The church is not a building, it is a body of believers where Christ is the head. Problems in the Church are one of two things. The flesh or not of Christ. For me, it is that simple. If I am being offended at church I have to soul search. Is my issue of the flesh or is it not of God. If it is the latter then Matthew 18:15-17 is my remedy. You will never ever find a body of people who will agree on everything. The world is starved of leadership. The church is not different.

I look at church like an Alcoholics Anonymous meeting. All people are broken. It's only when we expect perfection that we're disappointed. But the whole reason we go to church, is because those people know they're imperfect and need help. Would we ever criticize folks at an AA meeting for being a little rough around the edges? Nope, they're there because they recognize they are.

Though it is not perfect, I appreciate our little country church in Brierfield. We do not have membership or committees at our church. I was the chairman of the elders at our last church, and I do not miss that position. I learned a lot from it, but I do not miss it.

Jeremy

Very true. Problem is there are no prefect churches because they are made up of imperfect people. If someone is truly unhappy in a given church they can try to chance it for the better or move on and find a place that they fit better.

Essentially what happened is the Roman Empire borrowed/adopted Christianity from their subjects in the middle east in 380AD because of Constantine IMO. He had a vision and becomes a patron of one particular branch of Christianity that includes both the Old and New Testament as part of it's cannon. This includes a governmental model that Constantine uses to consolidate his secular power and he basically gives the church federal funding. Then he targets all the other Christian ideologies and eliminates them.

There was a vision of a renewed Rome. There was no separation of Church and State. You can decide for yourself what the motivation or goals were.

The Romans made Christianity their religion. In my opinion they molded it to fit their needs. They built up the Catholic Church and after the Roman's power vanished the Catholic Church remained as really the only force in Europe through the middle ages. It became the dominate religion in Europe and thus became the dominate religion in the West.

In 1517 (1,137 years later) Martin Luther began by criticizing the sale of indulgences, insisting that the Pope had no authority over purgatory and that the Catholic doctrine of the merits of the saints had no foundation in the Bible.

Now they surely didn't lie about anything or have any motivation, their own interpretation, etc.. Right? It's all right there written by the hand of God right?

501 Years later and 242 years after we won our independence and declared the Separation of Church and State. Now a single church can operate on it's own accord. So instead of being governed from a central source now you have essentially self-governance.

In my opinion what you are complaining about... this is what "Church" has always been designed for. The difference being you are seeing the politics and cult like aspects of an individual church at the local level.... instead of at the Vatican or by their direction. Nobody is really giving your local church orders. Thus it can take on it's own form and function socially, politically, etc.

I've got no issues with faith, however I too am cautious about the real ideology behind organized religion.

Great idea. Do you know of any around the Hoover area?

I was raised being in a church building every time the door was open. Was baptized 45 years ago. I do not attend as much as most folks claim I should. I've actually been told by more than one that I'm hell bound for not going. Book says gather together to praise the Lord. Doesn't say in a building. The building ia the body of Christ. Also been told that is up to the Lord. I firmly believe that.
I know folks who have been going to church 50 years but have never been baptized. Bible describes baptism as being emersed in water. Not sprinkled.
I try to live right. Pray daily. Help those in need if I can. Witness His greatness to folks almost each day.
Am I going to Hell. I pray not. Lord knows and I know him through his teachings.

Time for Stray to post a few pages.

Saying I heard many years ago. If the whole world knew what one dead man knew. And not talking about Jesus Christ.

Not in Hoover, but I know of several in St. Clair and Talladega counties.

I'm trying my best not to do that so much anymore.

Great idea, and I think a lot of people would be much happier and effective in a house church type setting. If you can't find one, and you don't feel satisfied in an established church, start a new one.

Any organization with people in it is going to be flawed. I think that the bigger the church, the easier it is for it to become more about entertainment than worship, and yet some of the mega churches seem to somehow manage a spirit of worship. If the Lord is in it, anything is possible. If He isn't, the smallest thing becomes impossible.

Not a fault Michael. It speaks great volumes of you faith.
Just hard for me to read that much at times

I consider myself a man of God and always have. I just cant believe if we arent saved then we are damned. I dont believe im goin to hell if im not baptised. It just dont make sense to me. As well as giving 10 or 20 percent of my income to a church. Lets meet outside and have church. Look at all that big money spent on church buildings and huge properties. It dont feel rite to me. Folks going hungry and poor and those huge churches everywhere. And then they pass the offering plate around. I see very few churches that arent about social status, games and baby sitting. I thought we gathered to learn God instead of 10 minutes of preaching and the rest playing

There’s a lot to what someone told me years ago. I don’t have to go to church to believe in and worship God. He also said churches are like banks there’s a different one popping up every day.

This topic is kind of ironic because it wasn’t too long ago the topic cane up of churches and I made the comment that they have become too theatrical, showy and become coffee shops. I almost got blasted. Most churches are evolving just to boost attendance. I’m not going to say it’s all about the money but follow it and see where it leads. Big buildings big expenses. The church of the highlands comes to mind.

So you don't believe in tithing?

Who came up with the 10-20%? Man.

While I can agree with that, it is difficult to be a lone ranger Christian. The Bible says we are to pray for each other, bear each other's burdens, edify each other, assemble regularly with each other. That "each other" part is speaking of Christian fellowship. What better place to do it than with your local body of believers?

ummm GOD, the word tithe literally means 10%

Pardon my verbiage. I didn't mean the legalistic 10% tithe, I just meant giving to the church in general.

This is impossible. Sorry, I am not trying to call you out Jake.

I would question if one is a Christain and be a long ranger. God's command is "GO" -Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, Matthew 28:19 . He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. Mark 16:15 You cant do that by yourself. Good works/deeds alone will not secure your seat in heaven.