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Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: CarbonClimber1] #3659792
04/27/22 01:07 PM
04/27/22 01:07 PM
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 171
Vinegar bend
JLedbetter Offline
3 point
JLedbetter  Offline
3 point
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 171
Vinegar bend
Originally Posted by CarbonClimber1
Where my 100 acre beach front estate is..can fly there in my helicopter..have to fire up the gulfstream to get to my other properties


You'd be amazed how convenient a helicopter can be 😉

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3660543
04/28/22 01:39 PM
04/28/22 01:39 PM
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
L
Lockjaw Offline
10 point
Lockjaw  Offline
10 point
L
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
Well I had another member leave. Just paid the downpayment too.

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: Lockjaw] #3660624
04/28/22 03:44 PM
04/28/22 03:44 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 7,822
A
abolt300 Online content
14 point
abolt300  Online Content
14 point
A
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 7,822
Originally Posted by Lockjaw
Well I had another member leave. Just paid the downpayment too.



Get rid of 10-12 more and you'll see some really good hunting, and find out you've got a whole lot more deer than you thought you had on the place.

Last edited by abolt300; 04/28/22 03:45 PM.
Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3661515
04/30/22 06:39 AM
04/30/22 06:39 AM
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
L
Lockjaw Offline
10 point
Lockjaw  Offline
10 point
L
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
If I don't start getting some payments that's where I'll be. Be interesting to see. I thought it might take a couple years but it may not. One of my newest WTI clover and chicory plots has 3 to 4 deer on it every night now. And they usually stay on camera for an hour or more. I need to check my other fields.

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: Lockjaw] #3661554
04/30/22 08:18 AM
04/30/22 08:18 AM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,778
Millry, AL
BayedUp Offline
Buttercup
BayedUp  Offline
Buttercup
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,778
Millry, AL
Originally Posted by Lockjaw
If I don't start getting some payments that's where I'll be. Be interesting to see. I thought it might take a couple years but it may not. One of my newest WTI clover and chicory plots has 3 to 4 deer on it every night now. And they usually stay on camera for an hour or more. I need to check my other fields.


I’m confused on how you have your lease and memberships structured. Do you not have a set amount for yearly dues that the members agreed to pay? If you are still cutting memberships after people have paid then you either are constantly raising the dues on them or you had the dues set to high to begin with. I may be wrong in assuming that but wouldn’t it be simpler to decide the ideal amount of memberships, set the dues for that amount, choose the best existing members to offer a spot at the new dues, and when you are full of paying memberships let the rest go.

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3661589
04/30/22 09:43 AM
04/30/22 09:43 AM
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
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Lockjaw Offline
10 point
Lockjaw  Offline
10 point
L
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
The lease is held by me for a hunting club. The board sets the amount of dues. All of last year's members are allowed to renew and can make an upfront PMT or 3 monthly payments. We (the board) essentially left the dues the same, just eliminated the upfront payment discount. All of last year's members were invited back. I have not heard from 5.

Based upon who has paid and committed to pay, I have enough $ to cover the lease and fall plant, but that's about it. I had 19, 3 left, 11 have paid or committed to pay and 5 have said nothing. That puts me at 11 members which is what the lease calls for as a max of standers. But the current dues aren't enough to accomplish our objectives. If the 5 who haven't said anything don't pay, then I'll have to decide about adding a person or paying some out of pocket.


Ultimately to keep the member count low, dues need to increase.

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662083
04/30/22 10:31 PM
04/30/22 10:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 957
North Birmingham
JustHunt Offline
6 point
JustHunt  Offline
6 point
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 957
North Birmingham
If your lease calls for only 11 people then that’s all you can add to your member list on the westervelt site. If you have more than that and they aren’t listed then that could be an issue. Possibly an insurance problem. But I’ve honestly never read anywhere in my lease where it states I can only have a certain amount of hunters. Maybe I overlooked it 🤷‍♂️.


NICHOLS OUTFITTERS IS HAVING A SALE!!!
Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662128
05/01/22 06:17 AM
05/01/22 06:17 AM
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
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Lockjaw Offline
10 point
Lockjaw  Offline
10 point
L
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
I've seen it in two. Westervelt likes to have 100 acres per hunter, and they round up on my case. That's the max number that can be hunting at any one time. I have never known a club to have less than the number, except the one next to me.

I figure by next spring I will have gotten all my main fields well covered and established with clover and chicory and hopefully this year we address stand issues. Then I believe I could have about 10 guys and charge the proper price to pay lease and maintain the fields year round.

The more I plant WTI clover and fusion, the more convinced I am it's the way to go. The deer eat it and it's usually an every day thing.

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662193
05/01/22 08:51 AM
05/01/22 08:51 AM
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 4,773
Lee County, Alabama
dBmV Offline
10 point
dBmV  Offline
10 point
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 4,773
Lee County, Alabama
Are you saying that you have/had 19 member but you limit the number of standers on any given hunt to 11?


What you do today, you have to sleep with tonight.
Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: Lockjaw] #3662225
05/01/22 09:39 AM
05/01/22 09:39 AM
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 1,292
In the woods
H
Here4fun Offline
8 point
Here4fun  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 1,292
In the woods
Originally Posted by Lockjaw
As the leaseholder of mine, starting this year, I can speak to this. Our lease went up 3%. I had 19 members, 2 are leaving, which gets me down to 17 on 1050 acres. The lease says 11. Some of my guys rarely hunt. I have 24 green fields, and if they thin and cut timber, they are supposed to add 2 more fields, which will be an acre or so more, that we will have to lime. My previous soil tests all indicate 2 tons per acre, so I will probably have to get 2 tons of pellet lime.

Fertilizer is up. Herbicide is up. I need to fertilize 3 times a year minimum. Thats 90 bags if I can find the stuff I need to use. I would need 100 bags of pellet lime. So at $20/bag for fertilizer, I need $1800. Lime at $5/bag is $500. Seed will easily be $600. The departing members are taking up to 4 ladder stands, which I need to replace more than likely. Figure another $500. All the ladder stands I have, and both tripods need new seats. We need to do some maintenance on the shooting houses, and probably build some new ones. I need to get a scale, and make sure I get jawbones this year too. We need to probably replace some ratchet straps as well.

I have spent the last 3 years planting in spring, expanding food plots, getting them limed, and planted in Whitetail or Durana Clover, along with Whitetail Chicory. I have a couple spots that have extreme. I put out minerals during that time, and even got mine out before Westervelt banned that this year. Of course I was the person footing the bill for all that. I say this to say, I finally have a high quality food plot structure, which should help keep the deer on the property and grow them as well. When I joined, they didn't plant in the spring, and they planted rye grass in the fall. I don't plant rye grass. I plant a brassica and cereal grain mix, and add clover to it.

So we did a few things to try to lower the member count without telling someone we aren't going to renew them. We raised dues $200. We cut the doe limit per member from 5 to 2. We lowered the kid limit to 1 buck and 1 doe. You can bring a guest, but their kill comes off your number. And we said no killing doe's off a green field. The goal being increasing the doe numbers on the property, and hopefully luring a buck out on a green field.

If I keep 17 members, then I will have enough $ in the treasury to do everything we need to do and have some left over, which I prefer, because I sent out invoices already and only 1 guy has paid me. Since 25% of my lease is due May 1, it would be nice to have that in reserve to just pay without waiting on the other guys to pay.

The biggest problem in all the clubs I have been in is getting people to work. It takes a lot of time and money to build and maintain shooting houses and green fields. And not alot of clubs put in the time to get their fields test and limed and fertilized properly. Even with all the supplemental fertilzing I was doing, we weren't putting enough out.

If you are having to work to chase members every year, then you can't focus on keeping the club up. So alot of clubs lower the price and get more members. Just depends which way you want to go.




Lockjaw I am still trying to wrap my mind around your situation.

You have 1050 acres. You had 19 members which is 55 acres per member. You lease says 11 members total which is around 100 acres per member. Which I would think means you cannot have more than 11 actually. And you allow guests and children as well ? That is way too many people.

On that much land youd be far better off just reducing members and increasing the price per member. If you went with 6 members youd not only have a lot better hunting IMO but a lot less hassle. 19 , 17 or even 11 members is just crazy.

How much do you charge per person to hunt that 1050 acres ? And does your memberships include turkey hunting? What are your goals with your lease? Are you trying to have quality deer hunting or just a meat club?

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662264
05/01/22 10:34 AM
05/01/22 10:34 AM
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
L
Lockjaw Offline
10 point
Lockjaw  Offline
10 point
L
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
I basically took over the lease. We had 19 members last year. We have a few that hardly, if ever hunt. Children are allowed, most sit with their parent. And it's not a large number. Guests are allowed with approval but only 3 times. Turkey hunting is included. Dues are $1,200, which is what they have been, we just got rid of the upfront discount this year. I think $1,500 is where they will need to be to get the member numbers lower and plant and fertilize properly.

I have been focused on food mainly. I did soil tests and limed 2 falls ago. I have really spent a lot of my own $ getting mainly WTI clover/fusion established. I know the deer herd has grown, but I'm not sure yet where I think it is. We have some nice mature bucks on the property, but they are tough to kill.

I want to reduce the member count, and improve our deer density. Then I think the transition to fewer members and better deer is easier. To help with that we lowered the doe kill limit and said you can't shoot one off a greenfield. I started last year when I was made the Pres convincing folks the idea of shooting every doe that walks out on a greenfield is a bad one. It helped with people seeing deer last season too.

I'm not sure how closely you have read a lease, but Westervelt can spell out how many doe's they want us to kill. The only analysis I can see online is from 2018 and it said to kill 10. We haven't ever killed 10 since I have been here. I could probably have killed 5 last year easily if I wanted. But feel I should be setting an example too. I really don't think anyone would complain about me doing that, since I do most of the field work. But... You know.

I figured it would take me a couple more years to really get this place dialed in and get everyone on the same page.

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: Lockjaw] #3662269
05/01/22 10:45 AM
05/01/22 10:45 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,779
Clanton
Turkey_neck Offline
Booner
Turkey_neck  Offline
Booner
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,779
Clanton
Originally Posted by Lockjaw
I basically took over the lease. We had 19 members last year. We have a few that hardly, if ever hunt. Children are allowed, most sit with their parent. And it's not a large number. Guests are allowed with approval but only 3 times. Turkey hunting is included. Dues are $1,200, which is what they have been, we just got rid of the upfront discount this year. I think $1,500 is where they will need to be to get the member numbers lower and plant and fertilize properly.

I have been focused on food mainly. I did soil tests and limed 2 falls ago. I have really spent a lot of my own $ getting mainly WTI clover/fusion established. I know the deer herd has grown, but I'm not sure yet where I think it is. We have some nice mature bucks on the property, but they are tough to kill.

I want to reduce the member count, and improve our deer density. Then I think the transition to fewer members and better deer is easier. To help with that we lowered the doe kill limit and said you can't shoot one off a greenfield. I started last year when I was made the Pres convincing folks the idea of shooting every doe that walks out on a greenfield is a bad one. It helped with people seeing deer last season too.

I'm not sure how closely you have read a lease, but Westervelt can spell out how many doe's they want us to kill. The only analysis I can see online is from 2018 and it said to kill 10. We haven't ever killed 10 since I have been here. I could probably have killed 5 last year easily if I wanted. But feel I should be setting an example too. I really don't think anyone would complain about me doing that, since I do most of the field work. But... You know.

I figured it would take me a couple more years to really get this place dialed in and get everyone on the same page.




Y’all don’t need to shoot any does honestly. We normally have the opportunity to kill at least 5 does a day on either of our 3 properties.


Would walk over a naked woman to get to a gobblin turkey!
Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662295
05/01/22 11:34 AM
05/01/22 11:34 AM
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
L
Lockjaw Offline
10 point
Lockjaw  Offline
10 point
L
Joined: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,988
Chelsea
We may not end up killing many. I know the club next to me doesn't shoot very many either.

We are going to try to do a camera survey later and see what we come up with.

I got a buck hitting one of my clover fields. He should be a good deer this year, maybe he will add some mass. I had pics of 4 nice mature one's last year. And several others that should be better this year.

I really believe our herd is increasing.

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662403
05/01/22 03:00 PM
05/01/22 03:00 PM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 10,951
Ourtown, AL
BCLC Online mad
Booner
BCLC  Online Mad
Booner
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 10,951
Ourtown, AL
Lockjaw-

I’m gonna offer up some advice, it’s only worth what you paid for it, so keep that in mind.

You’ve been very vocal about this lease. From the property owner to its location to the improvements you’re making to the quality of nature bucks you’ve got on cam to what high dollar mixes you’ve been planting in your fields. Once you get this place dialed in, somebody with big pockets is gonna sweep in and Westervelt is gonna break your heart. They’re not even gonna give you a chance to match, it’s gonna be a notice that your lease won’t be renewed and please remove stands and cameras by May31.

I’ve seen it happen to my friends. I’ve seen it happen to people on this forum. I know hunting leases are exciting to talk about but loose lips sink ships with a quickness. I only say this because you’re obviously emotionally attached to your property and I’d hate to see you lose it after so much hard work. Good luck this season!


We’re not dead. We just smell that way. Dayum. - AC870

Yessir! I’m always gonna shoot what makes me happy and I want everyone else to do the same! If you shoot one be proud of it and don’t worry what anyone else thinks. - SJ22
Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662410
05/01/22 03:15 PM
05/01/22 03:15 PM
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 5,107
Earth
TDog93 Online content
12 point
TDog93  Online Content
12 point
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 5,107
Earth
^^^^^
Amen
Loose lips sink ships - it can even be dangerous talking too much on here - somebody can always swoop in and take it - prob best to not say much and act dumb if u asked question

I don’t talk period around my friends and keep my leases on down low and I don’t give coordinates which has even been asked of me on here


Hunt the wind - leave it better than you found it - love your neighbor as you love your self
We need prayer for our country now more than ever
Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662548
05/01/22 07:08 PM
05/01/22 07:08 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 3,131
Michigan
S
Sasquatch Lives Offline
10 point
Sasquatch Lives  Offline
10 point
S
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 3,131
Michigan
I have had two properties stolen by groups of rich guys offering more $ than the property was worth. One got his ass kicked though so I hope it was worth it for him.

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: Sasquatch Lives] #3662577
05/01/22 07:30 PM
05/01/22 07:30 PM
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 135
Louisiana to Central AL
A
Antelope08 Offline
3 point
Antelope08  Offline
3 point
A
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 135
Louisiana to Central AL
Originally Posted by Sasquatch Lives
I have had two properties stolen by groups of rich guys offering more $ than the property was worth. One got his ass kicked though so I hope it was worth it for him.


I was in a club in MS and had a few guys that found out that the President of the club's mom owned the land, they had tried to talk with him about hunting it or joining the club for years but he wouldn't allow them to, they went behind his back and presented her an offer that was ridiculous.....she told them she would be a fool to sell/lease them the land and leave her son without a place to hunt......there are crooked people out there that will do anything to get a lease, sometimes it's good to keep quiet about where you hunt and the quality of the land and your heard.

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662590
05/01/22 07:42 PM
05/01/22 07:42 PM
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 5,107
Earth
TDog93 Online content
12 point
TDog93  Online Content
12 point
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 5,107
Earth
I hav lost turkey leases from friends hunting w me talking - and I hd told them up front not to talk - they did and we lost

They said - what u said actually came true - I said - why did u think I was telling u that - of course it came true


Hunt the wind - leave it better than you found it - love your neighbor as you love your self
We need prayer for our country now more than ever
Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662646
05/01/22 08:47 PM
05/01/22 08:47 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 13,405
Over yonder
E
extreme heights hunter Offline
Booner
extreme heights hunter  Offline
Booner
E
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 13,405
Over yonder
Damn Floridians rurnt it

Re: Have leases really gotten THAT high? [Re: ford150man] #3662670
05/01/22 09:24 PM
05/01/22 09:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 957
North Birmingham
JustHunt Offline
6 point
JustHunt  Offline
6 point
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 957
North Birmingham
Lockjaw, so you are saying that you can only have 11 hunters on the property but you have 19 members. Is this done on a first come first serve basis or do y’all draw to see who gets to hunt particular days. How do you accomplish keeping it at only 11 hunters on the property when you have 19 members. Really makes no sense.


NICHOLS OUTFITTERS IS HAVING A SALE!!!
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