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New SOAs?
by Beadlescomb - 08/25/26 10:50 PM
Cattle for deer habitat improvement
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First fawn!
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what deer see
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Leafy suit ground hunting
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Land, Leases, Hunting Clubs
Winston County club taking 2 members
by FreeStateHunter - 08/19/26 12:22 PM
NWA Hunt Club in Vernon/Sulligent area
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2 Spots Open Perry Co Club
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Interesting article on load development. Is ladder/node type testing actually repeatable in large group sizes? It gets deep and a little technical, but a good read no matter what you believe.


link to article

Last edited by WINMAG300; 04/28/26 03:30 PM.
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And a follow up article on why mean radius measurements may be a better way to measure group sizes. Also very interesting read.



link to article

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14 point
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ty sir!


"In time of war, send me all the Alabamians you can get, but in time of peace, for Lord's sake, send them to somebody else." General Edward H. Plummer

"Blessed are those who, in the face of death, think only about the front sight." Jeff Cooper
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Freak of Nature
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Interesting but very logical position I’ve kinda done that in the past but without measuring


“Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it.” ― Ronald Reagan
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Management Spike
Management Spike
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I've started shooting 20 shot groups (or plotting 20 rounds into one group) for a more real world expectation of rifle accuracy. There is always someone out there that talks constantly about their 1/2" rifle. For most of them that means they fired one group that small, by chance (and probably 20 years ago). It used to be that 1 MOA was the hunting rifle gold standard. I've got ONE rifle (Old Remington 700) that will do that for 20 shots. Most of them are 1.5-2+ for 20 shots. My Ruger SFAR put 20 rounds of my hunting handload into 1.9". All in all, I'm pretty happy with that.

My Dad left me a CZ457 American. A few weeks back it put 20 rounds of SK Long Range into .730" at 50 yards. That ain't chopped liver for a sporter weight 22 but it doesn't sound nearly as good as my 22 shoots 1/2" three shot groups. Under the new standard, .730" is awesome.

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Originally Posted by RidgeRanger
I've started shooting 20 shot groups (or plotting 20 rounds into one group) for a more real world expectation of rifle accuracy. There is always someone out there that talks constantly about their 1/2" rifle. For most of them that means they fired one group that small, by chance (and probably 20 years ago). It used to be that 1 MOA was the hunting rifle gold standard. I've got ONE rifle (Old Remington 700) that will do that for 20 shots. Most of them are 1.5-2+ for 20 shots. My Ruger SFAR put 20 rounds of my hunting handload into 1.9". All in all, I'm pretty happy with that.

My Dad left me a CZ457 American. A few weeks back it put 20 rounds of SK Long Range into .730" at 50 yards. That ain't chopped liver for a sporter weight 22 but it doesn't sound nearly as good as my 22 shoots 1/2" three shot groups. Under the new standard, .730" is awesome.

Buy a Tikka and you’ll have two guns that meet your accuracy expectations of 1MOA.


You're only as good as your worst shot-
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Management Spike
Management Spike
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Originally Posted by buckhunter2
Originally Posted by RidgeRanger
I've started shooting 20 shot groups (or plotting 20 rounds into one group) for a more real world expectation of rifle accuracy. There is always someone out there that talks constantly about their 1/2" rifle. For most of them that means they fired one group that small, by chance (and probably 20 years ago). It used to be that 1 MOA was the hunting rifle gold standard. I've got ONE rifle (Old Remington 700) that will do that for 20 shots. Most of them are 1.5-2+ for 20 shots. My Ruger SFAR put 20 rounds of my hunting handload into 1.9". All in all, I'm pretty happy with that.

My Dad left me a CZ457 American. A few weeks back it put 20 rounds of SK Long Range into .730" at 50 yards. That ain't chopped liver for a sporter weight 22 but it doesn't sound nearly as good as my 22 shoots 1/2" three shot groups. Under the new standard, .730" is awesome.

Buy a Tikka and you’ll have two guns that meet your accuracy expectations of 1MOA.

Dunno about that. My son's Tikka 300 Win Mag runs about 2" for 20 rounds.

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Freak of Nature
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What’s the consensus as far as off the lands. Is there a cheat code or is every rifle a “it depends” scenario.
Bullet and rifle configuration depending


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Originally Posted by cartervj
What’s the consensus as far as off the lands. Is there a cheat code or is every rifle a “it depends” scenario.
Bullet and rifle configuration depending

It’s not one size fits all, but for hybrid profile bullets between .040 and .080 off the lands is going to be the right range almost all the time, and it won’t change much over the life of the barrel. I start at .025 and move out by .005 until it shoots well, and then I usually don’t ever move the bullet depth for the life of the barrel. I’m lazy though, once I get a bullet shooting where I want it I quit fooling around and stick with it.

Hybrid profiles are becoming more and more prolific for the simple reason that they’re less sensitive to seating depth/jump. They get close to one size fits all. More so than VLD style bullets.

Once you get away from mainstream/SAAMI cartridges and standard reamers, all bets are off. What worked with a SAAMI spec reamer suddenly won’t work worth a flip in a chamber cut with extra generous freebore. But there’s demand for that because science is evolving for heavy, long for caliber bullets that just don’t fit well in SAAMI spec chambers, especially older cartridge design chamberings (308, 25-06, even 7mm-08).

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Freak of Nature
Freak of Nature
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Thanks cynical
I cut my teeth on two Weatherby rounds and rifles. I had a ruger No1 in 257 wthby that shot sub mos. Started life as a Robert’s and was teamed in full as a weatherby with 1 inch of freebore. 7mm stw in a weatherby accumark

Both rifles shot best at sammi specs oal
Magazine space and as nothing to deal with

Not until I bought several 300 Winchester short mags deal I start playing with the lands per se.


“Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it.” ― Ronald Reagan
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Freak of Nature
Freak of Nature
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I listened to this one the other day



“Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it.” ― Ronald Reagan

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