Since they decided to shoot does, how many would you take if shot about 12-14 last season? I don’t know why they are shooting more for no reason, but would you shoot less?

No one can really give you a complete answer just sitting here on the internet…..There needs to be measurements taken and reasons behind why you say you “need” to be shooting this or that amount of does…..It needs to be based on the condition of the habitat and the condition of the deer. Generally speaking though there aren’t that many places that “need” to be shooting a bunch of does….Shoot what you want for your freezer but don’t just shoot them for the sake of “management” without first being able to point to the reasoning behind it other than somebody said that’s just what you do.

Thanks I agree with shooting what you are going to eat, but I think fellow hunters are just shooting them for “ management” .

Need some data. Acres involved. Location. Adjoining land owners. Management goals.

Its hunting not killing. That's where I draw thse line too.

Yep, people take advantage and just kill way more than they need for fun.

I don’t shoot them for the extra pressure it puts on place - if I can leave without them ever knowing I hunted - that’s great

I see 5-7 Doe on good hunt and 1-2 on average hunt - some days none on my gun lease. Don’t think I need to do any management on my does - if I kill a few bucks - I hav plenty of meat

On My small bow lease - it has lot more does - May need to take some out There - but prob will not

Only kill bucks that are 4.5 or older and kill as many does as you do bucks. You won’t kill to many that way and keep the ratio balanced.

We try to kill mature bucks but don’t usually kill many in a season

Buck slayer I would suggest you contact your local District Office and schedule a site visit with a Biologist. There’s so much that goes into making recommendations on how many deer should or should not be taken on a particular property. There’s a lot of erroneous information in both of the threads you’ve asked about this. No one can answer your question without knowing the habitat you have to manage, what your restrictions are, current population and objectives for the property. Doe harvest is MORE important to overall herd health than buck harvest, so get a qualified opinion.

I work with properties in the same county, but on opposite sides, in completely different habitat. One property shoots a doe per 40-50 acres annually and can’t keep up. The other shoots 1-2 does per 500 acres annually. Anybody throwing numbers out there for you to kill is doing nothing but that, throwing out numbers.

Your club members have probably read that balancing the herd promotes antler growth. They all probably think killing a bunch of does will make bucks grow 130 inches of antler because some douche wrote an article about it in a deer hunting magazine. Or, they may just want to kill deer every weekend. I can tell you from 2 personal experiences on 2 large properties in Macon and tallapoosa counties that killing too many is a bad bad bad idea. The whole having a 1:1 bucks to doe ratio makes the rut more intense is a crockpot of steaming turds.

Buck to doe ratio plays out a little different than how we have it cleanly defined in our heads as a constant number for one given property…….It plays out more as the buck to hot doe ratio……and that changes every 24 hrs once the rut starts and the first doe goes hot....It may be a little different from spot to spot just depending on how the bucks start shuffling around when the does go to popping off……Buck to hot doe ratio begins to be something that’s happening on a landscape scale though and not just on a microlevel....Bucks start moving and searching and evening out the ratio on the landscape as they sort things out.....I like having a pile of does on my place when all that starts happening

Thanks for answers gonna try to stop these people from thinking they have to shoot does every weekend.

I we want to have the very best buck to doe ratio for the rut on a landscape scale then we should make our gun season Feb 1-10 or something of that nature.....as post rut as possible

My son and I, always try and kill twice as doe as bucks. Just 2 of us, so we might kill 4 doe. We try and do this in bow season.

I guess the people who shoot a bunch of does enjoy not seeing anything when they go.

We’ve killed 2 does inn7 years Matt. Not 1-2 per year 😂😂😂

Take Matt’s advice. I’m speaking from experience

Curious as to your informed thoughts on when you actually NEED to shoot does? I’ve had one biologist tell me that you should or need to when productivity (I think he said # of fetuses/doe) declines. Not sure that’s something many of us can gauge. Seems like that would also be seen with weight and antler declines over several years.

I usually give them a break as I like to see them and figure coyotes and neighbors get enough of them as it is.

I would think the most important thing would be the productivity of the habitat.....Is it declining?

One club I was in years ago was timber company land and they required a certain amount of doe jaw bones for management practices every year. Does timber company land still do this. Like I said in the other doe thread I think it depends on the property.

How do you tell that the habitat is declining? And, if it’s declining, isn’t what really matters the impact on deer? Also, wouldn’t you want to improve it rather than shoot does?

It’s all pretty subjective and a matter of opinion on where any one person thinks is the appropriate place to manage…..BUT….


You can do like a timber cruise but instead of assessing the timber with each plot you do an assessment on the understory vegetation…..What species do you see present in each plot….in what abundance do the different understory plant species exist? How does this year’s assessment compare to prior years??......Some folks are looking to manage at levels where certain plant species are allowed to flourish and reproduce without being wiped out by the deer…..You’re looking for diversity and higher preference plants to still be present and not browsed into “extinction” so to speak….. to where the quality of the overall forage declines

In other words, if you have privet then your habitat is still pretty good 😂😂.

We take 20+ off 2000 acres for years. 200+lb bucks and 120+lb does are common. Lot of does have twins and some triplets

There's a wide range in how properties are managed.....When it comes down to it deer will damn near eat anything green......There's a lot of difference in the preferences and quality though......I think if you want to really be able to make a judgement call in this matter then you need to be fairly familiar with the majority of our understory plant species and know how to identify them. Most of the time I find that the deer population goes hand in hand with the quality of the habitat and the population not something we really have to manage in most situations now that the coyote is in place.....What I mean by that is that I dont see Enon Plantation type population densities anywhere else but where there is habitat there to support such a population.....The same population does not exist on lesser lands with people needing to shoot their way out of it....The lesser managed lands have fewer deer

A lot of this revolves around plant diversity and land management practices……The deer aren’t gonna populate themselves beyond what the land can sustain when there is a vibrant predator population in place. The coyotes are doing more than we currently realize…..One thing I believe they are doing is busting up heavy concentrations of deer in areas where the habitat is more fragmented…..I believe I’ve seen this here at my place….Big influx in coyotes over the past several years….big decrease in doe population…..However, I had beggar lice on my pants for the first time this year…..You see the coyotes are busting up my efforts to stockpile does and in turn giving this area of habitat a little break from the intense browsing….which allows some of the more preferred species to prosper and replenish the seed bank for the future with things like beggar lice…..Its when the seed bank runs empty and there is nothing left to replenish the plant community that there becomes a real diminish in the “quality” of the habitat….Again though, I think the coyote is nature’s defense against that. The herd is not gonna exceed what the habitat will support….the yote will eliminate the excess before there is any crisis.


This is also an area where rotating cattle could help with plant diversity

Top cat do you still see as many after taking them?

We're the longest standing property on the state DMP. We cut off doe kills no later than 12-31 each year. Had a 130lb doe taken yesterday. Never seems to effect sightings. We're blessed to have the property.

We take 30-40 off 2100 acres every year and still covered up with deer.

It’s different on every property.

You can't raise cattle and only sell bulls

We use to not shoot them and were seeing same numbers as we did when we didn’t shoot them, so why would they shoot them? The only way you can due it I think without hurting your deer numbers is in a high fence.

This is the best advice you should consider, and follow.

Ok

Will a district biologist make a visit to a leased property? We lease from a timber company and they want us to kill 12 does off 1,800 acres. Problem is we won’t see 12 does the whole season

Lefthorn, as long as you have permission to hunt the property the biologist over the area will certainly meet with you to make recommendations.

Awesome. Thanks Matt

QDM and QDMA sometimes gets a lot of heat and is blamed for hunters killing of too many does. The QDMA has never said to kill, kill, kill does. QDM suggests having a balanced sex ratio and having X number of deer on your property in which a deer herd can exist in a healthy existence. And, the QDMA encourages habitat enhancements.

There are A LOT of factors in deciding your doe harvest, if any.

Yes, get a biologist in there. But no property can handle a bunch of wildlife "CONSUMERS" that pay thousands of dollars per yr so that they can "feed their family" and shoot every 2.5 yr old buck and any buck they see. If you "give back" to the land and wildlife, it will give back to you! In other words, be good stewards of the land.

Just on my soap box and I know you're doing it right, man!! Good luck!