Aldeer.com Forums Alabama Deer Talk Quality Deer Management Throw n Mow Q&A

Turkeyneck we did the same on loading areas with cereal rye , wheat and diakons last year the first weekend of november. Not much if any thatch at all and they turned out well. I think the waiting later really helps on those poor area for the cooler temps, dew, and more rainfall.

I will add to this thread. I had one spot done 3/4 a acre or so about a yr ago with a forestry mulcher leaving about a 8" bed of mostly pine chips. About this same time last year I had some leftover cereal rye and diakons and just spread it on top of the chips. Didn't try to drag, cover or anything. It made a great stand of it just seeding on top of the chips with no added fertilizer or anything. This year ive got about 2 acres of forestry mulched area ive got seeded.

How many have had success with oats with the t&m method . I wasnt real impressed with how the oats looked after cultipacking our fields there were alot left on top of the ground . I dont know if they do real well since they are a rather long and light seed . Any input ?

That’s what I used on mine. Just cheap seed oats, and they have seem to worked great! I will know more later in season, and next time I make the walk to back side of property. But they seem to have came up good!

The larger the seed the more important its gonna be to get it covered over with a really good crop of thatch. Thatch thickness is sort of like planting depth....You can smother out really small seed like clover with heavy thatch. It actually does better with thin thatch....But things like peas and oats are gonna do better if they get covered over well. The easiest cereal grain to grow is cereal rye. Its tailor made for this method.

Yeah I don’t like oats with T/M I prefer wheat, rye and triticale

I'll try to take pics at some point this week, but considering my seed was on the ground 30 days before rain, but I've got a pretty good stand of cereal rye, wheat, crimson clover, and radish. My radish wont do any good because of the lack of rain so they got a late start. There was also some winter peas mixed in but they are getting hammered as soon as they get 2" high

I'll take some new pics when the sun comes back out but my "Throw N' Go" experiment has been a success. The field is coming in great. I think for no more effort than it is to do you could probably just go ahead and hook up a drag behind your tractor and drag at the same time you spread the seed and still have a very simple process. It might help to settle the seed a little better but so far I'm not really seeing any issues with how I did it just broadcasting into the hay. I think its actually giving the plants a little time to get established before the deer can browse them. I'm already seeing a good bit of browsing on the tips of the cereal grains as they pop through.

Harold, that's what I've been doing the last couple years. I spray wait about 3 weeks. The grass falls over on its own. Then I sew my seed into it. It stays fluffy, not matted down. The seed sprouts under it, but has to be several inches high to even be seen, so it protects the young sprouts to let the field get established. Eventually, the thatch will decay and lay completely down and start feeding the soil.

Little spot I did in a old beaver pond I drained. Just something to see what happened.
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Something that probably needs considering about mowing versus just dragging is the effect it has on the biomass. Mowing and processing the biomass down into smaller and smaller pieces is going to speed up the rate of decay and also cause more N to be tied up right after planting. Leaving the biomass whole will cause a slower rate of decay and have he N tie-up gradually spread out over a longer period of time. Its due to the fact that mowing is exposing a much larger amount of surface area of the biomass to the microbes. For someone who is just starting out and having issues with thin biomass....I'd think they would probably want to just drag and leave the biomass intact. If you have too much biomass then you may want to mow and hit it with some extra N.....Just my thinking on this.

The deer are apparently starting to lose their chit too.......cause there's chit everywhere now.

I listened to the "Hunting Land" podcast today, and they had Grant Woods on, talking about his no till system. He's into no-till drills, and not using herbicides, or fertilizer. He seemed to downplay the success of broadcasting seed, but I've had great results. I just don't think it's realistic for most folks to spend $10-20k on a drill, in addition to a tractor. You're talking about 1% of people that are both committed enough, and rich enough to do that.

I feel like it detracts from his argument, especially with the success I've had, and seen without a drill, and just broadcasting.

Who are his sponsors?? Isn't one of them the folks who make the drills he's using in the videos? Look there and you may find your answer as to why he downplays broadcasting. If everyone knew you could have the same success broadcasting then they wouldn't be buying as many fancy drills. That's my issue with the approach these guys take. They can't just tell the truth because they have to promote something that's inline with the folks who are paying the bills. It's part of it I guess. As long as you recognize that then its all good. The problem is that there's a lot of folks who don't know any better and listen to what they say as the gospel not realizing the amount of influence that $$$ is having on their message.

I double checked just to make sure I'm right and I was....Genesis is one of his sponsors and the folks that make the drills he's using. There's really no need to drill in cereal grains and clovers/brassicas...etc...For summer beans and such now I could see using one. The market for folks planting summer plots is a lot smaller though than the market for everyone planting winter food plots. You have to make folks think they need it for winter plots too in order to expand your customer base.

Money influencing the message isn’t just limited to drills either. If you’ll notice….and I’ve seen this happen more than once now…..he’ll go to an area where they’ve thinned out the timber and talk about "all the great beneficial plants that are now coming in that will feed and give the wildlife cover”…..In the very next segment though he'll go to a food plot and call the same plants “bad ol’ nasty weeds that we have to get rid of in order to grow beans sold by his sponsors”….Now don’t get me wrong, in certain situations I’d be growing the hell of those beans too. But again the number of situations where it actually makes sense are few. So once again you have to make everyone think that “weeds are bad” and everyone needs beans by our sponsors in order to expand their customer base to all food plotters. They can’t just tell the truth about how most of us should just be growing lush fields of native browse in the summer and how much our soil and deer would benefit from it….They have to put out a message that sells sponsors products. I’m not just picking on him….it’s pretty much all of them out there who produce a show that's sponsored by different seeds and drills, etc, etc..... and sort of understandable in a way since $$$ is what drives everything and pays to make the shows to begin with. I can’t help but to look at things through the eyes of “truth” though….its just how my brain works I guess.

This is what pissed me off the most about QDMA shutting down their forum and selling out to the dollar. I always thought that their whole mission was to be the organization that brought “truth” to the masses. I guess not though. If they aren’t going to do it then who is…..Is there anyone that will promote truth over a message that's tainted by money?

Nope, ain't gonna happen. I can't watch Grant Woods show because of the endless schtoopping for his sponsors. His message changes as his sponsors change, which destroys his credibility.

Harold, our old friends at QDMA actually have an article on their website about broadcasting into dead thatch. Wow, how things come full circle. I'm still on their email list, but I haven't joined since they screwed the pooch with the forum.

Harold, our old friends at QDMA actually have an article on their website about broadcasting into dead thatch. Wow, how things come full circle. I'm still on their email list, but I haven't joined since they screwed the pooch with the forum.

That's good to know. I guess he has to answer to the man!