I don't believe that was broken out by District but I'd venture to say I know who is perceiving the decline because I've met with a few of them.

Oct1981, that was a great post.

>>>i believe the science is spot on. Most of you who are so passionate about turkeys also believe this. Its starts at the nest. Birds must have ample nesting habitat not only for the protectiom of the nest but also for a safe brood rearing habitat. It must provide great cover and food to raise a new poult for the first few weeks of life at least until the point at which that bird is able to fly to escape ground predation.

However, most hunters do not have the ability, whether it be the resource (land, equipment, time, cash, etc.) or the knowledge to properly manage for nesting habitat. <<<

You are certainly correct, but some landowners that are also hunters have that ability. The generous season and limit has encouraged those people to spend the money, forgo the income, and do the work to provide that habitat. When turkey and deer were being reestablished in AL, the dcnr talked about their partnership with landowners and the fact they wanted liberal seasons to encourage people to manage for wildlife. It was a unique philosophy that few other states followed, and it resulted in AL having the best turkey hunting in the nation. The current dcnr seldom even mentions that partnership that brought back deer and turkey. Reading their publications, one could get the idea that a certain national turkey organization is responsible for what we have. That ain't the way it happened.

The decline of quail is a good example of the need for landowner management to produce wildlife. Its extremely expensive to manage land for quail and it takes a lot of land to do it. As I'm sure you know, they are much different from turkeys. They can't survive in isolation. I don't know what the minimum amount of land needed to produce quail might be, but I can say 400 acres is not enough. I got my place up to having 2 coveys, but they faded away and now I don't think I have a bird.

But the same efforts to produce quail did indeed work for turkeys. They nest in the cover I provided, and then spread out to the paper company land around me. Everyone in the area benefits, and I'm happy that my neighbors have turkeys to hunt too.

Will the thousands of landowners like me that are passionate enough about turkeys to manage their land for them continue to do it now? Those are the places where turkeys are produced. Has anyone at the dcnr even thought about this? I haven't heard it mentioned.

The biggest single landowner in Alabama fails to do this. I cant understand how regulating thousands of people more to do one thing vs managing the tens of thousands of acres that goes unmanaged makes sense. Oddly they are the ones holding studies on this same poorly managed property and the ones that think reducing limit and days is the root cause to this idea of population decline. Thanks forever wild/Socialism you are everything a lot of us thought you would be.

Oct1981, that was a great post.

>>>i believe the science is spot on. Most of you who are so passionate about turkeys also believe this. Its starts at the nest. Birds must have ample nesting habitat not only for the protectiom of the nest but also for a safe brood rearing habitat. It must provide great cover and food to raise a new poult for the first few weeks of life at least until the point at which that bird is able to fly to escape ground predation.

However, most hunters do not have the ability, whether it be the resource (land, equipment, time, cash, etc.) or the knowledge to properly manage for nesting habitat. <<<

You are certainly correct, but some landowners that are also hunters have that ability. The generous season and limit has encouraged those people to spend the money, forgo the income, and do the work to provide that habitat. When turkey and deer were being reestablished in AL, the dcnr talked about their partnership with landowners and the fact they wanted liberal seasons to encourage people to manage for wildlife. It was a unique philosophy that few other states followed, and it resulted in AL having the best turkey hunting in the nation. The current dcnr seldom even mentions that partnership that brought back deer and turkey. Reading their publications, one could get the idea that a certain national turkey organization is responsible for what we have. That ain't the way it happened.

The decline of quail is a good example of the need for landowner management to produce wildlife. Its extremely expensive to manage land for quail and it takes a lot of land to do it. As I'm sure you know, they are much different from turkeys. They can't survive in isolation. I don't know what the minimum amount of land needed to produce quail might be, but I can say 400 acres is not enough. I got my place up to having 2 coveys, but they faded away and now I don't think I have a bird.

But the same efforts to produce quail did indeed work for turkeys. They nest in the cover I provided, and then spread out to the paper company land around me. Everyone in the area benefits, and I'm happy that my neighbors have turkeys to hunt too.

Will the thousands of landowners like me that are passionate enough about turkeys to manage their land for them continue to do it now? Those are the places where turkeys are produced. Has anyone at the dcnr even thought about this? I haven't heard it mentioned.

Change the law if you must but that's when I'll become an outlaw. Shortening the season will only take money out of my pocket and some of my families.

I'm just an outsider looking in but will toss my 2 cents in. I think overall the turkey and deer hunting was the best in the 80s and 90s and has went downhill ever since in about every state. The yote population hadn't blown up yet in a lot of states and you had more people trapping. As in any population, protect the females, supply good habitat and keep predators in check and the population has to succeed granted things such as disease and weather doesn't go wrong. It's really that simple. You can raise the limit to 10 birds and the all hens that are able to breed will get bred. Only down side to that is you could end up hearing less and less gobblers each year if the hens are not producing. Then again I bet less than 5% of hunters kill 4 or 5 so it's most likely a moot point and of the ones that do they are already in a turkey rich environment or jumping around to different areas and in either scenario it's not really having that much of an effect.

I can't even fathom how any state that doesn't have a tagging system in place can have any good data. It's a guessing game without one.

You were good down till the last two sentences.

I talked to a guy yesterday that said he knows a guy on the CAB. He said the guy claimed they where finding a lot of turkey nest with un-fertilized eggs is why making the season later. I have my doubt's on that but says that's their claim.

I talked to a guy yesterday that said he knows a guy on the CAB. He said the guy claimed they where finding a lot of turkey nest with un-fertilized eggs is why making the season later. I have my doubt's on that but says that's their claim.