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Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,130
Mildly Quirky
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Mildly Quirky
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 52,130 |
"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter
"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013
"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997 |
"If disease or management practices threaten the conservation, protection and increase of the species, then that's the state's business"
Dude, that IS health of the herd in a nutshell. Dude, that's not it at all. That's CONSERVATION in a nutshell. Many here think "herd health" depends on manipulation of age structure, sex ratios, habitat manipulation and any other ideas the QDMA puts in their heads.
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 14,263 Likes: 1
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 14,263 Likes: 1 |
Not sure why your are trying to split hairs with me. Health of the herd is the biggest part on Conservation.
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997 |
That's not true and I'm not "splitting hairs".
Conservation is the protection of the population for the perpetuation and preservation of the species.
Manipulation of the species in attempts to improve "herd health" is wildlife management.
Big difference. Not splitting hairs.
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,254
12 point
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12 point
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,254 |
Not sure why your are trying to split hairs with me. Health of the herd is the biggest part on Conservation. What's wrong with me - agreeing with 49r again - whew  Using "herd health" as a basis for "wildlife management" authority by the DCNR is the same as using the "general welfare" clause to justify earned income tax credits.
I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,885
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,885 |
First off let me point out to you that I said Might and underlined it because I did not know about Illinois and Iowa, other than the fact that they kill big bucks there like they do in Texas and KY. I have said on here many times that my experience with shooting over bait in KY, over the past 11 year 3 or more trips a year, has shown me that the big bucks do not come to the feeders during the day time(usually). In those 11 years we have killed many large bucks and I don't recall a single one being killed at a feeder.
That being said, if baiting is legalized if one does not wish to one does not have to use it. I doubt that baiting on private property will pull many bucks off the unbaited public property. Jack, why did you assume Ill. and Iowa allowed baiting? It's interesting that you lumped all the big buck states and baiting in together. Like I said man, I underlined might to cover that, sorry that you assumed, I assumed Ill and IOwa. BTW, I recently read a survey taken in 2008 and at that time there were 22 states that allowed baiting either all or part of the year. Notice that some of them are "big buck" states and I know their size has nothing to do with baiting.  Here they are: Baiting Allowed In Entire State: Arizona, Hawaii, Kansas, Nevada, New Hampshire, Mississippi, New Jersey, North Carolina, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon, South Carolina, Utah, Washington Baiting Only In Selected Areas: Connecticut, Florida, Kentucky, Maryland, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Texas, Wisconsin
"Its a damn weak minded person who can only think of one way to spell a work." Andrew Jackson
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 6,999
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 6,999 |
It does not matter what we want anyway. There are 4-6 guys that pretty well control the outcome of this bill. It just depends whether or not they get behind it or not.
Most of you know how I feel about the CAB but their decisions are rarely backed by science or good economy based research. This means it must be for personal, political or monetary gain.
The baiting bill is fine with me since many do it anyway... I prefer doing away with the a CAB that is not made up of wildlife/fisheries biologists and researchers/ educators.
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 14,263 Likes: 1
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 14,263 Likes: 1 |
That's not true and I'm not "splitting hairs".
Conservation is the protection of the population for the perpetuation and preservation of the species.
Manipulation of the species in attempts to improve "herd health" is wildlife management.
Big difference. Not splitting hairs. So a herds health (IE is it healthy) has nothing to do with it's perpetuation??? Who in the hell is talking about antler size in regards to health? I am not. You are the one making that leap.
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997 |
Show us where I did that.
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,907
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,907 |
I understand the desire of some to provide supplemental feed through hunting season without having to worry about the local GW's interpretation of whats legal and whats not.
I see a need to define area for those who do.
This bill, however, IMO will still have a need of interpreting whats legal and whats not and as a result, it may clarify area, but then bring about a whole new set of issues.
IMO it should either stay the way it is, illegal, or be made legal...without all the silly rules.
Super Predator
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 3,494
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 3,494 |
We have been gathering and getting support and have over 1,000 supporters of the bill now that own or lease land. My reason for the post was to let anyone that wanted to support the bill to have an opportunity to get involved and get on the list we have started. The level of support is from a wide range of people include (landowners, hunters who lease land, bowhunters, high fence owners, etc) The strange thing is even the opposition today has a lot of members in their associations or membership that are on the list. I think generally hunters are tired of a vague law. So how does one go about becoming one of the "over 1,000 supporters"? Is this an anonymous thing so you can vote multiple times? Is there a question that can be answered like "I own a hunting "preserve" and have a tremendous amount of deer inside an enclosure and would like to be able to help my herd due to over grazing and would also like to offer hunts for $8,500 so people shoot deer standing at feeding stations. Would you support my cause in getting the State to change the regulations so I can continue to make money while baiting and not get fined or my clients get tickets, yes or no?" If you are going to whip up a frenzy using numbers, please provide full disclosure of your background, sampling methods, questions asked, etc, etc, etc. Otherwise, the information can not be substantiated and therefore do not have ANY credibility and using them to change policy, regulations or laws is deceitful. I am willing to listen to any answers, but just don't provide anymore more smoke and mirrors. Thanks
"After all, it is not the killing that brings satisfaction; it is the contest of skill and cunning. The true hunter counts his achievement in proportion to the effort involved and the fairness of the sport." Dr. Saxton Pope
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,181
Booner
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Booner
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 14,181 |
Fun4All...you have a PM or two.
"You think I care? Roll Damn Tide"
Have you tried Google?
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,254
12 point
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12 point
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,254 |
If you think this is more than a "baiting bill" and defines "area", how bout the house version which is simply says feed must be "out of line of sight" and a permit costs $24
I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,629
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,629 |
Just another un-enforceable law.........Just like the so called tag system.
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