
08/28/20 10:59 AM
08/28/20 10:59 AM
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Posts: 21,813
Awbarn, AL
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We’re about 5 weeks out from planting now……To get ready for it I’ll go ahead this weekend and not do anything to the plot……In another couple weeks I’ll come back in and not do anything again…..Then maybe like 2 or 3 days ahead of planting….…..I’ll not do anything that day either…..When I see a good rain event coming after Oct 1…..I’ll spread my seed….run over the vegetation and then walk away…..It may take 30-45 minutes to plant a few acres depending on many times I stop to get another beer. After I’m done planting, I’ll come back in a few weeks later and start back doing nothing again. laugh


Last edited by CNC; 08/28/20 11:00 AM.

We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3203647
08/28/20 04:28 PM
08/28/20 04:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 38,489
N. Bama
257wbymag Offline
Boo Boo Head
257wbymag  Offline
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N. Bama
Ok


Quietly killing turkeys where youre not!!!
My tank full of give a fraks been runnin on empty
I'm the paterfamilias
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3203860
08/28/20 08:27 PM
08/28/20 08:27 PM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 4,500
george county ms
johndeere5036 Offline
10 point
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Hell yes I love looking at a wild brushy food plot. While your doing nothing I’ll be drinking beer preparing food plots. I live for this time of year. There’s nothing better than finally getting in the woods and doing some tractor work. I loose sleep at night thinking about how I can make my hunting land better. My kids love to go help do the tractor work and see how things are done to make nice pretty food plots

Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3203863
08/28/20 08:28 PM
08/28/20 08:28 PM
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Posts: 38,489
N. Bama
257wbymag Offline
Boo Boo Head
257wbymag  Offline
Boo Boo Head
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N. Bama
Lose sleep pal. Get it right. rofl


Quietly killing turkeys where youre not!!!
My tank full of give a fraks been runnin on empty
I'm the paterfamilias
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3203887
08/28/20 08:47 PM
08/28/20 08:47 PM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 30,910
Clanton, AL
Out back Offline
Grumpy Old Man
Out back  Offline
Grumpy Old Man
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Clanton, AL
Just something about that smell of fresh turned earth, gets my motor running.


My opinions and comments are my own. They do not reflect the position or political opinions of Aldeer or any of the Aldeer administration.
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3203894
08/28/20 08:55 PM
08/28/20 08:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
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N. Bama
257wbymag Offline
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N. Bama
I don’t even own a disk anymore. I love the smell of gramoxone getting poured in my sprayer then my Great Plains drill no tilling a few weeks later. That dam drill is nearly as aggressive as a disk.


Quietly killing turkeys where youre not!!!
My tank full of give a fraks been runnin on empty
I'm the paterfamilias
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: johndeere5036] #3203919
08/28/20 09:32 PM
08/28/20 09:32 PM
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Posts: 21,813
Awbarn, AL
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Dances With Weeds
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Awbarn, AL
Originally Posted by johndeere5036


Hell yes I love looking at a wild brushy food plot. While your doing nothing I’ll be drinking beer preparing food plots. I live for this time of year. There’s nothing better than finally getting in the woods and doing some tractor work. I loose sleep at night thinking about how I can make my hunting land better. My kids love to go help do the tractor work and see how things are done to make nice pretty food plots


Nobody said that I don't improve my property.......Work smarter not harder........Its not all about how much and how hard you can go at it. Its about how productive you're actions are being that you do take. I make tweaks and changes but /I don't fight nature all the time trying to beat her into submissio.n....I work WITH what I was given.....i just give things a helping hand to nudge in the direction I wan them to go.

Last edited by CNC; 08/28/20 09:35 PM.

We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3203937
08/28/20 09:47 PM
08/28/20 09:47 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,813
Awbarn, AL
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Dances With Weeds
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Dances With Weeds
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Awbarn, AL
Here’s a good example of what I’m talking about…..Come Feb as soon as season ends…..I’ll hook up to my disk and begin to trample down some 3rd successional vegetation…Not disk it up now mind you.....just trample the vegetation to the ground during dormant season. I’ll only do a portion of the understory though because there’s other areas that are in their 2nd year…..I’ reset them next year….Its a little mosaic if different classes of early successional plant communities….on a pretty small a scale….like 3-4 acre units….most all of it is in prime cover except for a few acres of winter plots that open up. You could manage like this on as small or as large of a scale as you wanted....Larger scale operations need done with cows or buffalos instead of tractors
....and of course fire too when needed or more practical

Using the disk to just trample down and reset the vegetation down in Feb just makes it to where that area doesn’t really miss a beat. It’ll be a little open at the first of spring but then it’ll flush out and grow. We don’t mind a few open areas for bugging in the spring any who…..Then cover later on for poults......You can set succession back during the growing season in this same manner and have a little different impact. Done at the right time under the right conditions….Reseting the veg about mid summer this way can cause annuals just to reset and put off a new flush of young growth during the second half of summer…..Numerous units or paddocks constantly shuffling through different early stages of growth at different times.......Hell, here I go rambling again………



Last edited by CNC; 08/28/20 10:50 PM.

We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: johndeere5036] #3203942
08/28/20 09:58 PM
08/28/20 09:58 PM
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Posts: 21,813
Awbarn, AL
CNC Offline OP
Dances With Weeds
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Dances With Weeds
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Awbarn, AL
Originally Posted by johndeere5036


Hell yes I love looking at a wild brushy food plot. While your doing nothing I’ll be drinking beer preparing food plots. I live for this time of year. There’s nothing better than finally getting in the woods and doing some tractor work. I loose sleep at night thinking about how I can make my hunting land better. My kids love to go help do the tractor work and see how things are done to make nice pretty food plots


Your also beating down the woods in the weeks leading up to opening day.....I'm not......Really give that some thought.....While you're coming in like road crew.....its silent and quiet here relatively speaking,...Its every day normal anyways.

Last edited by CNC; 08/28/20 09:59 PM.

We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3203944
08/28/20 10:00 PM
08/28/20 10:00 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,813
Awbarn, AL
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Dances With Weeds
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Awbarn, AL
Some times the best thing you can do is........nothing.





Here's one for the grammar police.....Was that the correct use of "Some times"???

Last edited by CNC; 08/28/20 10:01 PM.

We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3203965
08/28/20 10:46 PM
08/28/20 10:46 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
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Awbarn, AL
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Dances With Weeds
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Awbarn, AL
It's a hell of lot cooler after hunting season too....... smile


We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3203982
08/28/20 11:17 PM
08/28/20 11:17 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,813
Awbarn, AL
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Dances With Weeds
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Dances With Weeds
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Awbarn, AL
Did any of that come across too much like a “prick a$$”……If it did just let me know and I’ll go back and see if I can sprinkle a little sugar on it for some of the more sensitive readers….. laugh


Last edited by CNC; 08/28/20 11:17 PM.

We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3204076
08/29/20 07:25 AM
08/29/20 07:25 AM
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 4,500
george county ms
johndeere5036 Offline
10 point
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Posts: 4,500
george county ms
Originally Posted by CNC
[quote=johndeere5036]

Hell yes I love looking at a wild brushy food plot. While your doing nothing I’ll be drinking beer preparing food plots. I live for this time of year. There’s nothing better than finally getting in the woods and doing some tractor work. I loose sleep at night thinking about how I can make my hunting land better. My kids love to go help do the tractor work and see how things are done to make nice pretty food plots


Your also beating down the woods in the weeks leading up to opening day.....I'm not......Really give that some thought.....While you're coming in like road crew.....its silent and quiet here relatively speaking,...Its every day normal anyways.
[/quot
Haha you have a theory for everything I guess. Funny how I can manage and keep up a couple thousand acres and will be done working way before bow season comes in and have good success early season. Have fun doing nothing I’ll send some pics later of me enjoying doing the work before the season comes in🤘🤘

Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3204349
08/29/20 02:40 PM
08/29/20 02:40 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 21,813
Awbarn, AL
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Dances With Weeds
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Dances With Weeds
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Awbarn, AL
Knock it out John!!!!! .......... Weeesew.... laugh


We dont rent pigs
Re: The “Do Nothing” approach to food plotting [Re: CNC] #3204467
08/29/20 06:11 PM
08/29/20 06:11 PM
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Posts: 9,519
Trussville
T
toothdoc Offline
14 point
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Trussville
I enjoy sitting on the tractor way more than hunting.

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