Aldeer.com Forums Alabama Deer Talk Quality Deer Management Natural pine tree regeneration.

I have a 50 acre section of 25 year old pines that I want to cut or thin, but I would like to leave enough trees to have natural regeneration. How many trees per acre are needed for natural regeneration? Thnks in advance for any suggestions.

I wouldn't leave any less than 5. Better question is....why in the world do you want natural regeneration?

You can cut them all, and have volunteer pines come back so thick, you'll have to have them thinned early. They cut some of ours, years ago, when they came back, you would step on 2-3 with every step.

Exactly. Have it replanted and sprayed after the cut, and make some money in a few years.

No comparison to the growth and disease resistance of a Gen 3 or other comparable seedling to natural seeded. Having 2 or 3 seedlings of a natural seeded area in an area that you can step on the worst thing you can have. Trees are a crop, just like corn, cotton or anything else. They need space to perform best even when they are little. The natural will be thick, not grow and nobody will be wanting to thin it so it will grow. 5 loblolly seed trees is plenty on an acre if you do go with a seed tree method..

Thanks for the input. I will go with the clear cut and replant option. I am new to tree farming and I appreciate all the help I can get.

Where are you located?

A natural pine in the same exact size as a planted pine will weigh more than the planted pine. Therefor bring more money. Down side is it takes longer to grow. If you clear cut the pines in say 25 years vs. say 32 years on the natural pine, I believe you could invest the money from the planted pines for those 7 years and be even or maybe ahead. With planted pines in rows, when its time to thin you have less damage to other trees. With the planted pines growing faster means you can get to a point where you can burn sooner (assuming loblollies) than natural pines meaning better for wildlife. I have 1 tract of natural regeneration that I had thinned with machettes young. Still too thick so I went in with a dozer and tried to make rows. Still not doing well. All different size trees. From now on its planted pines for me.

Make sure when you herbicide you include either a heavy Gly application or another chemical that will kill the young natural pine seedlings. You need to spray usually around Sept so depending on the end of harvest date you need to have a germination period for the pine seeds before you spray.

x2. I've seen them come up in an old pasture that I plant a fairly large food plot in. I like to let it to get thick for three or four years around the edge before I bush hog around the plot seems to make deer mor comfortable. Anyways they come up and the nearest pine tree is 200 yards away.

The property is in Perry County.

If you have patience to wait, natural regeneration will give you a better, more valuable tree in 25-30 years. We are first thinning a few hundred acres of loblolly in Bullock county that we seedtree cut in 1996, removed the seedtrees in 2001, sprayed gums out of in 2003 with helicopter and burned in 2012. Cutting @ $500 per acre on a first thin at 18 years old, nearly twice as much as row planted. Problem is we need whole tree chip crew to do it.

Gobbler,

Can you elaborate on "need a whole chip crew to do it"?

Also, what makes a better more valuable tree with natural regeneration? Tighter spacings cause slower growth and less limbs?

Yes, slow growth makes tighter rings and heavier wood, competition with cohorts causes them to be tall, straight, and few limbs making good poles and sawlogs.

Due to the small diameters on the trees we want to remove, we cannot use a roundwood operation. They won't cut wood that small.

Gobbler, I see you mentioned you burn every 3 years. How often do you spray and do you coincide it with the burn in the same year or does it matter?

Gobbler, we have some land that experienced heavy natural regeneration along with planting after being clearcut. The trees are ~20 years old and are just borderline being large enought to be thinned for pulpwood. Would using a whole chip crew be an option for a first thinning to release the stand?

How many trees were left when y'all cut it in 1996? I've been kicking the idea around on trying this on a small stand we have.

Different stands have different burn rotations. Pine managed for quail, every other year, hardwood managed for deer every 5-7 years. If all works well, we spray once then burn when we need to. If spraying works well it does not need to be done again. We will burn the spring following spraying usually.



It would be if there was one available in your area. They are hard to find but are an excellent option for fist thinnings when the average diameters are small and the number of stems are high.



I think 15 or so.

What's your basal area on the stand in the last picture?

70 ish. Varies