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Iso
by AustinC. 05/21/24 05:01 PM
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Surefire1911]
#1205152
12/30/14 11:26 AM
12/30/14 11:26 AM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 533
Pickens county, AL
Ray_Coon
4 point
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4 point
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 533
Pickens county, AL
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I would like the season to go back to 2 does a day. Where I hunt, I like to kill 3- 4 does per year. What does it matter if I kill 2 in two days or spread 4 out over four days? Since, the buck limit was enacted in 2007 ( I believe), I have killed four bucks. One in 2011, 2 in 2012, and one in 2014. All of only one of these bucks was 3.5, the rest were 4.5+. That said, I simply do not like the state telling me how I need to manage my herd.
Deer management is not a one size fits concept. If you hunt private land, and kill a whole lot of deer for several years, it is going to be harder to see them in the following years. You cannot blame the fact that you are not seeing/ killing deer on the state. The key word is accountability. A hunter's actions, good or bad, have consequence.
As for state/ federal owned/ managed land, they can be manger the way they see fit. It is their land. If I have a piece of dirt, I should be able to manage as I see fit.
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Surefire1911]
#1205164
12/30/14 11:32 AM
12/30/14 11:32 AM
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,005
Round ‘bout there
Clem
Mildly Quirky
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Mildly Quirky
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,005
Round ‘bout there
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Mirage, from a biological sense would it matter if it were extended statewide through the middle of February (or even the end, like Arkansas)?
"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter
"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013
"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Clem]
#1205191
12/30/14 11:56 AM
12/30/14 11:56 AM
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,180
Coffee Co, AL
jlccoffee
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,180
Coffee Co, AL
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And I even supported the 3-buck limit. In hindsight, I wish I'd known better.
I'd rather be able to make my own decisions about what I need or want without having someone who thinks "three bucks are enough for anyone" impose more regulations. Or even "one buck is enough for you" ... who are they are they to tell me what I need/want for my property?
I've yet to see a single biologically-proven benefit whatsoever to the population with a 1/2/3-buck limit in any state other than (a) more hunters spending money, (b) more giant bucks, which leads to the first thing. If there is a legitimate biological benefit to the wild free-range population by having more 4- and older-year-old bucks, let's see it. I'd love to see it.
Just let me hunt legally and within what I believe is needed for my property, and leave me the hell alone.
I'm with Clem except I wasn't for it to start with. Im also with Wmhunter that the doe killing was overdone in some areas. Teaching people to be better managers is the key....not one size fits all regulations.
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: WmHunter]
#1205246
12/30/14 12:36 PM
12/30/14 12:36 PM
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Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 8,423
Atoler
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 8,423
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[quote=Atoler]2 bucks and 3ish does would be reasonable to me. Let's be honest: YOU can already do that IF **you** want to! Leave everyone else alone. [/quote Mine was more of a "not a chance in hell, but what I would love to see happen for my personal benefit" type scenario. It also directly relates to the fact that I don't have large acreage do that with. I hunt mainly public land, with a few very small pieces thrown in. There is no such thing as managing a 50 or 100 acre tract. You can add food and that's it. No one in their right mind can tell me that a doe a day, or 2 a day makes any kind of sense from a biological or need based scenario. You want to make it 2 a day? fine, have special doe days. Or hell make it unlimited does a day, but only a certain amount a year. I'm simply advocating a greater deer density, as well as bigger bucks. Bigger bucks may not be everyones wish. Fine, if that's not your wish, then shoot a doe. or small buck, but There is no reason you need 20
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Atoler]
#1205250
12/30/14 12:45 PM
12/30/14 12:45 PM
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,005
Round ‘bout there
Clem
Mildly Quirky
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Mildly Quirky
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,005
Round ‘bout there
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but There is no reason you need 20 Says who? You? How and why? If I have 3,000 or 5,000 acres and believe I need to kill 20 bucks, and I don't want to bring in five other hunters to fill their 'tags,' then I damn sure shouldn't be told by anyone what I "need" to be doing on my land. I currently hunt on some land on which my cameras have taken photos of bucks with truly messed-up antlers. I have photos of multiple bucks with screwed-up antlers. It's not just one or two. I've talked with hunters in the area who have seen similar bucks. I'd like to shoot every damned one of them but because of our "tag" and requirements, I cannot. Legally, of course. And I realize that buck genes are only half the equation so that means some does probably need to be whacked. Yet with some folks saying "Oh, you don't need to shoot more than X-number of deer a season!" and getting that BS pushed through that affects private landowners, it can and does have an effect on people who might genuinely need to do something. Which means you can hunt legally and keep having problems or violate the laws/regs to get done what you need to get done.
"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter
"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013
"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Atoler]
#1205275
12/30/14 01:23 PM
12/30/14 01:23 PM
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,180
Coffee Co, AL
jlccoffee
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,180
Coffee Co, AL
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[quote=Atoler]2 bucks and 3ish does would be reasonable to me. Let's be honest: YOU can already do that IF **you** want to! Leave everyone else alone. [/quote Mine was more of a "not a chance in hell, but what I would love to see happen for my personal benefit" type scenario. It also directly relates to the fact that I don't have large acreage do that with. I hunt mainly public land, with a few very small pieces thrown in. There is no such thing as managing a 50 or 100 acre tract. You can add food and that's it. No one in their right mind can tell me that a doe a day, or 2 a day makes any kind of sense from a biological or need based scenario. You want to make it 2 a day? fine, have special doe days. Or hell make it unlimited does a day, but only a certain amount a year. I'm simply advocating a greater deer density, as well as bigger bucks. Bigger bucks may not be everyones wish. Fine, if that's not your wish, then shoot a doe. or small buck, but There is no reason you need 20 2 bucks and 3 does a year isn't reasonable for 50 acres either...especially if more than one person might hunt there.
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Clem]
#1205294
12/30/14 01:31 PM
12/30/14 01:31 PM
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Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 8,423
Atoler
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 8,423
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but There is no reason you need 20 Says who? You? How and why? If I have 3,000 or 5,000 acres and believe I need to kill 20 bucks, and I don't want to bring in five other hunters to fill their 'tags,' then I damn sure shouldn't be told by anyone what I "need" to be doing on my land. I currently hunt on some land on which my cameras have taken photos of bucks with truly messed-up antlers. I have photos of multiple bucks with screwed-up antlers. It's not just one or two. I've talked with hunters in the area who have seen similar bucks. I'd like to shoot every damned one of them but because of our "tag" and requirements, I cannot. Legally, of course. And I realize that buck genes are only half the equation so that means some does probably need to be whacked. Yet with some folks saying "Oh, you don't need to shoot more than X-number of deer a season!" and getting that BS pushed through that affects private landowners, it can and does have an effect on people who might genuinely need to do something. Which means you can hunt legally and keep having problems or violate the laws/regs to get done what you need to get done. So what you're saying is the 1 in a million hunter who controls 3k-5k acres by himself and let's no one else hunt it, is more important than all the thousands of public land hunters and small acreage hunters?. Another point I'll bring up, you will not change the gene pool by shooting "culls". As you admitted, does carry the genes as well. So the only way to change it is to wipe out all the deer and start from scratch. If you really want 20 deer removed from your land, why not get some younger hunters in there and let them do it?
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: jlccoffee]
#1205298
12/30/14 01:34 PM
12/30/14 01:34 PM
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Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 8,423
Atoler
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 8,423
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[quote=Atoler]2 bucks and 3ish does would be reasonable to me. Let's be honest: YOU can already do that IF **you** want to! Leave everyone else alone. [/quote Mine was more of a "not a chance in hell, but what I would love to see happen for my personal benefit" type scenario. It also directly relates to the fact that I don't have large acreage do that with. I hunt mainly public land, with a few very small pieces thrown in. There is no such thing as managing a 50 or 100 acre tract. You can add food and that's it. No one in their right mind can tell me that a doe a day, or 2 a day makes any kind of sense from a biological or need based scenario. You want to make it 2 a day? fine, have special doe days. Or hell make it unlimited does a day, but only a certain amount a year. I'm simply advocating a greater deer density, as well as bigger bucks. Bigger bucks may not be everyones wish. Fine, if that's not your wish, then shoot a doe. or small buck, but There is no reason you need 20 2 bucks and 3 does a year isn't reasonable for 50 acres either...especially if more than one person might hunt there. Is it not? Well in that case, I guess it's not reasonable on most clubs either, since 50-100 acres a member is a pretty common ratio
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Atoler]
#1205309
12/30/14 01:40 PM
12/30/14 01:40 PM
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,180
Coffee Co, AL
jlccoffee
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,180
Coffee Co, AL
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[quote=Atoler]2 bucks and 3ish does would be reasonable to me. Let's be honest: YOU can already do that IF **you** want to! Leave everyone else alone. [/quote Mine was more of a "not a chance in hell, but what I would love to see happen for my personal benefit" type scenario. It also directly relates to the fact that I don't have large acreage do that with. I hunt mainly public land, with a few very small pieces thrown in. There is no such thing as managing a 50 or 100 acre tract. You can add food and that's it. No one in their right mind can tell me that a doe a day, or 2 a day makes any kind of sense from a biological or need based scenario. You want to make it 2 a day? fine, have special doe days. Or hell make it unlimited does a day, but only a certain amount a year. I'm simply advocating a greater deer density, as well as bigger bucks. Bigger bucks may not be everyones wish. Fine, if that's not your wish, then shoot a doe. or small buck, but There is no reason you need 20 2 bucks and 3 does a year isn't reasonable for 50 acres either...especially if more than one person might hunt there. Is it not? Well in that case, I guess it's not reasonable on most clubs either, since 50-100 acres a member is a pretty common ratio Not mine....how do you know what the limit should be for me? You don't know anything about what land I hunt, how many acres it is, how many people hunt it, the carrying capacity or anything else....so why would you make up 2 bucks and 3 does and think that's good for my situation? Education is the key, because every situation is different. You can't make up any number that is going to be right for all situations.
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: jlccoffee]
#1205313
12/30/14 01:42 PM
12/30/14 01:42 PM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 14,831
If you only knew.....
Tru-Talker
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 14,831
If you only knew.....
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[quote=Atoler]2 bucks and 3ish does would be reasonable to me. Let's be honest: YOU can already do that IF **you** want to! Leave everyone else alone. [/quote Mine was more of a "not a chance in hell, but what I would love to see happen for my personal benefit" type scenario. It also directly relates to the fact that I don't have large acreage do that with. I hunt mainly public land, with a few very small pieces thrown in. There is no such thing as managing a 50 or 100 acre tract. You can add food and that's it. No one in their right mind can tell me that a doe a day, or 2 a day makes any kind of sense from a biological or need based scenario. You want to make it 2 a day? fine, have special doe days. Or hell make it unlimited does a day, but only a certain amount a year. I'm simply advocating a greater deer density, as well as bigger bucks. Bigger bucks may not be everyones wish. Fine, if that's not your wish, then shoot a doe. or small buck, but There is no reason you need 20 2 bucks and 3 does a year isn't reasonable for 50 acres either...especially if more than one person might hunt there. Is it not? Well in that case, I guess it's not reasonable on most clubs either, since 50-100 acres a member is a pretty common ratio You can't make up any number that is going to be right for all situations. So your the saying the State is wrong.... They seem to be convinced they're right.... 
Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves...
Confucius
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Atoler]
#1205333
12/30/14 01:59 PM
12/30/14 01:59 PM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,210
Auburn
Ike McCaslin
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,210
Auburn
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Alabama is behind almost every state as far as quality of deer, and almost every other state has stricter harvest guidelines. The two go hand in hand. 3 of the 4 states that border us have better deer. Now I realize not everyone is interested in big bucks, but I think there should be a number that's a reasonable compromise between the 2 Mississippi produces more big bucks per capita because of the soil quality and agriculture in the delta...that's it. Georgia has good areas and bad areas...just like us. It is bigger though, so it inevitably produces more big deer...that's about the extent of it. Tennessee I'm not as knowledgeable of, but know there is a ton of agricultural land on the west end...probably more of a concentration than we have anywhere in Alabama.
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Atoler]
#1205367
12/30/14 02:20 PM
12/30/14 02:20 PM
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,005
Round ‘bout there
Clem
Mildly Quirky
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Mildly Quirky
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,005
Round ‘bout there
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Define quality. Big bucks? Giant antlers? Or by quality do you mean a biologically sound, managed approach that landowers can make on their own property without the government -- and a segment of trophy deer hunters wanting big racked bucks -- telling them what they "need" to do? Make those limits and regulations on public land the state owns or controls. But leave the private landowner to decide for himself. And as to your other question, yeah ... if I have 5,000 or 3,000 or 848 acres and believe I need to kill more than three bucks then I may not want anyone else on my property, at all. I might invite the Wee Tots Youth Home FutureHunters to come help me. But I should be able to do what I think is best for my property and if that means killing 3 or 10 or 20 bucks by myself then I don't need a state agency telling me I cannot on MY land. Or I'll just do it and be quiet.
Last edited by Clem; 12/30/14 02:22 PM.
"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter
"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013
"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Surefire1911]
#1205398
12/30/14 02:41 PM
12/30/14 02:41 PM
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Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,265
Mobile al
Surefire1911
OP
8 point
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OP
8 point
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,265
Mobile al
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Glad to see all the different opinions on this thread. I'm with a lot of you on the whole " don't worry about me " mantra but this is just me thinking out loud when I say I think the midwest and all the other states that take big time deer is partly bc of the limitations they have in place . I fully understand they have better soil and miles of row crops but I have to think the mostly archery and limits you can kill have something to do for it. I also understand a lot of people dont care of big deer and just like to shoot for some reason. There isn't a one size fits all plan but I don't see an issue with having a 2 buck 2 doe limit. If you have that big of a problem with deer plant some corn and get a ag license to kill what ever you would like.
Wolves don't lose sleep over opinions from sheep
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: Surefire1911]
#1205416
12/30/14 02:52 PM
12/30/14 02:52 PM
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,005
Round ‘bout there
Clem
Mildly Quirky
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Mildly Quirky
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,005
Round ‘bout there
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So your solution is to spend more money to plant corn in order to get a depredation permit to kill game animals during summer, when they have to be left in the field to rot and can't be used?
That's one reason hunting seasons are in place, and regs that allow landowners to do what they need to do then. Not by spending more money later.
You're correct about the Midwest. Nutrition and age, which comes from the one- and two-buck limits, helps them have big bucks. Are their deer populations far healthier than those in the Southeast thanks to those minimal limits and older bucks in the population? Is that comparison even possible to be made?
"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter
"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013
"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
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Re: Spin off from 3 buck limit thread....
[Re: hunterbuck]
#1205419
12/30/14 02:56 PM
12/30/14 02:56 PM
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
bigt
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
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@ Surefire: I say QUIT F8CKING WITH IT. Manage your ground and I'll manage mine. Bingo. If you feel like your neighbors are having a negative impact on your deer herd, then you're not doing something right. That is not necessarily a true statement.....
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