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81 members (skymech, Ron A., Beer Belly, BrandonClark, pkcole, slippinlipjr, Dixiepatriot, salock, murf205, bug54, hunter84, FreeStateHunter, CAL, stl32, grundan, zwick, rutwad, Irishguy, Solothurn, twaldrop4, centralala, BearBranch, top cat, Jtb51b, Tree Dweller, Bustinbeards, jawbone, doublefistful, SouthBamaSlayer, WEMOhunter, Antlerfluke, jdhunter2011, AU338MAG, 3bailey3, DHW, Maggie123, BPI, Coosa1, lectrode, CatfishJunkie, Chiller, IDOT, MTeague, CNC, Bigem1958, UARandy3, Jay512, Tall Dog, hoggin, 7mmMag, Okatuppa, sumpter_al, bamaeyedoc, thayerp81, chris18, spider21, seapro19, woodduck, trlrdrdave, robinhedd, WINMAG300, Hunting-231, Gunner211, UABCPA, TwoRs, canichols424, Shane99, BD, BAR II .270, DGAMBLER, BigA47, desertdog, akbejeepin, Livintohunt19, Cuz-Pat, jsubrett6, Fattyfireplug, 4 invisible),
821
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0
robots. |
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Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,254
12 point
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12 point
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,254 |
Your right i think it was David Nelson. I think claude might work for the afw association. I have the names mixed up, Claude is a good man too. As for what i ment about prperties We have some family land as does a couple of good friends. We sometimes get them to help us. Anyway im done with the pissing contest yall win i give up, my hands hurt! Good luck monday! You are losing credibility. Dave was a great guy and a good biologist, however NOT the head biologist for the state, that would have been and is Gary Moody. Claude Jenkins is a biologist for the AWF and in my discussion with him yesterday, he also stated his opposition for this project. Know any other bilogists that support this project??
I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 37,025
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 37,025 |
David was the head of the doe tag(DMAP) program for the state, and the biologist for (then) District 3. Gary has been the head of the Biology section of DCNR for a number of years.
I've spent most of the money I've made in my lifetime on hunting and fishing. The rest I just wasted.....
proud Cracker-Americaan
muslims are like coyotes, only good one is a dead one
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228
4 point
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4 point
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228 |
Never said they supported the idea! You said you knew most biologist and i simply asked if you knew them. I had my names mixed up, i ment Claude Jenkins not Claude Nelson. Is Claude not the leading biologist on deer for AWF? It might not be a tilte but from what i gather thats the case. That's who i was talking about. Again i simply ask if you knew them. Your trying to put words in my mouth. I simply had their last names backwards. Im sorry if i asked you a civil ?. I can also say my first impression of you is you are not in the same category as these 2. You come across as someone who just likes to bitc# and act as if you are important. Thsi whole thing started by me saying to the guys that are simply not informed in whats going on in marengo to shutup, and stop trashing people. You said yourself that EHD is not and issue, you also said CWD si what your worried about. Well as you know all of these deer are reqirred by law to be tested for CWD. Is this a good idea NO, ive said that. I wouldnt give $1 to help it. I thinks is stupid, im just saying that when people have another opinion than yours, and trys to help others you should be thankful. Now if you dont believe in what they are doing and thinks that its not worth the risk then act like an adult and contact them. The fact you come home and log onto a forum and act like a super star and trash others tells a lot about you. These guys have said to us that these deer will be tested before they are released. The State of Alabama has said though they are not for it, it is legal. If a couple of land owners want these deer to be placed on their lands than thats fine with me. I think its a waste of time, but its their right. As it is your right to come on here and portray yourself a important.
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228
4 point
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4 point
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228 |
Well i dont know these guys offical titles, i just was asking if the guy knew them. I have a high opinion of both of these guys, I could care lesee if he was head of the DMAP or the turtle program.
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228
4 point
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4 point
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228 |
But thanks BhamFred i couldnt remember exacly!
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228
4 point
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4 point
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228 |
Hey Bham is Colter surveying still?
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 37,025
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 37,025 |
Hey Bham is Colter surveying still? wouldn't know now, I retired in 05, not much contact with em.
I've spent most of the money I've made in my lifetime on hunting and fishing. The rest I just wasted.....
proud Cracker-Americaan
muslims are like coyotes, only good one is a dead one
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 37,025
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 37,025 |
polywaug, not beating on ya...educating, but there is no live animal test currently available for CWD. Dept has a dead animal test for it, and tests a lot of enclosure deer from all over the state, and free range deer also.
If the deer come from a herd with no CWD for three years and no new intakes, then CWD concerns are nil. CWD has an incubation period of 18-24 months usually.
I have no idea what they are testing those deer to be released for...TB maybe?? Really nothing else to test for.
I've spent most of the money I've made in my lifetime on hunting and fishing. The rest I just wasted.....
proud Cracker-Americaan
muslims are like coyotes, only good one is a dead one
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,673
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 37,673 |
Never said they supported the idea! You said you knew most biologist and i simply asked if you knew them. I had my names mixed up, i ment Claude Jenkins not Claude Nelson. Is Claude not the leading biologist on deer for AWF? It might not be a tilte but from what i gather thats the case. That's who i was talking about. Again i simply ask if you knew them. Your trying to put words in my mouth. I simply had their last names backwards. Im sorry if i asked you a civil ?. I can also say my first impression of you is you are not in the same category as these 2. You come across as someone who just likes to bitc# and act as if you are important. Thsi whole thing started by me saying to the guys that are simply not informed in whats going on in marengo to shutup, and stop trashing people. You said yourself that EHD is not and issue, you also said CWD si what your worried about. Well as you know all of these deer are reqirred by law to be tested for CWD. Is this a good idea NO, ive said that. I wouldnt give $1 to help it. I thinks is stupid, im just saying that when people have another opinion than yours, and trys to help others you should be thankful. Now if you dont believe in what they are doing and thinks that its not worth the risk then act like an adult and contact them. The fact you come home and log onto a forum and act like a super star and trash others tells a lot about you. These guys have said to us that these deer will be tested before they are released. The State of Alabama has said though they are not for it, it is legal. If a couple of land owners want these deer to be placed on their lands than thats fine with me. I think its a waste of time, but its their right. As it is your right to come on here and portray yourself a important. Most of us are not important in the grand scheme of deer management in Alabama, nor do we try to portray that we are. There are however, many users on this site that are very knowledgeable about whitetails, several even have degrees that say such. So I think on this subject we are trying to portray sanity.
"Why do you ask"?
Always vote the slowest path to socialism.
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,228
8 point
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8 point
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,228 |
I never once saw EHD brought into this subject until the pro release side injected it into the debate. I think there are several things that could happen besides EHD/bluetongue. All the states up north do CWD testing on a regular basis and many many deer on farms have been found to have it. When that happens most states requires that all deer on that farm be exterminated. That is to prevent an accidental release or some PETA knucklehead opening the gate on purpose to release Bambi into the wild population to infect it. I will give you a tip on how to get bigger bucks. Spend all that money set aside for buying these pet deer and spend it on lime, fertilizer and seed and then don't kill any bucks till they are at least 3 1/2 years old. That will give you a much better result and actually be beneficial to the herd. I doubt any biologist will be against it either.
Lead, follow or get the HELL outa the way!
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228
4 point
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4 point
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228 |
Once again i agree this is not the way to get bigger deer! Listen i hunt in a area that we have big deer. I plant beans,peas,sunflower and clovers for the deer. We fead our deer with pellets and provide lots of minerals. I understand that a deer will not reach his potential until 5.5. I also believe that pressure is the #1 factor that people dont kill mature(5 1/2) deer. I think adding a couple of breader bucks to a herd is like i think gobbler said putting 1 bull in a pasture with 5,000 otherbulls! Its a bad idea, i just dont think that this is a big of a deal as some make it. It to me sure isnt a reason to start attacking other hunters. I might be wrong, i hope im not. All this was about was me getting sick of people getting on here and trashing others. When they dont have all the facts. I dont have all of them either, but what is was saying was all these guys on here that are so passionate about this issue why dont you contact Hal and Walter and talk with them? They will be civil unlike some of you and they will answer your questions about what all have they done.
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 49
spike
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spike
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 49 |
polywaug, not beating on ya...educating, but there is no live animal test currently available for CWD. Dept has a dead animal test for it, and tests a lot of enclosure deer from all over the state, and free range deer also.
If the deer come from a herd with no CWD for three years and no new intakes, then CWD concerns are nil. CWD has an incubation period of 18-24 months usually.
I have no idea what they are testing those deer to be released for...TB maybe?? Really nothing else to test for.
Fred I do have a question for you. As I understand it, Alabama has not had a case of CWD detected in it yet. CWD has an incubation period of 18-24 months and there is a test for it after the animal is dead. Alabama has had import of deer from other states outlawed for many years and the breeders have to send any deer that dies on their farm to the state for testing. That leads us to determine that none of the deer in licensed breeding facilities have been brought in from out of state and none of them have had a deer with cwd so far. Therefore their herds have been only Alabama born and raised for many years. Doesn't that mean that the deer breeding operations have less chance of getting cwd than the wild since a wild deer can walk across state lines?
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,130
Mildly Quirky
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Mildly Quirky
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,130 |
the breeders have to send any deer that dies on their farm to the state for testing. Does this include deer in a high-fence hunting operation? If Jimmy Triggerman kills a whopper at HighFence Heaven, does the owner have to send the deer or tissue or brain sample or anything to the state? Or is it only for the 'breeder' facilities? Just curious. And longbow76, if you think no one has imported any whitetails into the state since the 'ban' was put in by the DCNR, you're really naive. And I don't believe you are. You seem like an intelligent guy passionate about this and that's fine. But there's no way deer haven't been imported from others states and I'd bet money it still goes on today.
"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter
"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013
"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 49
spike
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spike
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 49 |
the breeders have to send any deer that dies on their farm to the state for testing. And longbow76, if you think no one has imported any whitetails into the state since the 'ban' was put in by the DCNR, you're really naive. And I don't believe you are. You seem like an intelligent guy passionate about this and that's fine. But there's no way deer haven't been imported from others states and I'd bet money it still goes on today. Then if CWD was brought in through that process, it would be brought in by outlaws that were doing something illegal. Not by the business owners who follow the law. Correct?
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,130
Mildly Quirky
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Mildly Quirky
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,130 |
You didn't answer my question about high-fence outfits having to submit tissue samples.
As for your posit, please don't try to believe that all breeder and high-fence operators are virginal saints and squeaky clean. You know there are rogues among them and have been for years.
Every business has good people and bad people, and even some of the good ones aren't always good.
"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter
"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013
"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 49
spike
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spike
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 49 |
You didn't answer my question about high-fence outfits having to submit tissue samples.
As for your posit, please don't try to believe that all breeder and high-fence operators are virginal saints and squeaky clean. You know there are rogues among them and have been for years.
Every business has good people and bad people, and even some of the good ones aren't always good. Clem, I don't keep up with high fences but I do know the only place they can legally get deer is from the state licensed breeders if they buy them legally. Yes there are outlaws in most any business I would think. Which brings us to the question I asked you. If CWD was brought in it would have to be brought in by an illegally transported deer, and punishable by law, Correct?
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,130
Mildly Quirky
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Mildly Quirky
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,130 |
Not necessarily. CWD already could be here. Already could have been brought in. Could be being spread unknowingly via this intra-state transfer of breeder deer but not manifested yet. No one knows.
To the high-fence question, maybe Mr. Ainsworth or someone else who knows will jump in because it's a legitimate question: If deer in a breeder facility that die must be sent (or tissue samples sent) to the state for testing, then is same standard required of deer killed in a high fence by Jimmy Triggerfinger paying for a select buck?
"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter
"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013
"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 49
spike
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spike
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 49 |
Not necessarily. CWD already could be here. Already could have been brought in. Could be being spread unknowingly via this intra-state transfer of breeder deer but not manifested yet. No one knows.
BhamFred says that CWD has an incubation period of 18-24 months. Bringing deer in from out of state has been banned for many years. None of the deer that died at the legal facilities has ever tested positive for CWD. Therefore, I don't see how they could be spreading it. If it is already here it is more likely it is in either an illegal facility or the wild herd and not in the legal breeder facilities. According to all the research I have been able to gather. You are preaching the same old song and dance scare tactic to promote your own agenda obviously. I am getting a kick out of this forum. Having called and researched and checked all this out, I am finding it both hilarious and disturbing at how many unfounded lies and attacks some people will direct at others they don't agree with. Reminds me a lot of Obama campaign.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 24,507
Freak of Nature
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Freak of Nature
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 24,507 |
Nothing anyone else says it's nearly as cowardice or dishonest as you coming on here acting like you aren't involved in the project. Passing yourself off as a casual observer while having a vested interest in the project says you know the project doesn't have the scientific backing to stand on it's own.
" I do view Jim Waltz as a really good Presidential candidate"
Bama_Earl
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228
4 point
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4 point
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 228 |
Bill do you know longbow76?
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