Aldeer.com Forums Alabama Deer Talk Serious Deer Talk Forum Charts and Graphs

Nothing

The farmer is gonna do what the farmer is gonna do.......Blasting the deer off of my land isnt gonna change that. If farmers in Jackson Co are shooting too many deer then the hunters need to slack off on some of the 2000-2300 does they’re shooting annually to help compensate…..Its just like if you had coyotes start killing too many fawns and effecting the population…one of the first things you would do would be to decrease any hunter doe harvest to help compensate…..Whether its farmers or coyotes its the same concept

What some folks are gonna want to try and say in this situation is that the hunters need to try and work with the farmers and it all be Koom-ba-ya……..But that’s not what is actually occurring…..The farmer is not wanting to make any kind of middle ground deal……He wants them ALL shot……. 2 per day…..What is the acceptable loss the farmer has for deer crop damage??......I’m guessing zero or very close to it…… He wants every penny he can get because profit margins are slim……The hunters might as well be making a deal with the coyotes where the yotes promise not to eat fawns if the hunter will just shoot all the deer……same concept…….

CNC as my pawpaw used to say you are looking at this bassackards

Apparently I have a knack for it………

I'm curious if the depredation permit harvests are included in game check. And if they are, what percentage of doe numbers are from those permits ?

They are not included

Reckon how many deer one farmer realistically shoots in a summer??

That's the million dollar question. If your hunting around big ag, you got to factor this in yourself if Kyles is right and it's not included in the game check numbers.

Yep.....though you wouldn’t necessarily have to know exactly how many deer they were shooting…..Its a lot like not knowing how many fawns coyotes are killing…...If you're a "neighbor" then what you’re assessing is the amount that’s left over and how that population relates to the carrying capacity……Is the farmer shooting enough to control your population for you too??......Its likely the answer is yes for everyone around them in many cases

This is the first thing you've ever posted on here that actually makes logical sense. Haha. Just kidding Harold. But you are most likely 100% accurate, in most all cases where they are permit shooting big AG. Had a farmer that had one that adjoined us on two sides, in south Bama years ago. The first year that he got that permit and they started shooting on it, we probably saw a 30-40% reduction in the numbers of deer seen, per sit, on our adjoining property. Farmer had two sons in HS and they and their friends would shoot it for fun every night that they got bored and were not out chasing girls. They shot everything. Does, fawns, velvet bucks, anything standing there with eyes shining. We ended up dropping our lease after 2 yrs of it. Well managed place, good property, good numbers and quality, ruined.

Now don’t get me wrong the farmer is the main driver of the cycle in our scenario but If I had to guess the guy that was impacting the situation just as much was your hunting neighbors on the other two sides of you ……I heard a land owner griping last about how their sightings were WAY down and so-and-so the neighbor was still trying to pile up the does to meet a quota…….That probably sums up the farming situation pretty well too…..When you zoom out on the map and look at ALL the properties around the farmer out to a couple miles……you likely still have guys on properties out there who are trying to blast them 2 per day because they “need” to and don’t recognize the bigger scope of things……

If you go back to my scenario with the two big plantations on either side of the farmland…..if those plantations completely quit shooting does on thousands of acres surrounding the farmland…….then as the farmer blasts away at them on his ground in the middle..... the “growth pressure” occurring on the plantations will just keep pushing toward him and he’ll either shoot into perpetuity at an endless supply that he cant keep up with or he’ll shoot until the plantation population thins out to the point of not having social conflict occurring anymore……

You can bet that any excess on the plantations are gonna keep moving toward that ag food and filling those holes....So how many does the farmer have to shoot to control the population for the whole neighborhood??....or maybe we should be asking.....How far out from the farmland does the farmer’s impact reach??.....Is he shooting the doe quota for a 3-4 mile radius around him??

CNC, one strategy that would be interesting for you to include (if the information is available by county) would be to add total depredation permits issued to game check numbers. In most cases, I’m betting farmers are shooting very 90% (or more) of their permits.

I’m sure we could make some graphs out of it…..We don’t have to have it though……From the standpoint of the hunters, summer depredation permit kills could just as well be lumped in with coyote kills… ……What we are watching through game check is what the legal hunters are doing with anything that’s left over……..And when it comes to farmers and coyotes killing deers……the coyotes will likely be easier to control than the farmers for most “neighbors”……Just sayin…..Farmers gone farm……..

Where would you even find the data on depredation permit harvests ?

Probably the same place they keep it for auto collisions......

Deep farm baby

Here’s one of the biggest fallacies that deep farm is trying to convince everyone of…….

Right now Jackson Co averages checking in around 2800 bucks per year on game check an around 1900 does……so hunters are killing substantially more bucks than does…….Now, when hunters start talking about the late born fawns, secondary rutting, poor ratios, yada yada……it’ll get said that the solution to their problem is that they just need to shoot more does……The fallacy in this though is that if we increase our doe harvest to 2800 to match the bucks that are being killed…..it likely wont be very long before the population density tanks and hunters don’t have 2800 bucks to be killed anymore…….

It's in with the Epstein files

You know a “tell” that some of you have that you’re full of chit that’s extremely easy to see……It's when a really valid point is made like the one above ^^^^ and folks either completely dismiss it or they change the subject and try to run right by it without it getting noticed…..Anyone who was truly an objective observer of a situation would acknowledge the point and take it into consideration….When folks take the approach of “moving right along” …..it makes it obvious that they likely have a set agenda they’re trying to push and that information is not good for it….