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Key:
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 29,727 Likes: 165
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 29,727 Likes: 165 |
Pop quiz. How long is a day to God? 24 Godly hours.
Lord, please help us get our nation straightened out.
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Joined: Nov 2010
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Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 25,784 Likes: 66 |
I probably shouldn't say that I agree with you here...... Why is that so painful for folks??  Well... I think I've been labeled as an an outlier on here because I'm not a religious traditionalist. I don't want you to suffer from guilt by association.  I’ve always felt like I shouldn’t question anything about the bible, but you should. Doesn’t mean that you aren’t a believer, it just means that you’re trying to understand it better. Especially when my pastor explains it.
Proud Army and ALNG veteran
God Bless America!
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10 point
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10 point
Joined: Mar 2016
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Interesting opinions, I appreciate the respectful discussion.
Micah 6:8
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Posts: 5,949 Likes: 90
Skinny's Property
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Skinny's Property
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 5,949 Likes: 90 |
We ain't gonna whip a Neanderthal or Primate.
Believe me, got my ass beat by a monkey years ago. Please do tell. Got to be a good story.
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,169 Likes: 196
Doing the best I can.
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Doing the best I can.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,169 Likes: 196 |
Again, an honest series of questions for you CNC, Irish, and others as well. No disrespect intended at all.
If I'm reading things correctly, you don't believe in an "instant" creation because it doesn't line up with science. You also don't believe some of the stories in the Bible (Jonah) to be literal for the same reason. If I'm mistaken about my perception, please correct me.
Do you believe that your savior is Jesus Christ? Do you believe that he was literally the Son of God? Do you believe he was killed and literally rose from the dead?
If the answers to these questions are yes, how do you align those things with science because science does not dictate those things as being possible?
If the answer to those questions is no, then why do we even bother because it's all just a fairy tale?
If the answers are yes to those first questions, how do you personally differentiate between what things are true in the Bible that contradict science and what things are false in the Bible that contradict science?
Why is it that one thing can conflict with science yet another can't?
Again, not trying to be condescending, only trying to apply simple "If, Then" logic to the situation. If A = B and C = B, then C also has to = A. If A = B but C does not = B, then C can not possibly = A.
Last edited by Driveby; 07/02/26 09:02 AM.
The true mark of a man is not how he conducts himself during times of prosperity, but how he conducts himself during times of adversity.
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Posts: 12,681 Likes: 117
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 12,681 Likes: 117 |
I’m not sure about Neanderthal but I did have a guy that worked for me that was the spitting image of
Boris the animal from MIB
Last edited by deadeye48; 07/02/26 10:43 AM.
When I need expert advice I tend to talk to myself
The older I get the better I used to be
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Dances With Weeds
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Dances With Weeds
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 29,088 Likes: 85 |
Again, an honest series of questions for you CNC, Irish, and others as well. No disrespect intended at all.. When you read about another ancient culture telling stories about sky men riding in on a fiery dragon and such……Do you believe all of it literally happened??.....Why do you suddenly change your metric for what’s believable when the judgement is on your own belief??.....If you’re gonna go with the theory that anything is possible when it comes to God to explain humans poofing into existence then you should also believe that there could have actually been men riding on fiery dragons….. That being said…….I still look at a lot of things in the Bible with a grain of salt……Just like with anything else we have only been told the parts that folks wanted us to hear…..These disciples could have very well had that ethical logic that jawbone spoke of where you see something as ok to do if it serves a greater purpose……They could have all been on a life mission to save the souls of the world and felt like some details were ok to fudge if it accomplished the goal…..I’ll admit that I’m very skeptical of all of the “magic” and such……For example, I think Moses went up on a mountain and whittled on a rock for a while and came back down and told the crowd a little white lie for the sake of control and to get folks to act the way they needed to…..Its classic human behavior…… As far as Jesus specifically…….Its one of those things where I don’t know for sure……Like I said in a previous post…..I do recognize that if nothing else, for one individual to have the kind of impact his life had on the world is pretty miraculous in and of itself……and when it comes to a life to model my own after I have no problems in trying to follow the example that he set for us…..Those principles are the same ones that I naturally feel like are right in my heart or conscience …….Is he my Savior??.....I suppose I could logically concede to that because I’ll admit that going to church has definitely been good for my family and put me on a better path for life in general……and that church is there because of Jesus……Is he the son of God??.....This is where I want to believe such but I cant help but to also recognize that we are not the first and only humans in history to believe really strongly that someone was God or a god, etc……We’re really giving ourselves a lot of credit here to think that WE are the ones who have gotten it right and everyone else is wrong and burning in hell.
Last edited by CNC; 07/02/26 10:00 AM.
Folks that know don't shoot old does........ 
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Posts: 3,135 Likes: 15
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Dec 2018
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Again, an honest series of questions for you CNC, Irish, and others as well. No disrespect intended at all.. When you read about another ancient culture telling stories about sky men riding in on a fiery dragon and such……Do you believe all of it literally happened??.....Why do you suddenly change your metric for what’s believable when the judgement is on your own belief??.....If you’re gonna go with the theory that anything is possible when it comes to God to explain humans poofing into existence then you should also believe that there could have actually been men riding on fiery dragons….. That being said…….I still look at a lot of things in the Bible with a grain of salt……Just like with anything else we have only been told the parts that folks wanted us to hear…..These disciples could have very well had that ethical logic that jawbone spoke of where you see something as ok to do if it serves a greater purpose……They could have all been on a life mission to save the souls of the world and felt like some details were ok to fudge if it accomplished the goal…..I’ll admit that I’m very skeptical of all of the “magic” and such……For example, I think Moses went up on a mountain and whittled on a rock for a while and came back down and told the crowd a little white lie for the sake of control and to get folks to act the way they needed to…..Its classic human behavior…… As far as Jesus specifically…….Its one of those things where I don’t know for sure……Like I said in a previous post…..I do recognize that if nothing else, for one individual to have the kind of impact his life had on the world is pretty miraculous in and of itself……and when it comes to a life to model my own after I have no problems in trying to follow the example that he set for us…..Those principles are the same ones that I naturally feel like are right in my heart or conscience …….Is he my Savior??.....I suppose I could logically concede to that because I’ll admit that going to church has definitely been good for my family and put me on a better path for life in general……and that church is there because of Jesus……Is he the son of God??.....This is where I want to believe such but I cant help but to also recognize that we are not the first and only humans in history to believe really strongly that someone was God or a god, etc……We’re really giving ourselves a lot of credit here to think that WE are the ones who have gotten it right and everyone else is wrong and burning in hell. Wow, you danced all around those questions.
To GOD be All the glory!!!
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Dances With Weeds
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Dances With Weeds
Joined: Jun 2012
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Aint nobody “dancing” ……Everything isnt a debate to be won……I answered Driveby’s questions the best I could for how I perceive it…..
Folks that know don't shoot old does........
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8 point
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8 point
Joined: Oct 2005
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There’s a great exhibit of this — zero cost for a ticket — at the Smithsonian Natural History Museum (DC) with physical evidence included. I see an Aldeer meetup in our future.
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14 point
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14 point
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 8,198 Likes: 113 |
Aint nobody “dancing” ……Everything isnt a debate to be won……I answered Driveby’s questions the best I could for how I perceive it….. Let me simplify what you said…….you don’t believe Jesus is your Lord and Savior
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a.k.a. Dingle Johnson
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a.k.a. Dingle Johnson
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 28,349 Likes: 566 |
Again, an honest series of questions for you CNC, Irish, and others as well. No disrespect intended at all.
If I'm reading things correctly, you don't believe in an "instant" creation because it doesn't line up with science. You also don't believe some of the stories in the Bible (Jonah) to be literal for the same reason. If I'm mistaken about my perception, please correct me.
Do you believe that your savior is Jesus Christ? Do you believe that he was literally the Son of God? Do you believe he was killed and literally rose from the dead?
If the answers to these questions are yes, how do you align those things with science because science does not dictate those things as being possible?
If the answer to those questions is no, then why do we even bother because it's all just a fairy tale?
If the answers are yes to those first questions, how do you personally differentiate between what things are true in the Bible that contradict science and what things are false in the Bible that contradict science?
Why is it that one thing can conflict with science yet another can't?
Again, not trying to be condescending, only trying to apply simple "If, Then" logic to the situation. If A = B and C = B, then C also has to = A. If A = B but C does not = B, then C can not possibly = A. Well... Since I was mentioned. 1. Yes. Not only do I believe in The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit, more importantly I have FAITH in them. Now the way I envision them and how they interact and relate to our consciousness in this plane of existence that we call our world or our universe, certainly differs from those who may see things in a literal, physical sense. 2. i see science as human beings trying to figure out how God did it all. 3. Having faith means not having to differentiate. Faith is believing in things for which you have no proof. I have faith in God. I do not have faith in science. I have a fascination with science. Science is constantly being changed and updated based on the latest science. As I explained in another thread, God is a consciousness that has been in existence forever and will be forever. 4. See the answer to #2.
"When I say ever thing I mean ever thing." - Frankie
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Dances With Weeds
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Dances With Weeds
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 29,088 Likes: 85 |
Aint nobody “dancing” ……Everything isnt a debate to be won……I answered Driveby’s questions the best I could for how I perceive it….. Let me simplify what you said…….you don’t believe Jesus is your Lord and Savior You must be Baptist……bringing folks to the Lord one condemnation at a time.
Last edited by CNC; 07/02/26 11:55 AM.
Folks that know don't shoot old does........
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Old Mossy Horns
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Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Aug 2013
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Aint nobody “dancing” ……Everything isnt a debate to be won……I answered Driveby’s questions the best I could for how I perceive it….. Let me simplify what you said…….you don’t believe Jesus is your Lord and Savior You must be Baptist……bringing folks to the Lord one condemnation at a time. Unfortunately not untrue. And I'm a Baptist.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 8,198 Likes: 113
14 point
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14 point
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 8,198 Likes: 113 |
Aint nobody “dancing” ……Everything isnt a debate to be won……I answered Driveby’s questions the best I could for how I perceive it….. Let me simplify what you said…….you don’t believe Jesus is your Lord and Savior You must be Baptist……bringing folks to the Lord one condemnation at a time. You said yourself you aren’t sure that Jesus is the Son of God, therefore not the Messiah. Many people believe in Jesus. Non-Christians don’t believe he’s the Messiah
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Posts: 13,169 Likes: 196
Doing the best I can.
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Doing the best I can.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,169 Likes: 196 |
Again, an honest series of questions for you CNC, Irish, and others as well. No disrespect intended at all.. When you read about another ancient culture telling stories about sky men riding in on a fiery dragon and such……Do you believe all of it literally happened??.....Why do you suddenly change your metric for what’s believable when the judgement is on your own belief??.....If you’re gonna go with the theory that anything is possible when it comes to God to explain humans poofing into existence then you should also believe that there could have actually been men riding on fiery dragons….. That being said…….I still look at a lot of things in the Bible with a grain of salt……Just like with anything else we have only been told the parts that folks wanted us to hear…..These disciples could have very well had that ethical logic that jawbone spoke of where you see something as ok to do if it serves a greater purpose……They could have all been on a life mission to save the souls of the world and felt like some details were ok to fudge if it accomplished the goal…..I’ll admit that I’m very skeptical of all of the “magic” and such……For example, I think Moses went up on a mountain and whittled on a rock for a while and came back down and told the crowd a little white lie for the sake of control and to get folks to act the way they needed to…..Its classic human behavior…… As far as Jesus specifically…….Its one of those things where I don’t know for sure……Like I said in a previous post…..I do recognize that if nothing else, for one individual to have the kind of impact his life had on the world is pretty miraculous in and of itself……and when it comes to a life to model my own after I have no problems in trying to follow the example that he set for us…..Those principles are the same ones that I naturally feel like are right in my heart or conscience …….Is he my Savior??.....I suppose I could logically concede to that because I’ll admit that going to church has definitely been good for my family and put me on a better path for life in general……and that church is there because of Jesus……Is he the son of God??.....This is where I want to believe such but I cant help but to also recognize that we are not the first and only humans in history to believe really strongly that someone was God or a god, etc……We’re really giving ourselves a lot of credit here to think that WE are the ones who have gotten it right and everyone else is wrong and burning in hell. On the dragon riders, no, I don't believe the stories to be true. Why? Because those stories do not offer any evidence of being real. The Bible offers evidences that have indeed been confirmed by science itself. It's up to us to make efforts to study those evidences and come to a conclusion of what we believe. On the Bible issue, if we view the Bible as being a story book filled with lies, why should we believe any of it? Why should we model our lives out of lies? If we are, we are engaging in an exercise in futility. We may as well live our lives as we please and enjoy ourselves while we are here because it's all a lie. Why go to that trouble? As to giving ourselves credit for being right when others are wrong, when multiple things conflict in details, not every one of them can be right. Someone has to be wrong, It's just a fact. If the stories and myths are correct as well, why choose to follow Christianity rather than one of the other beliefs? Why are you looking into Christianity rather than Buddhism? There has to be a reason for your choice. Based on your responses, you are an agnostic. I'm not saying that to insult you or calling you a name, I'm just pointing out that you fit that description with your beliefs. You want to believe but there's a part of you that can't so you have your doubts about the Bible being entirely real. That's not to cast a bad light on you at all because everyone has to start somewhere. Not everyone was born into and raised in a "religious" environment. You seem to be trying though and you are looking, that's good. I hope you keep looking and sincerely hope you find your answers.
The true mark of a man is not how he conducts himself during times of prosperity, but how he conducts himself during times of adversity.
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TensawRiver |
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,169 Likes: 196
Doing the best I can.
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Doing the best I can.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,169 Likes: 196 |
Again, an honest series of questions for you CNC, Irish, and others as well. No disrespect intended at all.
If I'm reading things correctly, you don't believe in an "instant" creation because it doesn't line up with science. You also don't believe some of the stories in the Bible (Jonah) to be literal for the same reason. If I'm mistaken about my perception, please correct me.
Do you believe that your savior is Jesus Christ? Do you believe that he was literally the Son of God? Do you believe he was killed and literally rose from the dead?
If the answers to these questions are yes, how do you align those things with science because science does not dictate those things as being possible?
If the answer to those questions is no, then why do we even bother because it's all just a fairy tale?
If the answers are yes to those first questions, how do you personally differentiate between what things are true in the Bible that contradict science and what things are false in the Bible that contradict science?
Why is it that one thing can conflict with science yet another can't?
Again, not trying to be condescending, only trying to apply simple "If, Then" logic to the situation. If A = B and C = B, then C also has to = A. If A = B but C does not = B, then C can not possibly = A. Well... Since I was mentioned. 1. Yes. Not only do I believe in The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit, more importantly I have FAITH in them. Now the way I envision them and how they interact and relate to our consciousness in this plane of existence that we call our world or our universe, certainly differs from those who may see things in a literal, physical sense. 2. i see science as human beings trying to figure out how God did it all. 3. Having faith means not having to differentiate. Faith is believing in things for which you have no proof. I have faith in God. I do not have faith in science. I have a fascination with science. Science is constantly being changed and updated based on the latest science. As I explained in another thread, God is a consciousness that has been in existence forever and will be forever. 4. See the answer to #2. 2. I don't think man can figure out how God did it all because, well, He's God and his power is beyond our comprehension. 3. I differ on the faith issue. I base this on Hebrews 1:11, Now faith is the SUBSTANCE of things hoped for, the EVIDENCE of things not seen. Notice the substance and evidence there. I don't think God expects us to have "blind faith". I believe he will provide the evidence if we sincerely look for it. I mentioned this to CNC in a PM. Some people might say I don't have real faith because I look to the evidence that I feel God provides instead of blindly believing. 4. See the answer to #2.
The true mark of a man is not how he conducts himself during times of prosperity, but how he conducts himself during times of adversity.
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Posts: 10,974 Likes: 190
Fancy
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Fancy
Joined: Feb 2016
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Again, an honest series of questions for you CNC, Irish, and others as well. No disrespect intended at all.. When you read about another ancient culture telling stories about sky men riding in on a fiery dragon and such……Do you believe all of it literally happened??.....Why do you suddenly change your metric for what’s believable when the judgement is on your own belief??.....If you’re gonna go with the theory that anything is possible when it comes to God to explain humans poofing into existence then you should also believe that there could have actually been men riding on fiery dragons….. That being said…….I still look at a lot of things in the Bible with a grain of salt……Just like with anything else we have only been told the parts that folks wanted us to hear…..These disciples could have very well had that ethical logic that jawbone spoke of where you see something as ok to do if it serves a greater purpose……They could have all been on a life mission to save the souls of the world and felt like some details were ok to fudge if it accomplished the goal…..I’ll admit that I’m very skeptical of all of the “magic” and such……For example, I think Moses went up on a mountain and whittled on a rock for a while and came back down and told the crowd a little white lie for the sake of control and to get folks to act the way they needed to…..Its classic human behavior…… As far as Jesus specifically…….Its one of those things where I don’t know for sure……Like I said in a previous post…..I do recognize that if nothing else, for one individual to have the kind of impact his life had on the world is pretty miraculous in and of itself……and when it comes to a life to model my own after I have no problems in trying to follow the example that he set for us…..Those principles are the same ones that I naturally feel like are right in my heart or conscience …….Is he my Savior??.....I suppose I could logically concede to that because I’ll admit that going to church has definitely been good for my family and put me on a better path for life in general……and that church is there because of Jesus……Is he the son of God??.....This is where I want to believe such but I cant help but to also recognize that we are not the first and only humans in history to believe really strongly that someone was God or a god, etc……We’re really giving ourselves a lot of credit here to think that WE are the ones who have gotten it right and everyone else is wrong and burning in hell. CNC, logically speaking, Jesus fulfilled every single prophecy to the T written of in the Old Testament. He’s still got a few more to go (Second coming). It’s not about what WE think or believe. It’s about what HE said. No other deity did what Christ did, and there’s plenty of archaeological evidence to fully support He was and is who He said He was. Does it take faith to believe in the Trinity, a virgin birth, a parting sea, a whale spitting a guy up on dry land, healing sick people, raising your own self? Yes absolutely. But does the evidence (even non-biblical) draw the conclusion that what is written in the Bible occurred and is still occurring? Absolutely it does. Keep digging friend.
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a.k.a. Dingle Johnson
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a.k.a. Dingle Johnson
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 28,349 Likes: 566 |
Again, an honest series of questions for you CNC, Irish, and others as well. No disrespect intended at all.
If I'm reading things correctly, you don't believe in an "instant" creation because it doesn't line up with science. You also don't believe some of the stories in the Bible (Jonah) to be literal for the same reason. If I'm mistaken about my perception, please correct me.
Do you believe that your savior is Jesus Christ? Do you believe that he was literally the Son of God? Do you believe he was killed and literally rose from the dead?
If the answers to these questions are yes, how do you align those things with science because science does not dictate those things as being possible?
If the answer to those questions is no, then why do we even bother because it's all just a fairy tale?
If the answers are yes to those first questions, how do you personally differentiate between what things are true in the Bible that contradict science and what things are false in the Bible that contradict science?
Why is it that one thing can conflict with science yet another can't?
Again, not trying to be condescending, only trying to apply simple "If, Then" logic to the situation. If A = B and C = B, then C also has to = A. If A = B but C does not = B, then C can not possibly = A. Well... Since I was mentioned. 1. Yes. Not only do I believe in The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit, more importantly I have FAITH in them. Now the way I envision them and how they interact and relate to our consciousness in this plane of existence that we call our world or our universe, certainly differs from those who may see things in a literal, physical sense. 2. i see science as human beings trying to figure out how God did it all. 3. Having faith means not having to differentiate. Faith is believing in things for which you have no proof. I have faith in God. I do not have faith in science. I have a fascination with science. Science is constantly being changed and updated based on the latest science. As I explained in another thread, God is a consciousness that has been in existence forever and will be forever. 4. See the answer to #2. 2. I don't think man can figure out how God did it all because, well, He's God and his power is beyond our comprehension. 3. I differ on the faith issue. I base this on Hebrews 1:11, Now faith is the SUBSTANCE of things hoped for, the EVIDENCE of things not seen. Notice the substance and evidence there. I don't think God expects us to have "blind faith". I believe he will provide the evidence if we sincerely look for it. I mentioned this to CNC in a PM. Some people might say I don't have real faith because I look to the evidence that I feel God provides instead of blindly believing. 4. See the answer to #2. We aren't disagreeing on #2. I stated that "science is human beings TRYING to figure out how God did it all. I don't believe humans will ever figure it out either, but that's not going to stop science from progressing. We aren't disagreeing on #3. You and I apparently agree, we're just stating it a different way. "Evidence of THINGS NOT SEEN..." things not seen literally means no evidence. My faith is certainly not blind or whatever religious double speak that means. My faith in God is not a word game where we play semantics. It's very real to me. It's not a religion for me it's a daily walk. Religion is why so much of the world is screwed up. I just Googled it and there are over 45,000 Christian denominations. last time I checked, there's only one God. Apparently is pretty common for humans disagree on religious semantics. I'm no religious scholar trying to catch someone in a dogma trap, I'm just a dude that believes and has faith in Jesus. I've personally never met 2 Christians that agree 100% on religion.
"When I say ever thing I mean ever thing." - Frankie
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Posts: 13,169 Likes: 196
Doing the best I can.
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Doing the best I can.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,169 Likes: 196 |
Again, an honest series of questions for you CNC, Irish, and others as well. No disrespect intended at all.
If I'm reading things correctly, you don't believe in an "instant" creation because it doesn't line up with science. You also don't believe some of the stories in the Bible (Jonah) to be literal for the same reason. If I'm mistaken about my perception, please correct me.
Do you believe that your savior is Jesus Christ? Do you believe that he was literally the Son of God? Do you believe he was killed and literally rose from the dead?
If the answers to these questions are yes, how do you align those things with science because science does not dictate those things as being possible?
If the answer to those questions is no, then why do we even bother because it's all just a fairy tale?
If the answers are yes to those first questions, how do you personally differentiate between what things are true in the Bible that contradict science and what things are false in the Bible that contradict science?
Why is it that one thing can conflict with science yet another can't?
Again, not trying to be condescending, only trying to apply simple "If, Then" logic to the situation. If A = B and C = B, then C also has to = A. If A = B but C does not = B, then C can not possibly = A. Well... Since I was mentioned. 1. Yes. Not only do I believe in The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit, more importantly I have FAITH in them. Now the way I envision them and how they interact and relate to our consciousness in this plane of existence that we call our world or our universe, certainly differs from those who may see things in a literal, physical sense. 2. i see science as human beings trying to figure out how God did it all. 3. Having faith means not having to differentiate. Faith is believing in things for which you have no proof. I have faith in God. I do not have faith in science. I have a fascination with science. Science is constantly being changed and updated based on the latest science. As I explained in another thread, God is a consciousness that has been in existence forever and will be forever. 4. See the answer to #2. 2. I don't think man can figure out how God did it all because, well, He's God and his power is beyond our comprehension. 3. I differ on the faith issue. I base this on Hebrews 1:11, Now faith is the SUBSTANCE of things hoped for, the EVIDENCE of things not seen. Notice the substance and evidence there. I don't think God expects us to have "blind faith". I believe he will provide the evidence if we sincerely look for it. I mentioned this to CNC in a PM. Some people might say I don't have real faith because I look to the evidence that I feel God provides instead of blindly believing. 4. See the answer to #2. We aren't disagreeing on #2. I stated that "science is human beings TRYING to figure out how God did it all. I don't believe humans will ever figure it out either, but that's not going to stop science from progressing. We aren't disagreeing on #3. You and I apparently agree, we're just stating it a different way. "Evidence of THINGS NOT SEEN..." things not seen literally means no evidence. My faith is certainly not blind or whatever religious double speak that means. My faith in God is not a word game where we play semantics. It's very real to me. It's not a religion for me it's a daily walk. Religion is why so much of the world is screwed up. I just Googled it and there are over 45,000 Christian denominations. last time I checked, there's only one God. Apparently is pretty common for humans disagree on religious semantics. I'm no religious scholar trying to catch someone in a dogma trap, I'm just a dude that believes and has faith in Jesus. I've personally never met 2 Christians that agree 100% on religion. 
The true mark of a man is not how he conducts himself during times of prosperity, but how he conducts himself during times of adversity.
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