As my two boys get older I am seeing why our education system is failing to put productive minded kids out into the world. Not only that but why they are so entitled and such crapheads on into adulthood.

It's hard to make a dig at my wife but she is a prime example of what happened to the paddle as a means of setting chit strait with a kid who didn't want to play by the rules. My oldest is almost 12 and just don't give a crap about anything. Yes... I do remember that stage of my life but a leather belt and the thought of consequence as a result of not doing what I was supposed to do was enough to put me in my place. Poor grades, lack of manners, disrespect and just plain old not doing what I was told all held the same end result. Whooped arse and I mean call DHR type whooped or I lost privilege so something dear to me.

I'm trying to get my bluff in on my boys at a young age before their balls drop and it really gets tough. Wife keeps jumping in giving the answer most educators seem to give these days. " Kids need positive reinforcement" "they should be rewarded for good behavior" . I call BS. This is why our schools are sending kids out with an everyone gets a trophy mentality. These kids get everything they want why would rewarding them with more stuff or priveledges entice them to walk the line. My opinion is that it's more effective to take priveledges away and replace them with not so pleasant activities and punishment.

I told her I hope she knows what she is asking for because her method,which is the method they teach these educators and administrators, is going to fail. The kids earn no respect for people who hand them everything and I hope she is ready to have her little heart broken when one of these two hard ankles I have looks down at her and tells her what to go do with herself. I told her tonight she has one year to run discipline in our house lock stock and barrel. Come next March 1 if I don't see these boys making the grades they are capable of, doing there chores without being asked, and acting like responsible polite young men there is going to be hell to pay.

If I am wrong in my ways of punishment of kids I will make some big apologies to a bunch of educators. I'm feeling pretty good about my odds of never having to issue that apology.


Who else thinks we should just keep giving them more rewards and never punish based on a consequence?

I think id cut that back to 90 days, 180 at the most. Most of us here remember a sore arse from time to time, and looking back, I deserved every one of them !!

Ask my 7 yr old right now. He's in deep shucks. Brought home a 13 and 23 on math test a few weeks ago. We took shucks away that meant the most to him mainly his tool box. We don't play that positive stuff here. We reduced him to nothing and having to dig his way back up. He's capable just don't give a shucks. That's gonna change real quick.

The reward for good behavior is not getting your azz torn up. I commend you on being right headed. I see most kids as spoilded brats. My generation worked when we wanted a fishing reel or ball glove. Now they are handed everything. Give me a break, TIME OUT! This attitude is why we see the spoilded brats crying because their side lost the election. It's like the child crying because they want something. today they cry until they get their way instead of their butt torn up.They need to learn respect for everyone, Parents, LEO, God and Country.

You are spot on!! Going through this myself as I am step dad for 3 boys. Given everything they want and no chores etc. it's tuff. I have to just take my ass outside sometimes before I blow a gasket. We are headed for a come to Jesus meeting before long I'm afraid

Yelka280, y'all sound like me and my wife. My boys are 23 and 18. Been there. Write this down. One day your wife will see the error of her ways and say "you tried to tell me." There was no reasoning with my wife back when and there is no reasoning with these 2 knucklehead boys of mine know. But I'm still trying.

Ain't neither one of my kids ever made a dollar outside the home. I mixed mud and toted blocks for my granddad from age 12-18. Guess what? If Paw didn't have a job, my dad had me pulling wire on a house or toting torches and compressors for A/C units. Also raised a garden. Best damn thing ever happened to me. Taught me a work ethic. I made twice the minimum wage before I could drive. So there was definitely some reward too.
My grandpa and my dad really knew hard work. Every generation gets a little softer I think. I got a few of them DHR whippings too and I survived.
If I ever whooped one of mine just a little I had to fill out a "use of force" report and there was an internal affairs investigation and I ended up on probation.

I had a friend say one time that he wanted the world to look at his kids, and say they are "weird" (different).

Pretty much the opposite of what the liberal ideals of society pushes on us. Unrelenting positive reinforcement with few behavorial consequences is simply a liberal ideal.

One of my parenting goals will be judged when my boys are in college. If they go to the beach with their friends on Spring Break, I'll be crushed. If they come home to turkey hunt with their father - success!!

That's a great way to measure parenting success. I will have to write that down so I'll remember it 16 years from now.

Not just dishing out punishment, but they need to learn to work for something. What are their chores?

My parents did NOT spare the rod. By 1990's standards it was child abuse. By today's standards it was attempted murder.

While I agree with what you are saying mostly, since when is it the educators fault that today's parents will not discipline? Kids need discipline and they need structure there is no doubt. But for you to put your blame on teachers is not fair. Not to mention teachers can and do discipline but there is zero reinforcement at home.

The problem today is parents are not parenting and are scared to be the bad guy. A lot of parents today expect teachers to parent for them for 7 hrs a day, then when they are home that parent is their friend.

I have taught for 20 years up here in IN. When I started teaching in you sent a kid to the office he was crying before he got to the door. Principal would light them up. They stopped that years ago because of law suits even though its still legal. Now these ladies will stand here and argue with these kids and they will talk back etc. They call me mean because you will behave in my room I don't put up with that crap. I have 24 kids and 3 live with both parents. I have always said you should have to have a license to have children. We have the wrong people having them.

I was not clear. Not blaming the teacher. My wife is a teacher and this is how she says teachers are instructed to handle punishment. It's the way the "book" says to do it. It bleeds into my house. What am getting at is That this is how our kids are being felt with at school when you wonder wtf is going on with your kids head.

I used to think I knew how to raise kids until I raised 5 of them.

I know it's popular in certain circle to simply say, "You need to tear their ass up!" but in my experience that has not always worked. Children are little people and as such are all different from one another as you and I. Which, in my experience, means they all require different approaches.

We have had two, my stepson who my wife adopted at 3 years old from a really bad home life, and my youngest daughter who is simply very strong willed, who we "wore their asses out" when they needed it and loved them when we felt they needed it. However apparently they needed something else that we as parents overlooked because they still have had difficulties as adults.

My oldest son, was never super strong willed, just kind of a follower and always seemed to be hanging out with the wrong crowd and getting into stupid situations. He had a good heart and was a fairly good boy, in that he was never belligerent to me and always gave me a hug and we could hang out and talk. Well if you know me you know his whole sad story recently. Apparently corporal punishment didn't work in this case, because I never "spared the rod" with him either.

My oldest daughter is also very strong willed, outspoken, high strung and vivacious. She has been though a lot as well as the other's including the death of her mother from brain cancer. I was more of a hippy and a free spirit when I had her, and I can never recall giving her a spanking. She turned out fine and is a very successful young woman who makes good money working for a group of doctors and is highly valued in her field. She also has given me three wonderful grandchildren.

My youngest son was nicknamed "The Golden Boy" when he was little because he was never a "Daddy, Daddy, Daddy, Mommy, Mommy, Mommy, Look at Meeeeee..." kind of kid and could just sit quietly for hours playing legos or trucks by himself. He's always been a good student, a good son, caring for others, etc... All this despite going through a traumatic divorce with his mother and me and then her running off and not seeing him for over a year when he was just 7 years old. I raised him as a single parent for several years before I met Mrs. Irish and we got married. The only trouble he has ever been in was when he has been swept up with some stupid crap one of his older brother's enticed him into, and that that was extremely rare. In most cases he has apparently used them as an example of what not to do. He is an honor student, earned a scholarship to college, helps around the house, doesn't complain, and is simply a great kid. I have never given him a spanking either. Ever.

My point with this whole, long post is that there are simply not fast and hard rules in parenting, like "You need to wear their asses out." It would be great if life was that easy, but it's not. Parenting requires love above all, then understanding, hugs, positive affirmation, then and only then on the rare occasion that they need it, discipline. And if you do the first things correctly, you may not need the latter.

My wife always wanted to step in when I was going to whip my boys and it didn't work. I was not going to have disrespectful mouthy kids period. My mom would get fighting mad at me for whipping them but I just had to let her know they were mine to raise. By the way they are now two hard working respectful men. One in the Army the other a Machinist and we are very close.

Good post Irish. They are all different. It is sad that as 5th graders I can look at the girls and have a pretty go ideal which ones will end up pregnant and which boys will end up in trouble. I get on out local sheriff dept. website every morning to look at the jail arrest with pictures and I always see the ones I knew would be there and a few that really surprised me.

One problem that tends to be prevalent in many marriages today is that there is vey little discussion about discipline of children even before the marriage occurs and children are born. If a couple receives counseling before marriage, this should be a big part of the discussion along with finances. No counseling, the couple needs to talk about both and be on the same page. If they are not in agreement on discipline, there will be trouble ahead in the marriage, and children pick up on disagreements between parents, and then play them only causing more problems.

I could go on and on about what the Bible says and all, but the main problem this day and time is selfishness. Many dad's are not involved in their children's lives. They want to be out doing what they want to do instead of being the godly dad that is outlined in the Bible. Leave the kids to mom, school teachers, Sunday School teachers, etc. why I go out and enjoy my life. Heck, I deserve it after working 40 or 40+ hours a week. I know because I at one time was caught up in it. Fortunately, God showed me my way was in error of His Word. Mothers have an absolutely extreme effect on their children. She loves them pretty much more than anyone other than Christ Himself. But, with as much love and care that a mother can give, she cannot replace a loving and caring father. A dad who accepts and lives as a godly example to his children, and makes sacrifices for his family, will set the tone of the rest of his children's lives. Yeah, there will always be the prodigals, but if the dad has done his job, those prodigals will return if they don't destroy themselves during their wayward years. And if that happens, a dad has the satisfaction of knowing he did what was right in the eyes of the Lord.

Men in our country today should be very saddened by the fact that dad's have underperformed and have not taken the role of responsibility given to them. There are some very good dad's out there, but unfortunately, many more have let women and others usurp their position of authority in the home or they're just not present in the home. Way too many children run our homes today. Men need to step up and lead their families; not as a ruler, but as a loving father like our Father in Heaven. Just like our Father in Heaven disciplines us out of love, we should do so to our children because we love them. Plus, we need to remember to love our wives as Christ loves the church. A great example to our children in coming years when they will be choosing a husband or wife.

The old clich�, "Expect nothing and you'll get nothing", holds very true to raising our children. We need to get back to honoring the lines of authority given in God's Word. And we must teach them to our children, and expect them to have respect for us and others. Folks, the children of today are the leaders of tomorrow. What is going to happen to our country if we sit idly by and not accept our responsibilities as dads? As the Apostle Paul would say, "Heaven forbid".

Well I grew up with a loving but strict dad. Thing's where hard for him growing up. His dad physically and emotionally abused him.his oldest brother moved out the day he came home and paw paw was beating my dad with a hoe handle. My dad didn't continue that type of discipline. Don't get me wrong a got a whole bunch of dhr come get you butt whoopins but I always KNEW what the whooping was for witch I think is very important. I have 2 daughters under 4 yo and I do spank the oldest when needed. One thing I won't do is spank for school grades and test scores. I believe in taking privileges from them for grades and whippings for undesirable actions. What ever you do do it with love and show them respect because they deserve both.

Anybody that thinks an occasional whipping is enough, doesn't get it. I'm not saying they don't work, it's just not enough.