Aldeer.com Forums Alabama Deer Talk Serious Deer Talk Forum Doe numbers

We dealt with it to the point where folks were absurdly bragging about killing the millionaire clubs deer

They slaughtered 2.5 yr old bucks all around us. They benefited from our club.

Hey Rainbowstew I’m glad you posted that. This is actually a prime example of the way I look at it. Obviously you have some deer around your 11 acres. Let’s say you shoot two of those nice bucks and 2-3 does off of your 11 acres. What’s the carrying capacity of your 11 acres? Did those two bucks and 2-3 does need 11 acres to thrive? Or does it take 40-120 acres for them to thrive? Now let’s say you have a neighbor with the same 10-15 acres, he shoots two more of the bucks and 2-3 more does. That’s 4 bucks and 4-6 does off of 20-25 acres. We all know it takes a lot more than 20-25 acres to raise that many deer. All I’m saying is there’s a lot of small acreage folks killing way more deer than their property is raising. I’m not saying if I own 1000 acres I need more than 3 buck tags, but there’s no way someone with 11 acres needs the same 3. It’s not sustainable (in my opinion). Your scenario is happening all across Alabama, on much smaller acreage too. It just is, that’s not an opinion, that’s a fact.
I don’t know what exactly the answer is, but right now it’s a free for all. Feels like it anyway.

CNC I’m impressed. Even for you. 12 pages on a topic that has had page after page discussed and argued about prior to this thread. Well done sir.

So just because someone has more land they should be entitled to more deer than a small acreage land owner? Wish I had a 300 acres or 1000 acres. If i did I would be hunting it and killing deer by the state laws and not by public opinion standards and worrying about what neighbors were killing. I get my 11 acres is not going to hold or sustain these deer that come on my property. I don't kill every deer that steps foot on my property and I have yet to kill one this year. I plant a nice food plot for them and feed them all year, hunt by the regs, so if a deer shows up on my property I am going to kill it if I want to and not feel guilty because I only have 11 acres.

The lack of deer in some areas is mismanagement by the state, lack of game wardens and deer hunters that don't give a crap and kill any deer that walks. It's a free for all in this state. When you have 1 or 2 wardens per county there is no way you will get compliance with any regs that are designed to sustain deer numbers. Because if people want to kill over the limit they will because they know they are not going to get caught. I have hunted and fished in Alabama of and on since 1989 and I have never been checked by a game warden while hunting or fishing.

I would say pretty much everybody on here is against big govt but when it comes to deer hunting some of you are ok with the state telling a landowner how many deer they can kill on THEIR property? Rules will be followed by the honest hunters and the outlaws will do as they please. I know I have them for neighbors. Get rid of Corn, Cameras and 1 Doe a day and it may make a difference but I doubt it. Why? Limited enforcement of game laws.

Yeah, just got back on and saw that. What you stated was 100% my point Globe, and Rainbow could not have done a better job of making my point for me with his statement and pictures. I'm guessing someone in the area around him owns or controls and large block adjacent to him and he's pulling those deer off of them. Rest assured, all those deer are not living on his 11 acres. In most of AL, with the carrying capacity of most land, it takes 10-60 acres for 1 deer to survive on, depending on the quality of habitat. So the math is really not hard to do. Rainbow might not be shooting all those deer and maybe he's very selective on his harvest, maybe not. But there are tons of people in AL, with property situations just like his, that between them and their family, they will kill all those deer and especially all those young bucks, if given the chance. It's always been that way.

Land is so fragmented (property line wise, Atleast in NoAl, that most people are just pulling deer of other peoples property. large +100acre farm tracts are disappearing daily.

Some counties have to share a single warden with the neighboring counties or at least that's how it used to be. There is definitely not a warden for every county in the state, unless something has changed in the last 5 yrs. Everyone has to somehow get along. Here's a situation for you Rainbow. How would you like this: Dont know what your situation is but lets say your 11 acre property juts up into a rich landowner that owns 1500 or 3000 acres, under strict management, and has plenty of money. Then lets say that you are shooting quite a few deer each year on your 11 acres and he's hearing a shot pretty much every weekend on your property. How will you feel if he decides that you're detrimental to his management program and he's tired of you shooting all the young bucks he's trying to grow, and he decides to spend $5000 and put a high fence down all three sides of the property lines between him and your property and effectively makes yours completely worthless to hunt. At that point, I'd have to assume that you would be just as mad about him fencing those deer off of yours and making your property worthless from a hunting standpoint, as he is about you shooting all those deer that he's raising and are living on his property that are walking across the line to a bait pile and getting shot on your 11. Not advocating it in any way, but if it keeps up and keeps on, at some point, it'll end up hurting the little guy a whole lot worse than it does the big guy because at the end of the day, the big land owners really do control the resource, even if they dont own it. Just saying the small landowners need to start thinking about the big picture more than they do. And it's not like this is anything new that has just come about since baiting started. It's been happening for years and years. Only difference is that now the corn piles are much larger and no longer hidden, now that the little guy doesnt have to worry about the GW checking in on him and it's not like there were ever enough GWs around to enforce or do anything about it back when baiting was 100% illegal.

I will say this, Alabama does have a very "My Deer" type attitude, whereas other states have much more enforcement and make it clear that no one owns any deer or wildlife regardless of whom's property that animal is on. They treat game more strictly as public property/resource where here it's more a management-type attitude. I don't like big gubbamint telling anyone what to do, but lack of enforcement probably plays a roll in any over-harvesting that maybe occurring. I've personally been very surprised how few encounters I've had here in AL with Mr. Green Jeans. Seems like I couldn't get a line wet in Texas without running into them.
I got a ticket for a couple of 1/2 inch undersized speckled trout in Texas City by a couple of undercovers that had been watching me for hours with binoculars. They rolled up in a black 4x4 unmarked with do rags and plain clothes. I thought they were there to ask if I had extra bait to give up. $265 ticket and took my fish. Still not over it.

Now that’s bullchit.

Speaking of the GW, I have NEVER heard of a hunting situation where the GW just happened onto a property. It ALWAYS stems from a complaint, or a tip or an incident. With that being said you are right Abolt. They can’t enforce anything without being tipped off first.

[/quote}] Yeah, just got back on and saw that. What you stated was 100% my point Globe, and Rainbow could not have done a better job of making my point for me with his statement and pictures. I'm guessing someone in the area around him owns or controls and large block adjacent to him and he's pulling those deer off of them. Rest assured, all those deer are not living on his 11 acres.
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Yeah keep guessing but your wrong about adjacent land around me. Pulling deer of them? Pretty funny! Isn't that what all deer clubs and lease strive to do? Never said the deer lived on my property. How much property do you own abolt? Or you just hunting a club or lease and don't like neighbors killing deer?

I could care less if someone wanted to build a high fence next to me. Not every deer lives on the 1k you mentioned. They would lock out all other deer and leave them to me to kill and then I would not to have to listen to a whinny neighbor bitchin about me killing his deer.

Disagree. We started with a high density, and you can kill alot of doe's when your density is high. If the limit didn't matter, why did they lower it? It used to be 2 a day, now its one. And even if that reset the population, as you claim, the much lower doe density means you can't kill as many to maintain the population or increase it, it will just decrease.

That is what I am saying is happening. Between hunting, and coytote's, the doe's are taking a hit. The bucks aren't, because you can only kill 3 of them a year, legally. And then I do also agree that game check is only for the law abiding.

They cruise thru my lease every turkey season. Of course I sealed off the easy access point so that might slow them down a little.

Why would you not want them there?

""I have seen the enemy, and it is us"

Unless they open a night time season those look to be pretty safe.

I get what you're saying but you can't compare hen turkeys to doe deer , apples and oranges . Hens as a group lay a bunch of eggs , but getting those eggs to hatch , then to flying age is very difficult and the % is VERY low.

Every situation is different. The 175 I hunt on is not the same as hunting 175 in south Alabama. Should NOT be a state enforced limit based on how many acres you have.