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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997 |
... Quality deer management (QDM) is a growing practice in the Southeast and promotes densities in balance with habitat conditions and healthy buck:doe ratios (Miller and Marchinton 1995). In most cases, the management prescription that is applied to achieve these objectives is increased antlerless
harvest. Populations maintained at a low equilibrium by coyotes through single state regulation may decline even further with increased antlerless harvest because this harvest will most likely be additive (Nelson and Mech 1981, Messier and Crte 1985). However, if coyotes are regulating deer populations through multi-stable equilibria as we believe, then antlerless harvest programs that do not account for deer density could theoretically result in deer populations that are driven to a density from which they are unable to recover without help. (emphasis added) Read the whole study report here: Survival Estimates of White-tailed Deer Fawns at Fort Rucker, Alabama by Angela Marie Jackson
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,979
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,979 |
The Fort Rucker study did show that the yote situation can present a real problem. So I'm guessing that while be instituted in the future.
Deer were killed off from unregulated hunting and during the Great Depression, kill them year around you will have a problem.
Deer reproduce rather quickly, the Northern and Midwestern strains that were introduced never did well, Ron Eakes did a long study on the situation at Bankhead. He never reached a definite conclusion but a well thought out opinion with several things being a factor at least the last time I talked with him.
Gonna miss seeing him now that he has retired.
“Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it.” ― Ronald Reagan
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 12,788
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 12,788 |
Ruh..Roh....Raggy..... Maybe, just maybe....... Naahhhhh; nevermind. It WILL take Regulations to slow the doe harvest. Maybe, after a while, it can be relaxed. But, people have continually proven their lack of self-control for centuries!!! 
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 4,713
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 4,713 |
49er, I don't understand. What's your point? Again, within any discipline of study, varying factors are always present and are, for the most part, known about. Do you think the QDMA is oblivious to coyote predation? The QDMA suggests tools within data collection and observation that help uncover such variables as coyote predation.
If a piece of property doesn't need doe removal, QDM/QDMA would dictate that you don't remove any does.
I hope you're not insisting on painting the QDMA and QDM into a corner that INCORRECTLY labels QDM as a "doe killing" philosophy?
Last edited by Bucktrot; 02/12/12 11:17 PM.
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997 |
Bucktrot, The people with QDMA were generally advocating heavy doe killing when I was there. If they are now advocating restraint in killing does, that is a new approach for them. The Ft. Rucker study may have changed some minds. Statements like these were not uncommon: CAB Meeting, May, 2007 page 60 22 MR. DITCHKOFF: If you want to
23 properly manage deer on a piece of
1 property, what you need to do is take
2 a look at the condition of those deer
3 and you need to take a look at
4 actually what the condition of the
5 habitat is, whether or not it is being
6 overrun.
7 I honestly don't think you can
8 kill too many does on a piece of
9 property. Similar statements were being made in the QDMA meetings that I attended.
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,539
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,539 |
why don't you pick up a couple of issues and actually read what QDMA is now saying in stead of telling us what you think they are saying? I know it wouldn't change your mind about QDMA but at least it would give you something else/ some other organization to go after.
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,979
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 21,979 |
why don't you pick up a couple of issues and actually read what QDMA is now saying in stead of telling us what you think they are saying? I know it wouldn't change your mind about QDMA but at least it would give you something else/ some other organization to go after.
they were saying assess the situation way back when I was a hardcore member and I was a member almost when they just started The only reason I'm commenting on this thread, I really don't want some thinking they have a problem when they don't, this past year, bountiful acorn crop with warm weather is usually a season with low deer sightings. Deer hunting 101
“Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it.” ― Ronald Reagan
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 4,713
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 4,713 |
49er, what the QDMA was saying way "back then" was applicable. The State of Alabama went through an era where it was thought that you could not have too many deer! Through education and research, we now know differently! There was a time that we needed to whack some does! Lots of'em!
You didn't see that many yotes either (back then).
Adapt!!!!! Adaptation is ALWAYS in play. Things change. Manage the deer herd based on observation and harvest data along with habitat variations. Based on these things, shoot does if you need to or don't shoot'em! But make an "educated decision" and not some off the cuff decision.
Damn, I don't see how you can argue with that!
Last edited by Bucktrot; 02/15/12 12:13 AM.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 45
spike
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spike
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 45 |
49er, what the QDMA was saying way "back then" was applicable. The State of Alabama went through an era where it was thought that you could not have too many deer! Through education and research, we now know differently! There was a time that we needed to whack some does! Lots of'em!
You didn't see that many yotes either (back then).
Adapt!!!!! Adaptation is ALWAYS in play. Things change. Manage the deer herd based on observation and harvest data along with habitat variations. Based on these things, shoot does if you need to or don't shoot'em! But make an "educated decision" and not some off the cuff decision.
Damn, I don't see how you can argue with that! Thank You Bucktrot!! I'm so sick of people complaining about this. Look I hunt in Kentucky and Missouri as well as Alabama. Kentucky's rifle season is just a few weekends a year. If the weather isn't right or any of the other factors that influence rutting activity, then your SOL, but you don't hear them complaining nearly as much as Alabama hunters who have one of the longest and most liberal deer seasons in the country!! If you cant kill a buck during the 3 1/2 month deer season then your probably not going to kill him if the season is extended a couple of more weeks anyway!
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997 |
tiger87, Thank You Bucktrot!!
I'm so sick of people complaining about this. Look I hunt in Kentucky and Missouri as well as Alabama. Kentucky's rifle season is just a few weekends a year. If the weather isn't right or any of the other factors that influence rutting activity, then your SOL, but you don't hear them complaining nearly as much as Alabama hunters who have one of the longest and most liberal deer seasons in the country!! If you cant kill a buck during the 3 1/2 month deer season then your probably not going to kill him if the season is extended a couple of more weeks anyway! I see you still need to go to several other states to do it in addition to hunting during our liberal season.  Alabama hunters ... have one of the longest and most liberal deer seasons in the country!! I intend to help them keep it too. Qdm whiners need to get a life and learn to hunt and be happy.
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,363
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,363 |
Only commenting on the OP.
There *is* such a thing as "cull bucks" imo:
1. an obviously diseased or seriously injured buck.
2. an older than the hills buck already in decline.
3. a SOOS buck.
4. any racked buck that you see trying to hump another
racked buck.:)-
"The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson
" Chuck Sykes is a dictator control freak like Vladimir Putin " WmHunter
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,675
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,675 |
#5 ^^^ a 3.5 or older with 7 or less mainframe points.
I know, I know.
"Why do you ask"?
Always vote the slowest path to socialism.
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