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Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) #268323
01/22/12 11:23 AM
01/22/12 11:23 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
FurFlyin Offline OP
Freak of Nature
FurFlyin  Offline OP
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
I'm not sure how to phrase this question, but I have talked with 5 hunters who all hunt in different areas of the state and they have seen the same thing this year that I have. On our farm I have seen and have pictures of the least amount of does I have had. I also have pictures of 2-3 bucks per doe picture. Deer sightings have fallen off to near zero.

The other 5 guys hunt in Blount (2), Cherokee, Conecuh, Jackson, and I hunt in Marshall (south of the river) and in south Tallapoosa. My story above was told almost word for word by each of the other guys to me when I brought up the "How's your season been" conversation.

I'm looking for answers on this poll from the average Joe. If your land joins 6000 acres where no does are ever shot, then divulge that info when you answer. If you are in a club or lease and the rules have always allowed for a minimal doe harvest, like 1 per year per member, disclose that in your answer too.

I'm going to attempt to attend the CAB meetings this year and express my opinion on whether sound biological practices are being followed on herd management. I sure don't think they are. So I'd like to hear your opinion.

I know there are still areas in the state where the landowners or lessees have control over enough land that the deer population is relatively unchanged since "operation kill the does" started but it's just not that way on many properties.

Here's the question I would like answered and the type information I would like to see, Thanks:

Are we killing too many does in most places? My answer is, yes. I hunt 160 acres in Marshall county and 120 acres in south Tallapoosa county. I've seen 12 deer this season. 6 in Marshall, 6 in T'poosa. 8 bucks/4 does I've hunted 45-55 days


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268325
01/22/12 11:35 AM
01/22/12 11:35 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 4,053
White Plains Alabama
cgardner Offline
10 point
cgardner  Offline
10 point
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 4,053
White Plains Alabama
I hunt in north Randolph and my dad hunts in Monroe. Both of us have seen a drastic drop off in the number of deer, both on camera and with our eyes. I wish they would scale back on the doe slaughter. Maybe end the doe season on Dec 31st.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268329
01/22/12 11:54 AM
01/22/12 11:54 AM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 25,905
Prattville, Alabama
Skullworks Online content
Freak of Nature
Skullworks  Online Content
Freak of Nature
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 25,905
Prattville, Alabama
I've heard the same from people. We have never seen a ton of does on our property. We shoot maybe 5 a year(1 this year) off of 1100 acres...the people next to us make up for it by shooting 12 on 40 acres. smile


"I'm not near as critical about how big they are as I once was. Smiles are more important now! We will grow more deer."
Jimmy G.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268345
01/22/12 12:18 PM
01/22/12 12:18 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997
Warrior River Country
49er Offline
Booner
49er  Offline
Booner
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,997
Warrior River Country
Quote:
Are we killing too many does in most places? My answer is, yes. I hunt 160 acres in Marshall county and 120 acres in south Tallapoosa county. I've seen 12 deer this season. 6 in Marshall, 6 in T'poosa. 8 bucks/4 does I've hunted 45-55 days


DMAP is a good science-based program to use to control your doe population on a site-specific basis for neighboring small land parcels instead of just using the statewide seasons and bag limits.

DMAP: Page 78 in this year's Regulation Book:

Regulation Book 2011-2012

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 49er] #268355
01/22/12 12:34 PM
01/22/12 12:34 PM
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 239
Ohatchee, AL
D
dadbud Offline
4 point
dadbud  Offline
4 point
D
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 239
Ohatchee, AL
2 doe a day is too many. Too many people now live in the country. We are getting too populated to allow this to continue. The law should be changed and then we need better control and enforcement.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268359
01/22/12 12:41 PM
01/22/12 12:41 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 12,788
Thomasville, AL
H
Hogwild Offline
Booner
Hogwild  Offline
Booner
H
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 12,788
Thomasville, AL
IF people TRULY had the education, information and ability to manage the herd........we would NOT need any Laws OR the DCNR.

Fact is, though:

People LIKE to kill deer, and way too many of them if left unchecked!!!!

It is time to back off!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268360
01/22/12 12:47 PM
01/22/12 12:47 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 917
Skyline. Alabama
H
hillmp63 Offline
6 point
hillmp63  Offline
6 point
H
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 917
Skyline. Alabama
Why worry about not seeing does when the there isn't a way to enforce the 3 buck limit.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268409
01/22/12 02:01 PM
01/22/12 02:01 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,493
Millbrook AL
SMB44 Offline
10 point
SMB44  Offline
10 point
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,493
Millbrook AL
Between me and my buddy we have seen 6 deer (all does) on our 63 acres. It's our first season there but thinkin back I have 6 different bucks on cam and 4-6 does... Hard to b sure on the does . As of today I have no new pics since Jan 6th 4 pics of does one pic of a spike... This is at my lease in titus

I have about 50 acres I hunt in Nectar Al. So far there since last weekend I have pics of a min of 6 bucks and have multiple pics with atleast 4 does in one pic.... I have not had a chance to study all the pics yet to even try n guess buck to does ratio but I would say its close to 2 does to a buck ... But that info is from only one cam in one part of the property ....

I also hunt a wma near autaugaville . I have not hunted it a lot but I have seen 10 deer one was a spike ...

But I do think there needs to b a study on what the actual deer population is and what the buck to doe ratio ... And from that they need to determine how many bucks or does need to be harvested based off the heard of that area .


Playin string music
Hoyt Vector 32
Get Serious Get Hoyt

Alto, la migra means Stop, immigration in Spanish slang. They'll scatter like skittles dropped on a concrete floor. -Furflyin
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: cgardner] #268416
01/22/12 02:16 PM
01/22/12 02:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,264
Jay,Fl / Gulf Breeze
04 Spoiler Offline
14 point
04 Spoiler  Offline
14 point
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,264
Jay,Fl / Gulf Breeze
Originally Posted By: cgardner
I hunt in north Randolph and my dad hunts in Monroe. Both of us have seen a drastic drop off in the number of deer, both on camera and with our eyes. I wish they would scale back on the doe slaughter. Maybe end the doe season on Dec 31st.


That would be to good to be true...

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 04 Spoiler] #268466
01/22/12 03:46 PM
01/22/12 03:46 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
14 point
bigt  Offline
14 point
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
Are we killing too many does in most places? Yes

At least In Mobile and Baldwin counties where I hunt.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 04 Spoiler] #268467
01/22/12 03:46 PM
01/22/12 03:46 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
14 point
bigt  Offline
14 point
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
Originally Posted By: 04 Spoiler
Originally Posted By: cgardner
I hunt in north Randolph and my dad hunts in Monroe. Both of us have seen a drastic drop off in the number of deer, both on camera and with our eyes. I wish they would scale back on the doe slaughter. Maybe end the doe season on Dec 31st.


That would be to good to be true...


x2 thumbup


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268470
01/22/12 03:48 PM
01/22/12 03:48 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,209
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,209
Boxes Cove
We've got 840 acres, we gotta whack um. About 7-8 years ago we were taking 25-30 a year then for a few years about 20 , last couple 12-15 and I think that's right for us. If our doe numbers go up, we'll up our doe harvest again. The liberal season allows you to be flexable. If you need to whack um, whack um, if your numbers are about right slack up a few years. Flexable is good!



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 2Dogs] #268498
01/22/12 04:27 PM
01/22/12 04:27 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
FurFlyin Offline OP
Freak of Nature
FurFlyin  Offline OP
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
We've got 840 acres, we gotta whack um. About 7-8 years ago we were taking 25-30 a year then for a few years about 20 , last couple 12-15 and I think that's right for us. If our doe numbers go up, we'll up our doe harvest again. The liberal season allows you to be flexable. If you need to whack um, whack um, if your numbers are about right slack up a few years. Flexable is good!


I agree that flexible is good, if you have people who actually understand what you're doing. When people in south Marshall county are killing 10 does per year, they don't know their azz from a hat about deer management. I'm all for limited regulations, but for that to work people would have to have the knowledge of how to manage the deer herd, and that's just not the case in most circumstances.


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268501
01/22/12 04:32 PM
01/22/12 04:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 4,100
Grant, Alabama, USA
TR Offline
10 point
TR  Offline
10 point
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 4,100
Grant, Alabama, USA
Sightings of everything are down some on our lease. We have pics from Sept through November of 22 different bucks, mostly spikes. Not nearly that many does (it's hard to tell the difference in doe pictures). We have killed 3 bucks and one button head (mistake)and one doe. I attribute the low sightings to the record acorn crop. We have killed the fewest does of any of the 3 years our club has been in existence. We have never killed more than 6 or 7 on about 1,000 acres.


"Make a difference, take a kid hunting".
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: TR] #268509
01/22/12 04:51 PM
01/22/12 04:51 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
FurFlyin Offline OP
Freak of Nature
FurFlyin  Offline OP
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
Originally Posted By: TR
Sightings of everything are down some on our lease. We have pics from Sept through November of 22 different bucks, mostly spikes. Not nearly that many does (it's hard to tell the difference in doe pictures). We have killed 3 bucks and one button head (mistake)and one doe. I attribute the low sightings to the record acorn crop. We have killed the fewest does of any of the 3 years our club has been in existence. We have never killed more than 6 or 7 on about 1,000 acres.


I'm sure the acorn crop has some effect on it. Having said that I have not hunted a green field in over 6 weeks and I'm still not seeing deer. I've got one of my cameras up on an oak bottom here at home. I put it out 3 weeks ago and will not retrieve it until the season is over. I hope the batteries were 50% or better when I put it out. The amount of pictures on that camera will be a very good indicator of our deer population.


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268563
01/22/12 06:26 PM
01/22/12 06:26 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,113
Dothan
L
LIOJeff Offline
8 point
LIOJeff  Offline
8 point
L
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,113
Dothan
I think we're killing too many does myself

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268603
01/22/12 07:07 PM
01/22/12 07:07 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 12,788
Thomasville, AL
H
Hogwild Offline
Booner
Hogwild  Offline
Booner
H
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 12,788
Thomasville, AL
I have seen more people NOT hunt this year than EVER before.

Kids don't want to go and not see anything.
Older people, like my Uncles, who are not able to get around like they used to and hunt the way it takes to even see deer nowadays are getting very dis0interested as well.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268608
01/22/12 07:10 PM
01/22/12 07:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 293
A
ATDH Offline
4 point
ATDH  Offline
4 point
A
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 293
our doe sightings has dropped off big time! the few does we have seen has one or two button heads with them not any little young does, we have killed alot more bucks this year than does by far, and also the does that have been killing have weighed between 115-145lbs which tells me that they are not overpopulated for sure, real healthy, and the people in the club wont listen and keep shooting the fire out of them! alot of buttons have been killed also due to this, i think we could go the whole year next year and not pull the trigger on a doe and still be fine, wish the state would limit the doe season again.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268622
01/22/12 07:20 PM
01/22/12 07:20 PM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,440
Monroe Co.,Al
G
gobblebox Offline
10 point
gobblebox  Offline
10 point
G
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,440
Monroe Co.,Al
I've hunted the same land for 25 years and since the doe season was extended we don't see half thew deer we used to,we dont kill as many bucks either,some of the clubs close to us are if its brown its down so they kill the hell out of them,I think our buck harvest has gone down because of all the button bucks and spikes being shot for does,those deer never get the chance to grow up,one of our neighbors this weekend was talking about some guys down the road that have killed 8 or 9 spikes this year,I think the doe harvest should at least be cut back to 1 per day and no does after Dec.31st.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: LIOJeff] #268628
01/22/12 07:24 PM
01/22/12 07:24 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 24,761
Buc-ee’s Beach Express
leroycnbucks Offline
Freak of Nature
leroycnbucks  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 24,761
Buc-ee’s Beach Express
Thanks FurFlyin for this thread. This has been a concern of mine this whole year. When I ask other hunters if they are seeing any deer they say the same thing about the accorn crop this year. I think it's more to it than that. Were not seeing the deer we have in the past. We only harvest 2 does a year on 600 acres and have been doing so the past five years. My buddy and I have been in the stand every weekend and then some since the opening of gun season and between the two of us and some guest we have seen ten deer. Two spikes,seven does and one messed up rack buck. We have seen these same deer at least a half dozen times. Two years ago we would see as many as eight to ten deer every weekend. Between the hot weather and not seeing any deer this has been the worst season I have had in 32 years. I don't know what the answer is but I hope someone who knows more about it than me does.


Proud Army and ALNG veteran
God Bless America!
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268634
01/22/12 07:31 PM
01/22/12 07:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,021
Auburn
F
frezznh2o Offline
6 point
frezznh2o  Offline
6 point
F
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,021
Auburn
they need to err on the side of caution and pull back on the doe harvest. I think they need to get an accurate idea of what the coyote are doing to the population before making the call. we can always kill more if the population gets to high

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268635
01/22/12 07:31 PM
01/22/12 07:31 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 240
LA
sloughfoot Offline
4 point
sloughfoot  Offline
4 point
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 240
LA
As for the property we hunt, i have never had a year as good as this one- I have seen plenty of deer, maybe as many bucks as does. The deer herd is healthy, most of the mature does had twins or triplet fawns, and all the deer I see look fat and sassy, probably because of the acorn crop and a mild winter. I have heard no one complain except about the weather and there is no particular management technique applied in any of the acreage around us. I love having self discretion, and overall the current law hasn't hurt us a bit. So far so good...

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268641
01/22/12 07:34 PM
01/22/12 07:34 PM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 293
A
ATDH Offline
4 point
ATDH  Offline
4 point
A
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 293
looks like if this " wipe the does out" keeps going on that everybody is jumping up and down about we will be hurting to see anything in the next several years, the bucks will deffinetly go where the does are and if they aint many left then people will start to lose interest in going out and sitting in the woods for nothing then people will quit hunting and spending so much money in everything and the hunting economy will be in bad shape unless the state does somthing about it!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: sloughfoot] #268644
01/22/12 07:35 PM
01/22/12 07:35 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,209
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,209
Boxes Cove
Thanks sloughfoot, I was getting lonely out on that limb.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268652
01/22/12 07:43 PM
01/22/12 07:43 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 12,788
Thomasville, AL
H
Hogwild Offline
Booner
Hogwild  Offline
Booner
H
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 12,788
Thomasville, AL
Just out of curiosity's sake......what part of the State are you guys in that are seeing as many, or more, deer than years past???

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 2Dogs] #268659
01/22/12 07:49 PM
01/22/12 07:49 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
FurFlyin Offline OP
Freak of Nature
FurFlyin  Offline OP
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
Thanks sloughfoot, I was getting lonely out on that limb.


I am glad you two posted your observations. I didn't ask for only those who agree with me to reply. laugh

For the two of you, I'll ask this. Is your hunting land secured in such a manner that you have the control over the majority of the killing? Like, is your land surrounded by or joining property that is managed with limited does killed, or joining land that isn't hunted much, join a large river, or is the land around you pressured like it is for most of us?

I've spent 95% of my time in hardwoods setting up close to the thick nasty with a bow in my hand. I don't hunt spots when I know the wind won't try to cooperate. I guess my point is, this ain't my first rodeo. I've successfully hunted a long time. I'm not seeing deer and I'm hunting where they feed in heavy acorn years. Granted there are more places for them to feed but if I ain't seeing them and my camera ain't catching them, then I've gotta wonder if there is many of them.....left.


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268662
01/22/12 07:51 PM
01/22/12 07:51 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 12,788
Thomasville, AL
H
Hogwild Offline
Booner
Hogwild  Offline
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H
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 12,788
Thomasville, AL
Last Sunday afternoon, my wife wanted to just go 'riding-around' on the backroads. It was warm and I didn't feel like going hunting. So, we loaded up around 3:00 pm and just slowly rode backroads. We went down Hwy 154 through the Chilton community, then through the Lower Road (dirt) out to Hwy 84 and then to Coffeeville. We left Coffeeville on Hwy 69 and came then turned back up the Tallahatta Rd to midway and then back thru there to the house. It was just after dark when we got home. We saw 1 (one) doe the entire trip!!!! And she crossed the road very near my house right as we were getting home.

In recent years past, at this time of the year, we would have thought it unusual to have not seen 15-20. 20 years ago, we would have seen well over 100. I know we WERE overpopulated at one time. BUT, it has not been in the past 6-8 years!!!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #268667
01/22/12 07:54 PM
01/22/12 07:54 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
FurFlyin Offline OP
Freak of Nature
FurFlyin  Offline OP
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
Originally Posted By: Hogwild
I have seen more people NOT hunt this year than EVER before.


Me too. I've talked to people who are hanging it up, quitting clubs, etc all because they aren't seeing deer.

Originally Posted By: Hogwild
Kids don't want to go and not see anything.


This worries me most of all. I'm hunting as long as there is something to hunt. I want to see deer, but don't have to. My 9 year old on the other hand?????


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268669
01/22/12 07:54 PM
01/22/12 07:54 PM
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Alabama
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Dquailhunter Offline
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Alabama
Going to look back in a few shorts years and say man I remember those good ole days when I could go and sit and see some deer.

No does = No bucks

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #268674
01/22/12 07:58 PM
01/22/12 07:58 PM
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Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
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Boxes Cove
Hills of Jackson Co for me.
Originally Posted By: Hogwild
Just out of curiosity's sake......what part of the State are you guys in that are seeing as many, or more, deer than years past???





"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #268677
01/22/12 08:01 PM
01/22/12 08:01 PM
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Marshall County
FurFlyin Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Hogwild
In recent years past, at this time of the year, we would have thought it unusual to have not seen 15-20. 20 years ago, we would have seen well over 100. I know we WERE overpopulated at one time. BUT, it has not been in the past 6-8 years!!!


From what I understand seeing deer on the road is the largest cause of the wide open doe season. Thanks to ALFA and their deep pockets the DCNR adopted this liberal doe season. ALFA's plan is working to eliminate deer/vehicle collisions, it's also working to eliminate deer/eyeball collisions.

I have come in from my lease in Tallapoosa county on Saturday night every time I've hunted there this year. This may sound like b.s. but out of all the trips home, 3 hours worth of driving (not interstate) I've seen 2 deer. 15 trips.....


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268693
01/22/12 08:14 PM
01/22/12 08:14 PM
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LA
sloughfoot Offline
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LA
Most of the propery near ours is leased to hunt, but not all of it. There are a few small blocks that get hunted on a limited basis. Everyone that hunts around us shoots with little to no restriction. I hunt in central alabama, south of montgomery. I have killed two bucks and two does on just over 200 acres.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268694
01/22/12 08:15 PM
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Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
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Boxes Cove
Fur, I' ve got some good neigbors and a small area with not so good. Most of our neighbors kill does at about the same amount per acre as we do. The farmers in the area get crop damage permits and whack some in the summer. I was seeing does in bow season, then when gun season opened very few. Then during pre rut it was like flipping a switch, I started seeing plenty. Guess it was food, rut,weather combo got them moving. Business as usual on my place this year. Shot one this AM, would have got # 2 if she'd stood still bout 2 more seconds.

Last edited by 2Dogs; 01/22/12 09:17 PM.


"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268750
01/22/12 08:50 PM
01/22/12 08:50 PM
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Land of the free because of th...
mike35549 Offline
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Land of the free because of th...
I think the areas of the state that were overpopulated needed a more liberal doe season. I use to hunt right on the Tombigbee river and by this time of year the woods look like a cow pasture with a browse line. In other parts of the state like where I live in Walker Co. they have never been over populated but when they extended doe season the people here started killing does just like they did in other places. The result in places that were overpopulated is less deer which was good but at some time you have to stop reducing the herd. Here where I live the result is so few deer that it makes hunting not very enjoyable. The DMAP program is not an effective tool in places where the majority of people hunt properties less than 500 acres.


If you're gonna be stupid you better be tough.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268809
01/22/12 09:35 PM
01/22/12 09:35 PM
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West Alabama
Ant67 Offline
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West Alabama
I've hunted a 600 acre tract below centreville for about 17 years. In the beginning I rarely.hunted in the mornings without seeing 15 plus deer. 7 years ago in the "big" field I saw 36 deer at one time. I have hunted that same field three times this year and have only seen one deer. I hunted a nice field tonite that has not been hunted all season and saw nothing. I go 3 or 4 days on some fields without a pic. I am sure I have seen less than 10 deer all year. This is not a one year problem and it is a serious one.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268833
01/22/12 09:49 PM
01/22/12 09:49 PM
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PDL, Fl
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timbercruiser Offline
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I'm worried more about the dang coyotes killing untold numbers of fawns than I am a hunter shooting a couple of sausage nannies.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: mike35549] #268835
01/22/12 09:52 PM
01/22/12 09:52 PM
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Warrior River Country
49er Offline
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49er  Offline
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Warrior River Country
mike35549,
Quote:
The DMAP program is not an effective tool in places where the majority of people hunt properties less than 500 acres.


DMAP was designed for people on small properties to co-operate with each other to kill only the numbers of does needed to keep the population from increasing at an undersireable rate. It is a very effective tool if the people on those small parcels join together and give it a chance to work. The limit is set for a designated area instead of allowing an individual limit for each hunter.

There is one thing about deer management that is undeniable... killing does in large enough numbers works to reduce a deer population.

Kill one doe this year and there will be at least two deer less in the population next year. Three less if she would have had twins. It adds up quickly in an area of low population density, and it takes time to recover if too many are taken out.

I've hunted in an area of low population density all my life. I've gone weeks during deer season without seeing a single deer when I was growing up. I don't want to go back to those days.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268843
01/22/12 10:02 PM
01/22/12 10:02 PM
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Slidell, La
perchjerker Offline
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If you guys are so worried how many does did you kill this year?
Deer management begins with YOU using trigger finger control !


Thomas Jefferson. The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.

Life is too short to only hunt and fish on weekends!

If being a dumbass was fatal some of you would be on your death bed!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: perchjerker] #268847
01/22/12 10:04 PM
01/22/12 10:04 PM
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Warrior River Country
49er Offline
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I've killed none.

I let all I've seen walk because I think they needed to. I've encouraged the other members to lighten up as well. Most of them have.

I've let a few shooter bucks walk too. Fewer does means fewer bucks will be taking their place.

I might have faults, but nobody who knows me has ever accused me of not having trigger control.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268853
01/22/12 10:10 PM
01/22/12 10:10 PM
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Marshall County
Auburn_03 Offline
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Marshall County
I have seen less deer this year than in years past. I do remember in 2009 we had an extremely wet winter similar to this year and our deer sightings were lower than normal. I think it has more to do with the weather this year than hunters shooting to many does.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: cgardner] #268856
01/22/12 10:12 PM
01/22/12 10:12 PM
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Birmingham
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truedouble Offline
14 point
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Joined: Feb 2004
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Birmingham
for us it's been the exact opposite. More does in game camera pictures than ever before and although I haven't run the final numbers from our hunting log I'm going to guess we saw as many or more does than any other season in the past. We are in NE Bama and have never really had a doe problem, but years ago the buck to doe ratio was pretty bad. We try to kill 10-12 every season and this year we've killed 10 so far but have had more opportunities than ever before to kill them on foodplots but didn't cause we like to limit doe kills on plots. A lot of our neighbors only kill bucks so I guess we also should try to make up for their lack of doe kills. That being said not sure NE Bama is a good representation of Alabama's hunting situation in general (less deer, earlier rut, etc.)

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #268863
01/22/12 10:19 PM
01/22/12 10:19 PM
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Hoover
burbank Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hogwild
Last Sunday afternoon, my wife wanted to just go 'riding-around' on the backroads. It was warm and I didn't feel like going hunting. So, we loaded up around 3:00 pm and just slowly rode backroads. We went down Hwy 154 through the Chilton community, then through the Lower Road (dirt) out to Hwy 84 and then to Coffeeville. We left Coffeeville on Hwy 69 and came then turned back up the Tallahatta Rd to midway and then back thru there to the house. It was just after dark when we got home. We saw 1 (one) doe the entire trip!!!! And she crossed the road very near my house right as we were getting home.

In recent years past, at this time of the year, we would have thought it unusual to have not seen 15-20. 20 years ago, we would have seen well over 100. I know we WERE overpopulated at one time. BUT, it has not been in the past 6-8 years!!!


I hunt in the Chilton community. I average seeing 5-6 does per hunt if I do my part. Now keep in mind this is a low pressure situation. The place was LOADED in the 80s.

I started hunting with my late father n law around 05. The numbers have seemed to fluctuate some based on my time in the woods. Oddly enough, Im not seeing any bachelor groups this year. When I put out buck urine, does come looking for him.

I actually may need to kill a few more.

That being said, I have always been for moderation. I never kill more than 2-3 per year, less if I am lucky enough to take a buck.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268870
01/22/12 10:24 PM
01/22/12 10:24 PM
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burbank Offline
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And FYI, the yotes are out of control.

I'm sure this is not helping.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268880
01/22/12 10:36 PM
01/22/12 10:36 PM
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Jefferson
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Fun4all Offline
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Jefferson
Since Tallapoosa County went to a permit dog hunting system the pressure on and around the property that I hunt has reduced dramatically, therefore, I am seeing and getting photos of more deer including does. However, from hunting on that property for 12 years the deer numbers have always been low and from my perspective Tallapoosa County or at the northern part should not have had more than a partial season.

Nothing against people hunting with dogs, just a problem with the specific people that were hunting everybody's properties that they did not have permission to hunt with their dogs. Also, now there is a person living on the property and it keeps the neighbors (dog hunters mentioned above) off the property.

I have not killed a doe on that property since 2007 and the one I killed that year was with a bow. However, I did miss a doe this past Monday with a handgun, killed a sapling though!


"After all, it is not the killing that brings satisfaction; it is the contest of skill and cunning. The true hunter counts his achievement in proportion to the effort involved and the fairness of the sport." Dr. Saxton Pope
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 49er] #268882
01/22/12 10:36 PM
01/22/12 10:36 PM
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Land of the free because of th...
mike35549 Offline
12 point
mike35549  Offline
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Land of the free because of th...
Originally Posted By: 49er
mike35549,
Quote:
The DMAP program is not an effective tool in places where the majority of people hunt properties less than 500 acres.


DMAP was designed for people on small properties to coopertate with each other to kill only the numbers of does needed to keep the population from increasing at an undersireable rate. It is a very effective tool if the people on those small parcels join together and give it a chance to work. The limit is set for a designated area instead of allowing an individual limit for each hunter.


It is hard enough to get the people in one club to agree on this. Getting the people on 5 or 6 adjoining properties to agree would be almost impossible. But would be nice if you could.


If you're gonna be stupid you better be tough.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #268981
01/23/12 04:44 AM
01/23/12 04:44 AM
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War Eagle, USA
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Bucktrot Offline
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War Eagle, USA
At some point, hunters have to put their desire for a healthy deer herd above their desire to burn powder.

Are too many does being killed in some areas? I would say yes. Are not enough does being killed in other areas? I would say yes to that too.

We have cut back on our doe harvest b/c of our huge increase of yotes. Packs of them in every direction sound off at dusk!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #269020
01/23/12 08:08 AM
01/23/12 08:08 AM
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On The Move
rackdisaster Offline
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I Hunt primarily Winston, also in Marion and Fayette Counties. Most tracts of land are 80 to 300 acres of private land. I'm not in a club. Game cam pics were way down this year but they are all located on food plots. I have seen as many deer this year as ever in the woods. They did not use our food plots except during the nighttime. I have hunted 60 plus days most days all day long. I have no complaints.


May The Odds Be Ever In Your Favor
'The Hunger Games'
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #269021
01/23/12 08:16 AM
01/23/12 08:16 AM
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Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
14 point
bigt  Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hogwild
I have seen more people NOT hunt this year than EVER before.

Kids don't want to go and not see anything.
Older people, like my Uncles, who are not able to get around like they used to and hunt the way it takes to even see deer nowadays are getting very dis0interested as well.



I think the liberal doe season is one of the main reason kids are not as interested in hunting as much as they used to be. When they go hunting for a few weekends and do not see a deer they soon find something more interesting to do with thier friends.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269027
01/23/12 08:22 AM
01/23/12 08:22 AM
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Thomasville, AL
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Hogwild Offline
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Thomasville, AL
In my personal experience, I am certain that is the case bigt!

Heck; I don't even like to hunt and not see anything!

There was a happy medium that we passed about 6 or 8 years ago in our area.

The "can't shoot enough does" mentality is SO ingrained in people nowadays, though.....that grown men that have NEVER set foot on, or even near, the property that you hunt on will get on this forum and bash you for not knowing how to hunt, being a consumer of wildlife or some other QDM BS while telling you how irresponsible you are to NOT being trying to shoot more when you tell them how few there are!!!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: timbercruiser] #269030
01/23/12 08:26 AM
01/23/12 08:26 AM
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Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
14 point
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Originally Posted By: timbercruiser
I'm worried more about the dang coyotes killing untold numbers of fawns than I am a hunter shooting a couple of sausage nannies.


I agree but with both going on your are asking for big trouble. It is easier to control hunters than coyotes.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 49er] #269034
01/23/12 08:29 AM
01/23/12 08:29 AM
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Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
14 point
bigt  Offline
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Gulfcrest
Originally Posted By: 49er
mike35549,
Quote:
The DMAP program is not an effective tool in places where the majority of people hunt properties less than 500 acres.


DMAP was designed for people on small properties to coopertate with each other to kill only the numbers of does needed to keep the population from increasing at an undersireable rate. It is a very effective tool if the people on those small parcels join together and give it a chance to work. The limit is set for a designated area instead of allowing an individual limit for each hunter.

And there is the problem getting surrounding landowners to cooperate. My experience is you can not convince the people with small tracts of land to cooperate around here.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: perchjerker] #269035
01/23/12 08:31 AM
01/23/12 08:31 AM
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Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
14 point
bigt  Offline
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Gulfcrest
Originally Posted By: perchjerker
If you guys are so worried how many does did you kill this year?
Deer management begins with YOU using trigger finger control !

I personally have not shot a doe in three years so I think I have full contol of my trigger finger.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: bigt] #269036
01/23/12 08:31 AM
01/23/12 08:31 AM
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Thomasville, AL
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Hogwild Offline
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Originally Posted By: bigt
Originally Posted By: timbercruiser
I'm worried more about the dang coyotes killing untold numbers of fawns than I am a hunter shooting a couple of sausage nannies.


I agree but with both going on your are asking for big trouble. It is easier to control hunters than coyotes.


EXACTLY!!!

The ones that the yotes kill are dead and gone too!!!!

That HAS to be factored in!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269053
01/23/12 09:08 AM
01/23/12 09:08 AM
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abolt300 Offline
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Here's something to think about. I've been complaining cause we simply are not seeing deer in daylight hours on my lease in Covington county. Not getting too specific but its well over 1,000 acres and only 4 of us hunt it. Pressure is not an issue. We've killed 3 mature bucks, 3 does, 2 hogs. Tracks and sign everywhere so the deer are still there and we're all very experienced hunters and just not seeing them. There is something going on this year in the SE with the deer herds. I live in FL and work just across the AL line so I drive through 20 miles of Eglin AFB property every day, morning and night going to a from work. Eglin allows limited hunting and absolutely no does. I was thinking this morning on the way in that I have not seen a deer on the side of the road in the past 45-60 days morning or night. In a normal year, I'll see 2-3 in each morning driving north and generally 7-12 at night on the way home, bucks and does. Let me stress this point, no does are being killed at Eglin and the majority of the land I am driving through is closed to all hunting. Once again, i have not seen a deer on the way to or from work in the past 2 months. Warm weather, abundant natural browse, good acorn production, EHD, coyotes, who the heck knows but it is not just due to hunting pressure and doe harvest. My opinion is there is something else behind it and I'd sure like to know what it is. The deer just are not moving during daylight hours.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269054
01/23/12 09:15 AM
01/23/12 09:15 AM
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Shuter II Offline
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Used to be Taboo to shoot a doe. Now all the young kids that get in a stand with their Dad's want to shoot the first doe that steps out.

Most every kid that's mature enough (supposedly) to sit by himself, will shoot a doe.

Overall, the mentality has changed. I don't like it.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269060
01/23/12 09:25 AM
01/23/12 09:25 AM
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Thomasville, AL
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Hogwild Offline
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The huge reduction in the deer herd combined with the greatly reduced fawn recruitment rates has created a situation where there are very few 'hungry' deer. With the thick cover and large expanses of managed properties, along with numerous food plots (take a look at an aerial view on Bing maps!) deer simply do NOT have to move during daylight hours OR move very far when they do move.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269070
01/23/12 09:34 AM
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Slidell, La
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I suggest clubs tell members to please continue to hunt till it gets too hot. Hunt and kill every yote they can ! Kill as many as possible before the fawns drop next time. Dogs take a toll on fawns too. Uncollared dogs running deer need to be killed also.


Thomas Jefferson. The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.

Life is too short to only hunt and fish on weekends!

If being a dumbass was fatal some of you would be on your death bed!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: perchjerker] #269082
01/23/12 09:42 AM
01/23/12 09:42 AM
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Shuter II Offline
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Originally Posted By: perchjerker
I suggest clubs tell members to please continue to hunt till it gets too hot. Hunt and kill every yote they can ! Kill as many as possible before the fawns drop next time. Dogs take a toll on fawns too. Uncollared dogs running deer need to be killed also.


Keep in mind that they are breeding shortly and will have pups late April into May. The males bring food to the females tending the little ones in the den.

The males will hunting hard at that time............

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: abolt300] #269170
01/23/12 11:35 AM
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bigt Offline
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Originally Posted By: abolt300
Here's something to think about. I've been complaining cause we simply are not seeing deer in daylight hours on my lease in Covington county. Not getting too specific but its well over 1,000 acres and only 4 of us hunt it. Pressure is not an issue. We've killed 3 mature bucks, 3 does, 2 hogs. Tracks and sign everywhere so the deer are still there and we're all very experienced hunters and just not seeing them. There is something going on this year in the SE with the deer herds. I live in FL and work just across the AL line so I drive through 20 miles of Eglin AFB property every day, morning and night going to a from work. Eglin allows limited hunting and absolutely no does. I was thinking this morning on the way in that I have not seen a deer on the side of the road in the past 45-60 days morning or night. In a normal year, I'll see 2-3 in each morning driving north and generally 7-12 at night on the way home, bucks and does. Let me stress this point, no does are being killed at Eglin and the majority of the land I am driving through is closed to all hunting. Once again, i have not seen a deer on the way to or from work in the past 2 months. Warm weather, abundant natural browse, good acorn production, EHD, coyotes, who the heck knows but it is not just due to hunting pressure and doe harvest. My opinion is there is something else behind it and I'd sure like to know what it is. The deer just are not moving during daylight hours.


When I say that too many does are being killed in the areas I hunt I am not basing my opinion on merely deer sightings but also on camera observations, harvest data and usage cages on food plots. It also should be based not on one year but over a multi year time period.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269194
01/23/12 11:58 AM
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Horton, Al. Marshall Co.
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tim1980 Offline
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I used to be of the mentality of whack em and stack em on does. I hunt in Jackson Co. But now I think we need to let of on the does. I do see more buck sign than I use to and a more pronounce Rut. I think the limit should be 3 does and 3 bucks per season, 1 for 1.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269382
01/23/12 03:56 PM
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Land of the free because of th...
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I haven't killed a doe in 10 years but know a guy that killed 10 this year he hunts three different 40 acre blocks. To me that is just ignorant.


If you're gonna be stupid you better be tough.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269385
01/23/12 03:58 PM
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Hogwild Offline
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I gotta side with 49'er on this one........

It is very hypocritical of the ALDCNR to place a limit on the number of bucks that can be harvested by an individual while allowing 2 does a day the entire Season to be harvested by everyone who wants to go hunting!!!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #269410
01/23/12 04:26 PM
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Land of the free because of th...
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Originally Posted By: Hogwild
I gotta side with 49'er on this one........

It is very hypocritical of the ALDCNR to place a limit on the number of bucks that can be harvested by an individual while allowing 2 does a day the entire Season to be harvested by everyone who wants to go hunting!!!


I agree I think the doe limit should be what ever the buck limit is. So in this case it should be 3 does per season.


If you're gonna be stupid you better be tough.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 49er] #269413
01/23/12 04:33 PM
01/23/12 04:33 PM
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Clem Offline
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Quote:
DMAP was designed for people on small properties to coopertate with each other to kill only the numbers of does needed to keep the population from increasing at an undersireable rate. It is a very effective tool if the people on those small parcels join together and give it a chance to work. The limit is set for a designated area instead of allowing an individual limit for each hunter.


Cooperatives among neighboring landowners are encouraged by QDMA as part of a management strategy that encompasses many aspects including habitat, killing bucks and does, etc.

They can work well when the cooperating landowners can agree on mutually-beneficial strategies. But it takes someone making that first offer for discussion to see if the idea will take root and then flourish.


"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter

"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013

"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #269422
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The "can't shoot enough does" mentality is SO ingrained in people nowadays, though.....that grown men that have NEVER set foot on, or even near, the property that you hunt on will get on this forum and bash you for not knowing how to hunt, being a consumer of wildlife or some other QDM BS while telling you how irresponsible you are to NOT being trying to shoot more when you tell them how few there are!!![/quote]
HogWild.
You hit the nail on the head. I agree 110 %

Last edited by leroycnbucks; 01/23/12 04:51 PM.

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Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269434
01/23/12 05:06 PM
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South Alabama
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On places that are well managed and have been for the last few decadea, the population has not changed much and the current regs are working well. Many NEED the ability to kill 2 does a day - I did last week.
On places that were overpopulated, the numbers are down significantly - actually kinda nice since if it is WAY down, gives the habitat a chance to recover. However, in light of the down numbers and fawn predation, hunters should exercise restraint. They have the option of NOT killing 2 does a day. On places that were underpopulated it probably has not changed much and the hunters there should have been and should now, exercise restraint in harvest. They still have that option.


I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: gobbler] #269437
01/23/12 05:08 PM
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Thomasville, AL
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Hogwild Offline
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Originally Posted By: gobbler
On places that are well managed and have been for the last few decadea, the population has not changed much and the current regs are working well. Many NEED the ability to kill 2 does a day - I did last week.
On places that were overpopulated, the numbers are down significantly - actually kinda nice since if it is WAY down, gives the habitat a chance to recover. However, in light of the down numbers and fawn predation, hunters should exercise restraint. They have the option of NOT killing 2 does a day. On places that were underpopulated it probably has not changed much and the hunters there should have been and should now, exercise restraint in harvest. They still have that option.


Just take a moment and imagine the irony of that post........

People HAD the option to not kill more than 3 bucks. Heck, they had the option to not kill ANY!!!

Why the different viewpoint based solely on the sex and number of antler points of the animal???

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269439
01/23/12 05:13 PM
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Clem Offline
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Because no one pursues or brags about their "trophy does."


"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter

"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013

"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: bigt] #269442
01/23/12 05:15 PM
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Marshall County
FurFlyin Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: bigt
When I say that too many does are being killed in the areas I hunt I am not basing my opinion on merely deer sightings but also on camera observations, harvest data and usage cages on food plots. It also should be based not on one year but over a multi year time period.


That is very true. I specifically posted what I have seen this year, but it's been going on for several years. I was arguing with someone the other day who has been brainwashed into thinking that NOT shooting a doe is bad. They said the deer were just moving at night now. I told him that my cameras run 24/7 and if the deer weren't on my cameras they weren't in that area. I've put up utilization cages here for the past 3 years. There is no more vegetation in the cage than there is outside it. There are many things I am not proficient at, but growing high quality deer forage is not one of them.

A good friend of mine, a member of aldeer who never posts, could tell you a tale about his hunting club that should raise eyebrows with folks besides me. 1200 acres of pristine deer habitat, with no deer sightings by any club member in the last month to 6 weeks and one or 2 sets of tracks in all the greenfields combined, no tracks in the roads, very few if any trail cam pics........ That should be a sign to the state.....


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #269443
01/23/12 05:16 PM
01/23/12 05:16 PM
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Birmingham
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truedouble Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hogwild
Originally Posted By: bigt
Originally Posted By: timbercruiser
I'm worried more about the dang coyotes killing untold numbers of fawns than I am a hunter shooting a couple of sausage nannies.


I agree but with both going on your are asking for big trouble. It is easier to control hunters than coyotes.


EXACTLY!!!

The ones that the yotes kill are dead and gone too!!!!

That HAS to be factored in!


I'm sure most will say I'm wrong or crazy but I'm still not convinced that yotes kill that many deer. We have a pretty big coyote population, more than I like and a lot more than 10 years ago, but that being said I've only seen signs of one deer that appeared to have been killed by a coyote, in 25 years of hunting our land. Further more, we also saw a very large number of fawns this year, more than ever before...probably one fawn for every doe on average. So with such a healthy coyote population it would seem that we would see more sign of fawns being killed through either a carcass or by low fawn numbers.

Along the same lines I did get to watch something pretty cool this year. Early January I was watching 2 bucks chasing several does, about 500 yds below me in the bottom in a sage grass field. After about 30 minutes I noticed 3 yotes running in. It seemed to bother the deer just a small amount for just a few seconds and then the bucks continued to chase the does around. Two of the yotes left and one sat down in the sun for 30 minutes or so and just watched the deer running around. The doe walked to with in 20 yds of the yote several times, both knew the other was there and neither seemed to care about the other. So although this was just one experience on one morning it gave me even more reason to believe that a coyote will not spend it's energy trying to kill a deer unless there is no other food around. I still kill em any time I get a chance cause they do kill quail and poults and probably a fawns every now and again but I think our yotes live off of rabbits for the most part.

Last edited by truedouble; 01/23/12 05:20 PM.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269451
01/23/12 05:28 PM
01/23/12 05:28 PM
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So as deer hunters Furflyin what can or should we do to help in this matter as far as writing letters or calling someone.


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Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269471
01/23/12 05:46 PM
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Coffee Co, AL
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jlccoffee Offline
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Coffee Co, AL
I don't think the problem is with the limit. The problem is with too many people preaching that hunters need to shoot every doe they see. With education, in most cases hunters will make reasonable decisions.

Same can be said for the buck limit. Things were improving before the limit was put in place. Fewer and fewer people were shooting every buck without at least some kind of self imposed standard.

Last edited by jlccoffee; 01/23/12 06:34 PM.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #269472
01/23/12 05:49 PM
01/23/12 05:49 PM
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South Alabama
gobbler Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hogwild


Just take a moment and imagine the irony of that post........

People HAD the option to not kill more than 3 bucks. Heck, they had the option to not kill ANY!!!

Why the different viewpoint based solely on the sex and number of antler points of the animal???


Has nothing to do with the number of points - has LOT to do with the existence (or lack of) a uterus. I will assume that you will agree with me that the population is controlled (increased or decreased) by manipulating the FEMALE component of the herd!? That and what Clem said - antler envy - don't see it much in doe killers.


I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Clem] #269473
01/23/12 05:49 PM
01/23/12 05:49 PM
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Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
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Originally Posted By: Clem
Because no one pursues or brags about their "trophy does."



Oh yes they do I hear people brag about the number of does they kill like it is a badge of honor.

Last edited by bigt; 01/23/12 05:54 PM.

Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269481
01/23/12 05:58 PM
01/23/12 05:58 PM
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southwest alabama
aldoghunter Offline
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southwest alabama
I hunt in Choctaw county,our west border is the Ms.state line,we have +/-12000 acres with 60 members we are 2 does per paid membership,3 bucks.These rules have been in effect since the doe shooting started,we knew it was going to be a problem.The deer herd on our land has not changed much in 20 years,we still see plenty of does and plenty of bucks,the majority of the does have 2 yearlings every year.Over all I would say our deer herd is in good shape.EDUCATION is the key thing here,if you need to thin the does do it,but if not leave them alone.We had some guys from the B'ham area come hunt with us this year,and they had never seen as many deer and deer sign as they did on our club.I have seen the mentality change that some of you are talking about and it is sad.


Be safe & have fun
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: truedouble] #269494
01/23/12 06:18 PM
01/23/12 06:18 PM
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Boxes Cove
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Truedouble, here I go again, I think coyote kill is prolly lower in the moutains of No. East Bama than in LA. Add some timber cutting up here and you got some serious cover. Cover is huge in keeping yotes from killing large numbers of deer. Maybe our yotes are just dumb and lazy.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: jlccoffee] #269497
01/23/12 06:22 PM
01/23/12 06:22 PM
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Yep.
Originally Posted By: jlccoffee
I don't think the problem is with the limit. The problem is with too many people preaching that hunters need to shoot every deer they see. With education, in most cases hunters with make reasonable decisions.

Same can be said for the buck limit. Things were improving before the limit was put in place. Fewer and fewer people were shooting every buck without at least some kind of self imposed standard.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: gobbler] #269500
01/23/12 06:23 PM
01/23/12 06:23 PM
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Thomasville, AL
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Hogwild Offline
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Originally Posted By: gobbler
Originally Posted By: Hogwild


Just take a moment and imagine the irony of that post........

People HAD the option to not kill more than 3 bucks. Heck, they had the option to not kill ANY!!!

Why the different viewpoint based solely on the sex and number of antler points of the animal???


Has nothing to do with the number of points - has LOT to do with the existence (or lack of) a uterus. I will assume that you will agree with me that the population is controlled (increased or decreased) by manipulating the FEMALE component of the herd!? That and what Clem said - antler envy - don't see it much in doe killers.


I ain't trying to be an azz to you!!!!! smile

But, it is ironic that many people feel that the general hunting population is either not educated enough, or lacks the restraint to keep the herd healthy by limiting their buck harvest.......

BUT, then they turn around and give the SAME people credit for being able to determine populations, sex ratios, recruitment rates, etc and then develop meaningful harvest strategies concerning the doe population of the herd!

I envy people who still hunt areas with good numbers AND good quality!

But, down here in my World.....it is DAMN EXPENSIVE to hunt an area where you have realistic expectations of consistently seeing deer and having any semblance of a chance to kill a nice mature buck.

I have hunted AND managed good quality property and seen the results of hard work and management. Shooting every doe you see is NOT what made the places so good!!!!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: leroycnbucks] #269522
01/23/12 06:50 PM
01/23/12 06:50 PM
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Marshall County
FurFlyin Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: leroycnbucks
So as deer hunters Furflyin what can or should we do to help in this matter as far as writing letters or calling someone.


Go to the CAB meetings. They are held in Montgomery. Will be a 3 hour drive for me, but I hope to attend.


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269533
01/23/12 07:02 PM
01/23/12 07:02 PM
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If you only knew.....
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No.... Our rut seems to be getting stronger and stronger over the past three years and we havn't changed how we manage our does or bucks for that matter. We have 1600 acres and and getting better quality and overall hunting. We hunt on the Bullock/ Barbour line and enjoy seeing what is happening with our club.


Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves...

Confucius
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269591
01/23/12 07:59 PM
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Sylacauga, AL
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I haven't seen much change in the numbers of deer we have on the farm in Perry Co. We've had good numbers of deer since the early 90s when some of the big dog hunting clubs went out of business. But there is a total of about 5000 acres surrounding us that is well-managed by large clubs that are practicing QDM. They are killing the right number of does to keep the population stable.

At my house in Coosa Co, there are hardly any deer at all now. The land here is made up of small landowners, and I think way too many does are being killed.

I hate the idea of more regulation, but I think areas of the state that are made up primarily of small landowners need a much more strict doe season. We could go back to the system of the state issuing doe tags to clubs that need them, and having a much shorter doe season overall. That would still allow clubs that need to kill does to kill them, and protect them in places that need protecting.

But the DCNR probably doesn't have the manpower to run that program anymore, and ALFA would be against it, so I doubt it will happen. I've solved the problem for myself by no longer deer hunting in Coosa Co. I suspect that's gonna happen to a lot of people in a lot of places.


All the labor of man is for his mouth, and yet the appetite is not filled.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269634
01/23/12 08:32 PM
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Land of the free because of th...
mike35549 Offline
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If hunters as a whole could manage a deer herd without any laws we would not have to have a deer season or any type of restrictions at all people would just do what was best for the herd. In places where you might have 2 or 3 clubs in one area controlling 5,000 acres a piece and applying the laws with some common sense the way the law is now would be fine. But in places where this is not the case it wont work. It is not working and will never work the way the laws are now. I had a guy that I hunt with that is a fairly knowledgeable hunter ask me why I wasn't killing any does and I said I didn't think we needed to kill more than had already been killed he told me " You know to grow big bucks you have to kill a lot of does and I think we should be killing at least twice as many as we do." This is the mentality of a lot of well intentioned hunters. We killed 4 bucks this year so far that weighed over 200lbs I am certain we are not over populated. As far as coyote there are numerous studies on fawn recruitment rates before and after coyote removal in areas and recruitment rates doubled or better in these areas. If they were not a problem these big pay to hunt places would not hire people to come in and trap them but they do.


If you're gonna be stupid you better be tough.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269650
01/23/12 08:41 PM
01/23/12 08:41 PM
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Fairhope
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joeml18 Offline
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Fairhope
I hunted a piece of property near brewton 2 weeks ago that is 48,000 acres. I got to talking to the land manager and he said that to date they had only shot 120 does This time last year they had shot around 400 does. He said they keep all harvest records and this year was almost identical to 2007. Seems to me that hunting is pretty cyclical with of course different opinions from each area.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269651
01/23/12 08:41 PM
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ATDH Offline
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we so far have killed about 20 8pt or better and there has been alot of buttons that has been killed for does wich would prob put the buck numbers around 30 and we have only killed abount 18 does, sounds like next year is gonna be tough to see any for the club im in

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: mike35549] #269657
01/23/12 08:45 PM
01/23/12 08:45 PM
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Montgomery
WmHunter Offline
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Montgomery
Deer numbers have been declining in many parts
of the Southeast since the Great Drought of
2007. That is also about the time the coyote population
went thru the roof and liberal doe harvest rules skyrocketed
doe harvest.

We used to whack and stack the does like crazy, but when
I saw the results of the 07 Drought converging with coyote
explosion (read fawn wipe out) we simply stopped killing
does for population control; we just shoot a couple for the
freezer.

People have to adjust what they are doing based on what
they are/aren't seeing.

Have to say this though: this has been a VERY warm winter.
No cold days to speak of. That always means less daytime deer
movement. La Nina sux.



"The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson

" Chuck Sykes is a dictator control freak like Vladimir Putin " WmHunter

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: jlccoffee] #269680
01/23/12 09:02 PM
01/23/12 09:02 PM
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Montgomery
WmHunter Offline
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Montgomery
Originally Posted By: jlccoffee
I don't think the problem is with the limit. The problem is with too many people preaching that hunters need to shoot every doe they see. With education, in most cases hunters will make reasonable decisions.



yep

Last edited by WmHunter; 01/23/12 09:03 PM.

"The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #269682
01/23/12 09:04 PM
01/23/12 09:04 PM
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Montgomery
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Originally Posted By: Hogwild
I gotta side with 49'er on this one........

It is very hypocritical of the ALDCNR to place a limit on the number of bucks that can be harvested by an individual while allowing 2 does a day the entire Season to be harvested by everyone who wants to go hunting!!!


yep


"The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson

" Chuck Sykes is a dictator control freak like Vladimir Putin " WmHunter

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: poorcountrypreacher] #269738
01/23/12 09:57 PM
01/23/12 09:57 PM
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Birmingham
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Originally Posted By: poorcountrypreacher
I haven't seen much change in the numbers of deer we have on the farm in Perry Co. We've had good numbers of deer since the early 90s when some of the big dog hunting clubs went out of business. But there is a total of about 5000 acres surrounding us that is well-managed by large clubs that are practicing QDM. They are killing the right number of does to keep the population stable.

At my house in Coosa Co, there are hardly any deer at all now. The land here is made up of small landowners, and I think way too many does are being killed.

I hate the idea of more regulation, but I think areas of the state that are made up primarily of small landowners need a much more strict doe season. We could go back to the system of the state issuing doe tags to clubs that need them, and having a much shorter doe season overall. That would still allow clubs that need to kill does to kill them, and protect them in places that need protecting.

But the DCNR probably doesn't have the manpower to run that program anymore, and ALFA would be against it, so I doubt it will happen. I've solved the problem for myself by no longer deer hunting in Coosa Co. I suspect that's gonna happen to a lot of people in a lot of places.


surely you aren't suggesting that practicing QDM works... wink

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Hogwild] #269791
01/23/12 10:45 PM
01/23/12 10:45 PM
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T-Town
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Originally Posted By: Hogwild
The huge reduction in the deer herd combined with the greatly reduced fawn recruitment rates has created a situation where there are very few 'hungry' deer. With the thick cover and large expanses of managed properties, along with numerous food plots (take a look at an aerial view on Bing maps!) deer simply do NOT have to move during daylight hours OR move very far when they do move.


Agree!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269936
01/24/12 09:02 AM
01/24/12 09:02 AM
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Sylacauga, AL
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>>>surely you aren't suggesting that practicing QDM works...<<<

Whaddayamean? I've always believed that QDM works when applied over a large area.

I wasn't for the unenforceable buck limit because I didn't think IT would work. But that's a different argument. wink


All the labor of man is for his mouth, and yet the appetite is not filled.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269964
01/24/12 09:50 AM
01/24/12 09:50 AM
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Clarksville, TN /Greenville, ...
bill Offline
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Its always something. Most years hunters are complaining that the rut is in Feb. And they don't see any bucks.

This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.


"Political debate: when charlatans come together to discuss their principles"
-
Bauvard
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #269984
01/24/12 10:27 AM
01/24/12 10:27 AM
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Hoover
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I suppose I'm one of the fortunate ones. I see several does every time I hunt our farm. We're in west AL. We have 200 acres of pasture, with cattle, 100 acres of 7 yo pines and 150 acres of ancient hardwood creekbottom. But, we're also landlocked and all the surrounding property is hunted heavily. We only hunt 5-10 man/days per month with two of us being the only ones hunting.
What I don't see is bucks older than 2.5 yo.
Personally, I don't have any complaints about the liberal doe season.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: bill] #269986
01/24/12 10:29 AM
01/24/12 10:29 AM
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Boxes Cove
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Originally Posted By: bill
Its always something. Most years hunters are complaining that the rut is in Feb. And they don't see any bucks.

This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.

I'll agree with ya on this one.^^^^



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: bill] #270017
01/24/12 11:42 AM
01/24/12 11:42 AM
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Gulfcrest
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Originally Posted By: bill
Its always something. Most years hunters are complaining that the rut is in Feb. And they don't see any bucks.

This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.


Where I hunt the rut is and has always been the last week of Jan into feb not complaining just a fact that even fetus studies support. No more bucks have been killed in my area than the usual amount and our doe population has been on a steady decline for the last five years. These are not new complaints just the same old facts.I do not think we need to see 20 does on a food plot but I do think that somewhere in the middle is the right answer and allowing two does a day the whole season is not middle ground.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 2Dogs] #270078
01/24/12 01:31 PM
01/24/12 01:31 PM
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Birmingham
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Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
Originally Posted By: bill
Its always something. Most years hunters are complaining that the rut is in Feb. And they don't see any bucks.

This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.

I'll agree with ya on this one.^^^^


Hit the nail on the head. First point is I have also heard from numerous people that hunt anywhere from Union Town, to Selma to Montgomery that the bucks started chasing around the first week in January, which is a couple of weeks early. Second point, I never hear about extending the season from people in LA that have well managed land with low pressure cause they usually kill their fill of mature bucks by the end of the season. For what it's worth I think there is a general opinion that in most of LA the bucks don't get cranked up until the very end of the month and way into Feb. b/c the land is either not managed properly (buck to doe ratio is way off) or there is a lot of pressure so most of the rutting activity is done at night.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270109
01/24/12 02:47 PM
01/24/12 02:47 PM
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Coffee Co, AL
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There is intense rutting activity on the property I hunt right now. Much more intense than I ever saw when I hunted primarily in Georgia. Most of the deer movement I am seeing in the last week is around 10am so they do not appear to be moving mostly at night. I kill enough deer every year to be satisfied and if the season was later, I doubt I would kill any more than I already do.

I'm for hunting on into February in South Alabama.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270125
01/24/12 03:25 PM
01/24/12 03:25 PM
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Cleburne
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I agree we need to stop the doe slaughter. I at least like to see deer when deer hunting. There's not much sport in sitting in a killing house & shooting does off a killing field with 500 magnum rifles. It's going to get much worse when baiting is allowed. There won't be any does left. Hunting will go back to the way it was in the 60's & 70's when folks talked about seeing a deer track for days. The herd needs to be managed, not exterminated.


"When you've stared down the barrel of a shotgun in your own home, 3rd & 20 don't seem too bad"......Ken "Snake" Stabler
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: bill] #270183
01/24/12 04:57 PM
01/24/12 04:57 PM
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Over Yonder
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Clem Offline
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Quote:
This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


Society wants it all:

--Giant bucks
-- Seeing numbers every time they go hunting "like the good 'ol days"
-- Watching "the rut" (which is the chasing phase, b/c that's fun to watch)

-- State DNRs "leaving us ALONE!!!!"
-- State DNRs "doing something about 'everyone' killing 'everything' that moves

-- Game Wardens should stay the hell away (and Marine Police, too)!
-- Game Wardens should come catch my poachers now but they're doing something else!

-- Cooperation would help with deer management
-- Neighbors slay everything and won't cooperate

-- Season's too long
-- Season's not long enough

-- Doe slaughter has to stop
-- Don't need more regulations telling me about killing does or bucks

-- State biologists aren't concerned about (whatever issue)
-- State biologists don't know shix about (whatever issue)
-- State biologists have been hiding data about (whatever issue)
-- State biologist helped our club and is a good ol' guy

-- You're not a hunter if you don't use (whatever weapon)
-- Let's all get along and support one another and hunting

-- Get kids in the outdoors!
-- Sorry, we don't allow squirrel or rabbit hunting anywhere on our property until after deer season ends

-- Gots a damn problem with hogs!
-- Sorry, we don't allow anyone on our property due to liability

-- We need to kill some does early in the season
-- Sorry, we don't allow anyone outside the club unless you pay club dues and it also counts against one of my two 'visits' so ... sorry.

Ad nauseum ...


"Hunting Politics are stupid!" - Farm Hunter

"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013

"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270197
01/24/12 05:11 PM
01/24/12 05:11 PM
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Missouri
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Good post Clem!


It takes a long time to grow an old friend.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Clem] #270203
01/24/12 05:24 PM
01/24/12 05:24 PM
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Boxes Cove
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Great post Clem, you hit all the nails!



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: truedouble] #270220
01/24/12 05:52 PM
01/24/12 05:52 PM
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Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
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Originally Posted By: truedouble
Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
Originally Posted By: bill
Its always something. Most years hunters are complaining that the rut is in Feb. And they don't see any bucks.

This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.

I'll agree with ya on this one.^^^^


Hit the nail on the head. First point is I have also heard from numerous people that hunt anywhere from Union Town, to Selma to Montgomery that the bucks started chasing around the first week in January, which is a couple of weeks early.


None of the places you named is anywhere close to what I call LA just sayn..........

Last edited by bigt; 01/24/12 05:52 PM.

Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: truedouble] #270229
01/24/12 05:56 PM
01/24/12 05:56 PM
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Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
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Gulfcrest
Originally Posted By: truedouble
Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
Originally Posted By: bill
Its always something. Most years hunters are complaining that the rut is in Feb. And they don't see any bucks.

This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.

I'll agree with ya on this one.^^^^


For what it's worth I think there is a general opinion that in most of LA the bucks don't get cranked up until the very end of the month and way into Feb. b/c the land is either not managed properly (buck to doe ratio is way off) or there is a lot of pressure so most of the rutting activity is done at night.


It ain't worth much because the land I hunt on is and has been managed by a wildlife biologist hired by our landowner for over ten years with very little hunting pressure and the rut has always and looks like always will be the last week of Jan and on into Feb.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270231
01/24/12 05:56 PM
01/24/12 05:56 PM
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Over Yonder
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Clem Offline
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So, "lower Alabama" wouldn't be anywhere near Montgomery, Selma or Uniontown?

What's "lower" ... Baldwin County?


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"Bible says you shouldn't put sugar in your cornbread." Dustin, 2013

"Best I can figure 97.365% of the general public is a paint chip eating, mouth breathing, certified dumbass." BCLC, 2020
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Clem] #270241
01/24/12 06:01 PM
01/24/12 06:01 PM
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Gulfcrest
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Originally Posted By: Clem
So, "lower Alabama" wouldn't be anywhere near Montgomery, Selma or Uniontown?

What's "lower" ... Baldwin County?



Well that is definitely lower Alabama but I would add Mobile too at least! But seriously no Montgomery is not lower Alabama.It is lower than you are but its over three hours away by interstate from my home in lower Alabama. wink

Last edited by bigt; 01/24/12 06:07 PM.

Life is too short to be small !!

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Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270278
01/24/12 06:55 PM
01/24/12 06:55 PM
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McCalla, AL
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Well, I will say that I never have shot more than one or two does in a season. And neither have the folks in our club. And probably not the folks around us. As a matter of fact, i don't know anybody that waylays does the way some of ya'll are making it sound. Maybe I just run in the wrong circles.

If anything, I think my property has too many does. We always get four to five does on camera for every buck we get. This year I definitely haven't seen the number of does that I've seen in the past, but I saw more once I got out of the shooting houses and started trying to figure out where they were. Turns out they were using natural browse this year and not our food plots. After we changed strategies we saw more does. And as far as the rut, after ten years hunting my place in Dallas county, I've seen the rut occur anywhere from the week after Christmas into early February. If it were up to me I'd move season back a month, but if they don't, I won't be crushed. I still kill a deer or two every year and enjoy getting out there. I see far more than I shoot.

If ya'll want to go back to having three or four doe days a year thats fine by me. Won't affect the way i hunt in the least since I don't usually shoot many anyway. I am amazed though how folks seem to want to make a one size fits all rule based on "what I'm seeing on my place this year." AND wanting the state to regulate it even though the general consensus is that we all want less government and more control over our own lives.


"We sleep safe in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm."

George Orwell
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: bill] #270287
01/24/12 06:59 PM
01/24/12 06:59 PM
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Marshall County
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Originally Posted By: bill
I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.


I don't expect to ever see 20 in a green field again. Don't need to see 20. I'd be happy if my son could see a deer or three at least 50% of the time. I agree that the answer is in the middle, but we are nowhere near there. Good bucks are killed every year. As each year goes by it seems that the average hunter becomes a better steward of wildlife by providing better food and better habitat. That produces better bucks. A deer herd that is below the carrying capacity should remain relatively healthy and produce large racked bucks. If the area you have can provide high quality browse and habitat to easily carry 50 deer per square mile, that area will produce no larger deer than if it had 25 deer per square mile.


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270342
01/24/12 07:53 PM
01/24/12 07:53 PM
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Thomasville, AL
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Thomasville, AL
For all the nay-sayers.......

Just a simple test!

Go to a local, well-established deer processor that has been in existence for a minimum of 6-8 yrs.
Ask him a few questions:

1) How are your overall numbers compared to years past?
2) What is the estimated buck:doe ratio of the deer brought in?
3) What has been the consensus opinion on the deer herd by the hunters who visit?
And for fun!!!
4) What percentage of the deer brought in have corn in them??

Now, I know full well that 'everybody' doesn't have their deer processed.
BUT, it does provide a good comparison and 'real-world' opinions!!!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: bigt] #270399
01/24/12 08:54 PM
01/24/12 08:54 PM
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Montgomery
WmHunter Offline
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Montgomery
Originally Posted By: bigt
Originally Posted By: truedouble
Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
Originally Posted By: bill
Its always something. Most years hunters are complaining that the rut is in Feb. And they don't see any bucks.

This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.

I'll agree with ya on this one.^^^^


Hit the nail on the head. First point is I have also heard from numerous people that hunt anywhere from Union Town, to Selma to Montgomery that the bucks started chasing around the first week in January, which is a couple of weeks early.


None of the places you named is anywhere close to what I call LA just sayn..........


Anybody who says the rut begins ANYWHERE in Montgomery County
in early January is full of chit. Ours hasn't even started yet and it is Jan. 24. No seeking, no monitoring, no chasing no nothing. Zip. Zero, Nada. Rarely see a chase and never before the last 3 or 4 days of January. It has always been like that in our area. AND DESPITE MASSIVE DOE KILLING AND
QDM THE TIMING AND INTENSITY HAS NOT CHANGED ONE IOTA.

Never even heard anyone claim an early January rut for
Montgomery County.


"The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson

" Chuck Sykes is a dictator control freak like Vladimir Putin " WmHunter

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: WmHunter] #270410
01/24/12 09:04 PM
01/24/12 09:04 PM
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Clarksville, TN /Greenville, ...
bill Offline
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Really? Because I've been hunting a 600 acre bow only club out on 13 bridges rd and they have been wide open since first week of January and several monsters have been killed chasing.


"Political debate: when charlatans come together to discuss their principles"
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Bauvard
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270426
01/24/12 09:16 PM
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I think a matter of mere miles can make a big difference.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: WmHunter] #270431
01/24/12 09:22 PM
01/24/12 09:22 PM
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Originally Posted By: WmHunter
Originally Posted By: bigt
Originally Posted By: truedouble
Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
Originally Posted By: bill
Its always something. Most years hunters are complaining that the rut is in Feb. And they don't see any bucks.

This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.

I'll agree with ya on this one.^^^^


Hit the nail on the head. First point is I have also heard from numerous people that hunt anywhere from Union Town, to Selma to Montgomery that the bucks started chasing around the first week in January, which is a couple of weeks early.


None of the places you named is anywhere close to what I call LA just sayn..........


Anybody who says the rut begins ANYWHERE in Montgomery County
in early January is full of chit. Ours hasn't even started yet and it is Jan. 24. No seeking, no monitoring, no chasing no nothing. Zip. Zero, Nada. Rarely see a chase and never before the last 3 or 4 days of January. It has always been like that in our area. AND DESPITE MASSIVE DOE KILLING AND
QDM THE TIMING AND INTENSITY HAS NOT CHANGED ONE IOTA.

Never even heard anyone claim an early January rut for
Montgomery County.


Really? I've seen bucks chasing does since between Christmas & New Years Day. In fact, they're starting to wind down a little. I did see a terrible fight yesterday between two vicious spikes.

My son killed a nice 8 on New Years day walking across a green field and grunting with each step. Neck swollen, leg glands stinking......... Is that signs of rut? LOL

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: burbank] #270449
01/24/12 09:52 PM
01/24/12 09:52 PM
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Clarksville, TN /Greenville, ...
bill Offline
Freak of Nature
bill  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 23,870
Clarksville, TN /Greenville, ...
Originally Posted By: burbank
I think a matter of mere miles can make a big difference.


It absolutely does but he emphasized ANYWHERE. I Also hunted a 1000 acres out on trotman rd last season and they were done by 3rd week in Jan. These were intensely managed properties and probably as good as hunting gets in Alabama.


"Political debate: when charlatans come together to discuss their principles"
-
Bauvard
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270492
01/24/12 10:26 PM
01/24/12 10:26 PM
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,174
South Alabama
gobbler Offline
12 point
gobbler  Offline
12 point
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,174
South Alabama
Seems like the property in Montgomery Co I hunt is slowing down but there has been chasing for the last 2 weeks anyway. Saw 4 different bucks chasing 3 different doe groups in one hour this pm. Necks swollen, grunting, chasing each doe one after another, scrapes and rubs actively being worked, etc - seems like a "rut" to me grin


I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Shuter II] #270550
01/24/12 11:35 PM
01/24/12 11:35 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 3,494
Jefferson
F
Fun4all Offline
10 point
Fun4all  Offline
10 point
F
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 3,494
Jefferson
Originally Posted By: Shuter II
Originally Posted By: WmHunter
Originally Posted By: bigt
Originally Posted By: truedouble
Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
Originally Posted By: bill
Its always something. Most years hunters are complaining that the rut is in Feb. And they don't see any bucks.

This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.

I'll agree with ya on this one.^^^^


Hit the nail on the head. First point is I have also heard from numerous people that hunt anywhere from Union Town, to Selma to Montgomery that the bucks started chasing around the first week in January, which is a couple of weeks early.


None of the places you named is anywhere close to what I call LA just sayn..........


Anybody who says the rut begins ANYWHERE in Montgomery County
in early January is full of chit. Ours hasn't even started yet and it is Jan. 24. No seeking, no monitoring, no chasing no nothing. Zip. Zero, Nada. Rarely see a chase and never before the last 3 or 4 days of January. It has always been like that in our area. AND DESPITE MASSIVE DOE KILLING AND
QDM THE TIMING AND INTENSITY HAS NOT CHANGED ONE IOTA.

Never even heard anyone claim an early January rut for
Montgomery County.


Really? I've seen bucks chasing does since between Christmas & New Years Day. In fact, they're starting to wind down a little. I did see a terrible fight yesterday between two vicious spikes.

My son killed a nice 8 on New Years day walking across a green field and grunting with each step. Neck swollen, leg glands stinking......... Is that signs of rut? LOL



Shuter, no way that is the signs of the rut, you have to see them chasing, then mounting, then kicking back smoking a cig for it to be "THE RUT". Or, that's the way it seems by some of the posts. Oh yeah, when good bucks are being shot in food plots in Counties south of Montgomery down to the FL line starting in early January, those good bucks are just hungry cause no signs of "THE RUT" (see definition above)have been seen and its not February yet, when they reeeaaaaallllyy rut.

Last edited by Fun4all; 01/24/12 11:37 PM.

"After all, it is not the killing that brings satisfaction; it is the contest of skill and cunning. The true hunter counts his achievement in proportion to the effort involved and the fairness of the sport." Dr. Saxton Pope
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270678
01/25/12 08:41 AM
01/25/12 08:41 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,582
Moss Creek
Gotcha1 Offline
Bright Eyes
Gotcha1  Offline
Bright Eyes
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,582
Moss Creek
My thoughts on when the rut is on--When I start seeing doe tracks bigtime in the scrapes. Happening now at our place.


Matt Brock wears knock-off Crocs.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Gotcha1] #270742
01/25/12 10:16 AM
01/25/12 10:16 AM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,363
Montgomery
WmHunter Offline
14 point
WmHunter  Offline
14 point
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,363
Montgomery
Originally Posted By: Gotcha1
My thoughts on when the rut is on--When I start seeing doe tracks bigtime in the scrapes. Happening now at our place.


and seeking, monitoring, chasing, bucks cruising
etc.

Looks like a couple folks are hunting the
central part of the county betwen Woodly, Mt.
Zion where I have heard that rut is more mid
January. This is the first I have evey heard
anyone make a claim of early January, so I am
very skeptical.


"The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson

" Chuck Sykes is a dictator control freak like Vladimir Putin " WmHunter

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: WmHunter] #270760
01/25/12 10:40 AM
01/25/12 10:40 AM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,074
Glendale, FL
W
WhiteCityHunter Offline
6 point
WhiteCityHunter  Offline
6 point
W
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,074
Glendale, FL
Ive been hunting the same 220 acres in Autauga County for ten years. Ive observed a noticeable decline in numbers of deer over that period of time. I realize that the population goes through natural cycles, but the decline I have seen is drastic. This year I hunted 14 days and saw a total of 3 deer, one doe, one yearling, and one buck. This is BY FAR the lowest number of deer I have seen in a season. This is also the first season since I began hunting this property that I have not fired a single shot. Maybe it's coyotes, maybe its the liberalized doe season, I don't know. I DO KNOW that there are far fewer deer on this property and in the area around it than there has ever been. Some folks can regulate themselves and control their trigger finger, but enough can't that it is having a detrimental impact on the herd. It is very frustrating to spend hours and hours in the woods and see very few deer and even more when you are afraid to kill one because you don't want to make the situation even worse.
I would like to see either a shortened season or a decrease in the number of doe days. I realize that not all areas of the state are experiencing the same problems I am, but is it too much to ask that state biologists do deer herd estimations and change the seasons accordingly? Practically every other state in the SE U.S. has made changes to their seasons in response to changes in the herd.

Last edited by WhiteCityHunter; 01/25/12 10:43 AM.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270795
01/25/12 11:41 AM
01/25/12 11:41 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 972
Shelby County
BibbCounty Offline
6 point
BibbCounty  Offline
6 point
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 972
Shelby County
I think you just have to go by what you see on your property , I hunt 3300 acres on the marengo/Clarke county line , we have a club rule that each member can kill 4 does (18 x 4 = 72) but we never do , some people dont care to shoot any. I think this year we have killed 24 doe and 9 bucks so far, and if history holds true we will kill about 4 or 5 more bucks this last week and maybe a doe or two. Seems like some of you are contradicting your selfs though, you dont want people to shoot young bucks , but you dont want people to shoot does either , everybody is not in it for a trophy , me and my family eat at least 5 deer a year easy, I cant count on seeing a couple of 4.5 year old bucks every January!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270831
01/25/12 12:29 PM
01/25/12 12:29 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 7,153
Hoover
40Bucks Offline
14 point
40Bucks  Offline
14 point
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 7,153
Hoover
Let me play devil's advocate.
Suppose the following limiting factors which could affect deer sightings, either does or bucks, are in effect statewide:
1) warmer average temperatures, which may:
a) keep deer bedded down during daylight hours while its warmer
b) boost an earlier spring green up meaning deer may travel
shorter distances in search of food during typically cooler
months
c) initiate more frequent weather fronts which suppress deer
movement I believe this to be true

2) bumper acorn crops providing more food than in average years
away from greenfields

3) higher than normal rainfall amounts which could limit or
alter deer travel patterns where flooding can occur This is true on our place

4) increased human pressure due to more hunters in the woods in
expectation of rutting behavior

IF these are indeed in effect collectively, then I have to consider that fewer deer sightings would be atypical. I would have to think that with no way to know the actual number of deer in the state, there is a reasonable explanation for fewer sightings (the limiting factors suggested above) and that there is the possibility that numbers have not been drastically reduced due to an overly aggressive doe harvest.
My point is, even though individuals have personally witnessed fewer deer, less deer sign, heard tales of hunters and or clubs taking large numbers (however you define ‘large numbers’) of does for several consecutive years, maybe the deer are there but they’re not appearing during shooting light for myriad reasons and the herd is not in a downward population trend as it might first appear.
I’m not arguing that the things people have mentioned on here are not valid; I’m only suggesting that it may be more complex than merely 'shooting too many does'.
I know this logic is riddled with holes, I’m just sayin… my two cents.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 40Bucks] #270932
01/25/12 02:28 PM
01/25/12 02:28 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,209
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,209
Boxes Cove
^^^ I believe some if not all your points are true. I agree 100%, this years reduced doe sightings are due to much more than over harvest.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Shuter II] #270949
01/25/12 02:50 PM
01/25/12 02:50 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,539
Birmingham
T
truedouble Offline
14 point
truedouble  Offline
14 point
T
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,539
Birmingham
Originally Posted By: Shuter II
Originally Posted By: WmHunter
Originally Posted By: bigt
Originally Posted By: truedouble
Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
Originally Posted By: bill
Its always something. Most years hunters are complaining that the rut is in Feb. And they don't see any bucks.

This year I've heard a lot of hunters talk about an early rut and I've seen a truck load of good bucks killed but now we are complaining that we can't see 20 does on a greenfield like the good ol days.


I don't know much about qdm or putting doe limits but I imagine the answer lies some where in the middle. Wouldn't matter if we got it perfect we would still find something to complain about. It's what we do.

I'll agree with ya on this one.^^^^


Hit the nail on the head. First point is I have also heard from numerous people that hunt anywhere from Union Town, to Selma to Montgomery that the bucks started chasing around the first week in January, which is a couple of weeks early.


None of the places you named is anywhere close to what I call LA just sayn..........


Anybody who says the rut begins ANYWHERE in Montgomery County
in early January is full of chit. Ours hasn't even started yet and it is Jan. 24. No seeking, no monitoring, no chasing no nothing. Zip. Zero, Nada. Rarely see a chase and never before the last 3 or 4 days of January. It has always been like that in our area. AND DESPITE MASSIVE DOE KILLING AND
QDM THE TIMING AND INTENSITY HAS NOT CHANGED ONE IOTA.

Never even heard anyone claim an early January rut for
Montgomery County.


Really? I've seen bucks chasing does since between Christmas & New Years Day. In fact, they're starting to wind down a little. I did see a terrible fight yesterday between two vicious spikes.

My son killed a nice 8 on New Years day walking across a green field and grunting with each step. Neck swollen, leg glands stinking......... Is that signs of rut? LOL


I guess a friend of mine is full of crap then, cause he hunts just south of Montgomery and has seen several mature bucks chasing does hard over the past 2 weeks.

Hearing/ seeing a huge increase in domestic/ stray dogs barking and running deer is a great indicator that the rut has started. Someone told me this several years ago and since then I've noticed it. I remembered that at some point every year I would see dogs running deer but never put two and two together that it was always in late Dec. and January when this occurred. Since then, it's never failed. Once the rut kicks in we typically hear or see a dog or dogs chasing deer and start getting pics of dogs over at scrapes.

Last edited by truedouble; 01/25/12 03:01 PM.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270974
01/25/12 03:25 PM
01/25/12 03:25 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 35,427
Missouri
swamp_fever2002 Offline
Administrator
swamp_fever2002  Offline
Administrator
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Posts: 35,427
Missouri
Pass_the_Buck, I agree with you. Here is a random goggle map of lower Alabama.





It takes a long time to grow an old friend.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270981
01/25/12 03:30 PM
01/25/12 03:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 293
A
ATDH Offline
4 point
ATDH  Offline
4 point
A
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 293
probably too many, thats alot of food plots right there!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #270999
01/25/12 04:07 PM
01/25/12 04:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 421
Bama
topcat223 Offline
4 point
topcat223  Offline
4 point
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 421
Bama
This is for truedouble. I got in the stand on Dec 29th. I killed first coyote at 7:08am. Then at 7:38M I heard what I thought was a buck chasing a doe towards me. Turns out it was a coyote chasing a buck towards me, a three point and he was right on his heels. In our part of the state coyotes a a big problem, killing fawns, turkeys, calves and and yearling deer. This is not the first time I have seen this happen. After seeing two or three coyotes working toghter after a yearling size deer a fawn would not have a chance. As far as the doe numbers go I know they are way down in our area. I have been out at least 12+ times this season and never hear asingle shot fired in the afternoon. I have hunted many more times than this and have heard just a , two or three, on several morning or afternoon hunts. Either hunters are not seeing deer, not seeing what they want to shoot or not hunting as much as in the past. That has not happened around our place since the dog season has been cut out. After the dog season was cut out for years you would go out and and hear 20-30 shots EVERY afternoon! I know of a guy and his hunting buddies that hunt on around 400 acres. He was talking to me about not seeing any deer at all, hardly, the last couple of years, esp this year. I pointed out the fact that he and his buddies killed them all over the last five years. That was about the time they really started killing the does. That first year they killed 70+, the second year 40+, the third year 20+ the last two around 6!!! You think they were killing to many does?


The world and all it's beauty is best seen through the eyes of a hunter.

Sept 09, 2004
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #271019
01/25/12 04:37 PM
01/25/12 04:37 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,582
Moss Creek
Gotcha1 Offline
Bright Eyes
Gotcha1  Offline
Bright Eyes
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,582
Moss Creek
Topcat--You don't think maybe they just told you that they killed 110 does on 400 acres in 2 years? I honestly don't see how that is possible.


Matt Brock wears knock-off Crocs.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: topcat223] #271030
01/25/12 05:01 PM
01/25/12 05:01 PM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,717
Huntsville, Al
L
LUMPY Offline
14 point
LUMPY  Offline
14 point
L
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 6,717
Huntsville, Al
Originally Posted By: topcat223
first year they killed 70+, the second year 40+

Just how many people are hunting this 400 acres???

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #271034
01/25/12 05:08 PM
01/25/12 05:08 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,539
Birmingham
T
truedouble Offline
14 point
truedouble  Offline
14 point
T
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 6,539
Birmingham
topcatt, you know way more about your area than I do but assuming there are few does based on number of gun shots heard in the afternoon is a little ridiculous. There may not be many does, but that should be determined by something a little more accurate than number of gun shots heard. Way too many variables there. Fewer hunters, more hunters being more selective and not shooting does they see, mild temperatures, a lot of browse, full moon, nocturnal movement, etc., etc. Personally I would create some bait stations and put out a camera right after the season or even during the summer to get a more accurate count of does but that's just me. We've had our share of bad weekends but when foodplots are eaten pretty good and there are tracks everywhere and you were getting pics of plenty of does then regardless of what I see I know the does are there.

All that being said, yes killing 70 does on 400 acres seems very excessive and pretty much impossible but not saying it can't be done. IF they killed 70 does, then I would bet there would be 70 more does from surrounding properties that would move in over the following year or two, cause if there are no deer then there would be a lot of food. you can't wipe out a deer herd hunting only 400 acres. My guess is one, they didn't kill half as many as they say but more importantly the deer have become 99% nocturnal. Now if you put out cameras over corn and didn't get any pics over a week or so you might have something to actually worry about but my guess is you would see plenty of deer eating corn at night.

As for the yotes. You could be right, I just gave my personal observation of 3 yotes and 5 deer all in the same field one morning. Definitely not enough info. to make a definite conclusion but still pretty good indication that deer, where I hunt, don't seem to be very concerned with yotes. We also have cows on our property and haven't had a calf killed in over 5 years. We have a ton of rabbits so maybe that's what the yotes don't appear to be killing our deer...don't know for sure but still kill them when I can.

Last edited by truedouble; 01/25/12 05:24 PM.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #271036
01/25/12 05:13 PM
01/25/12 05:13 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,749
Baldwin County, AL
longspur69 Offline
8 point
longspur69  Offline
8 point
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,749
Baldwin County, AL
Not to nit pick, but that aerial photo looks like gas wells instead of food plots. It also looks like way too much topography change for anywhere in lower Alabama. But I think your point is that our deer get too much pressure, which I can't argue against.

As for 110 does in 2 years on 400 acres. It sounds to me like the state should have allowed 3 does a day there. Seriously, what is the carrying capacity on 400 acres of the best habitat money can buy?

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #271081
01/25/12 06:46 PM
01/25/12 06:46 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 35,427
Missouri
swamp_fever2002 Offline
Administrator
swamp_fever2002  Offline
Administrator
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Posts: 35,427
Missouri
longspur69 those are food plots in an area I hunted as a guest a few years back.


It takes a long time to grow an old friend.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #271085
01/25/12 06:49 PM
01/25/12 06:49 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 421
Bama
topcat223 Offline
4 point
topcat223  Offline
4 point
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 421
Bama
First off, Gotcha 1, you need to count a little better, it was over five years that this took place not two. As for the total # of people hunting this property including kids ( that like to shot) it was about ten total, 10 hunters X 7 deer each = 70 deer the first year, with fewer and fewer deer each year after that. That is not that hard for me to believe at all. Back a few years ago when I put in more time than I do now I could have killed three times that many does alone. I would usually pass up from 15-20 yung bucks a year. Yes I do believe they killed this many. They had not been killing any does and then they bought into the idea they needed to shoot plenty, and plenty it was. I have hunted this area all my life and have been in a hunting club in the area for 26 years now. I know the guys. It was all on private property that this took place. As I said this all sarted five years ago. At that time it was not uncommon for a buddy and I to go bowhunting for one morning and between us see 20 or more deer. That number as been goig down for the last five years. This year two of us hunted hard for three days and never saw a deer. We were hunting in places that should have produced deer sighting. I know this year was differnet due to the mass amount of acorns on the ground. What I was trying to get across is that I do believe the number of does/deer are down in our area. I also run from 4-6 trail cams on this property from Sept-Feb and have not gotten the number of deer as in the past. I have gotten about as many young bucks as does. As far as the amount of shooting going on I was just stating that to make the point that there are either fewer deer being seen or there are fewer people hunting. Also as stated before I have been hunting this area all my life and know most of the folks that hunt around our club. There is approx 10,000 acreas of hunting clubs in our area plus private land on top of that. I am just going by what I have seen and heard from other hunters.


The world and all it's beauty is best seen through the eyes of a hunter.

Sept 09, 2004
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #271104
01/25/12 07:38 PM
01/25/12 07:38 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,582
Moss Creek
Gotcha1 Offline
Bright Eyes
Gotcha1  Offline
Bright Eyes
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,582
Moss Creek
70+ first year. 40+ second year. 70+40= 110 deer as I see it. I may be missing something.


Matt Brock wears knock-off Crocs.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 40Bucks] #271124
01/25/12 07:59 PM
01/25/12 07:59 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
FurFlyin Offline OP
Freak of Nature
FurFlyin  Offline OP
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
Originally Posted By: Pass_the_Buck
Let me play devil's advocate.
Suppose the following limiting factors which could affect deer sightings, either does or bucks, are in effect statewide:
1) warmer average temperatures, which may:
a) keep deer bedded down during daylight hours while its warmer
b) boost an earlier spring green up meaning deer may travel
shorter distances in search of food during typically cooler
months
c) initiate more frequent weather fronts which suppress deer
movement I believe this to be true

2) bumper acorn crops providing more food than in average years
away from greenfields

3) higher than normal rainfall amounts which could limit or
alter deer travel patterns where flooding can occur This is true on our place

4) increased human pressure due to more hunters in the woods in
expectation of rutting behavior


You're right that all those things can cause fewer deer sightings. What concerns me MUCH more than the number of deer that I've seen, is the number of deer I have on camera. I have 2 cameras running on our farm. I have one on a trail to a food plot. I've had very few pictures on it. The other camera I stuck back in the deep woods, very close to a prime bedding area. I put it on an old trail that's been used for years. It leads to an oak bottom. I put the camera out in mid December IIRC and was planning on leaving it until the season was over. I pulled it yesterday. It's been in the woods for over a month and had 12 pictures on it. 6 of them were of me, 3 when I put it out and 3 when I picked it up. The other 6 pictures were of nothing. Maybe the wind blowing. There was not a single deer picture. This trail has been a well used deer trail since deer were first stocked here 25 years ago. That concerns me a bunch.


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 40Bucks] #271206
01/25/12 09:10 PM
01/25/12 09:10 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
14 point
bigt  Offline
14 point
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
Originally Posted By: Pass_the_Buck
Let me play devil's advocate.
Suppose the following limiting factors which could affect deer sightings, either does or bucks, are in effect statewide:
1) warmer average temperatures, which may:
a) keep deer bedded down during daylight hours while its warmer
b) boost an earlier spring green up meaning deer may travel
shorter distances in search of food during typically cooler
months
c) initiate more frequent weather fronts which suppress deer
movement I believe this to be true


2) bumper acorn crops providing more food than in average years
away from greenfields

3) higher than normal rainfall amounts which could limit or
alter deer travel patterns where flooding can occur This is true on our place

4) increased human pressure due to more hunters in the woods in
expectation of rutting behavior

IF these are indeed in effect collectively, then I have to consider that fewer deer sightings would be atypical. I would have to think that with no way to know the actual number of deer in the state, there is a reasonable explanation for fewer sightings (the limiting factors suggested above) and that there is the possibility that numbers have not been drastically reduced due to an overly aggressive doe harvest.
My point is, even though individuals have personally witnessed fewer deer, less deer sign, heard tales of hunters and or clubs taking large numbers (however you define ‘large numbers’) of does for several consecutive years, maybe the deer are there but they’re not appearing during shooting light for myriad reasons and the herd is not in a downward population trend as it might first appear.
I’m not arguing that the things people have mentioned on here are not valid; I’m only suggesting that it may be more complex than merely 'shooting too many does'.
I know this logic is riddled with holes, I’m just sayin… my two cents.


All of the above is why you do not manage a deer herd off of hunter observations only but also usage cages in food plots, harvest data and camera surveys. When you bring them all together you can make sound management decisions.


Last edited by bigt; 01/25/12 09:10 PM.

Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: 2Dogs] #271208
01/25/12 09:12 PM
01/25/12 09:12 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
14 point
bigt  Offline
14 point
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
^^^ I believe some if not all your points are true. I agree 100%, this years reduced doe sightings are due to much more than over harvest.


Hopefuly when people are calling for reduced doe harvest they are not using one year as the reason. I know I am not.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: bigt] #271211
01/25/12 09:15 PM
01/25/12 09:15 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 39,377
Marshall County
FurFlyin Offline OP
Freak of Nature
FurFlyin  Offline OP
Freak of Nature
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Marshall County
Originally Posted By: bigt
Originally Posted By: 2Dogs
^^^ I believe some if not all your points are true. I agree 100%, this years reduced doe sightings are due to much more than over harvest.


Hopefuly when people are calling for reduced doe harvest they are not using one year as the reason. I know I am not.


Neither am I.


If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #271218
01/25/12 09:22 PM
01/25/12 09:22 PM
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Colbert County
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Colbert County
Fur, I have kept up with this thread and decided I would just add my two cents. No matter what people believe, North Alabama deer numbers are decreasing. I haven't hunted the southern part of the state in several years, so I can't offer input on that area. I think there are too many deer riding in the back of pickup trucks to not be a contributing factor. The excessive doe harvest and predation by coyotes are taking a major toll on the deer. I hope your presentation goes well. I am on your side of this fence! Teacher.


I can't stand a thief.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #271238
01/25/12 09:41 PM
01/25/12 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted By: FurFlyin
Originally Posted By: Pass_the_Buck
Let me play devil's advocate.
Suppose the following limiting factors which could affect deer sightings, either does or bucks, are in effect statewide:
1) warmer average temperatures, which may:
a) keep deer bedded down during daylight hours while its warmer
b) boost an earlier spring green up meaning deer may travel
shorter distances in search of food during typically cooler
months
c) initiate more frequent weather fronts which suppress deer
movement I believe this to be true

2) bumper acorn crops providing more food than in average years
away from greenfields

3) higher than normal rainfall amounts which could limit or
alter deer travel patterns where flooding can occur This is true on our place

4) increased human pressure due to more hunters in the woods in
expectation of rutting behavior


You're right that all those things can cause fewer deer sightings. What concerns me MUCH more than the number of deer that I've seen, is the number of deer I have on camera. I have 2 cameras running on our farm. I have one on a trail to a food plot. I've had very few pictures on it. The other camera I stuck back in the deep woods, very close to a prime bedding area. I put it on an old trail that's been used for years. It leads to an oak bottom. I put the camera out in mid December IIRC and was planning on leaving it until the season was over. I pulled it yesterday. It's been in the woods for over a month and had 12 pictures on it. 6 of them were of me, 3 when I put it out and 3 when I picked it up. The other 6 pictures were of nothing. Maybe the wind blowing. There was not a single deer pictur
e. This trail has been a well used deer trail since deer were first stocked here 25 years ago. That concerns me a bunch.


I agree with your concerns regarding trail camera pictures. We've had only seven bucks show up on our cameras, four of which were 2.5 yo and the others no more than 4.5, I estimate. But, we've seen 12 unique does on camera since August and we usually see a half dozen or so deer in fields in the afternoons. It's a very complex situation. I don't quite know what to make of it. Maybe if I didn't live two hrs from our farm I could get more consistent data and study it a little more.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: topcat223] #271318
01/25/12 11:12 PM
01/25/12 11:12 PM
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Birmingham
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Birmingham
Originally Posted By: topcat223
First off, Gotcha 1, you need to count a little better, it was over five years that this took place not two. As for the total # of people hunting this property including kids ( that like to shot) it was about ten total, 10 hunters X 7 deer each = 70 deer the first year, with fewer and fewer deer each year after that. That is not that hard for me to believe at all. Back a few years ago when I put in more time than I do now I could have killed three times that many does alone. I would usually pass up from 15-20 yung bucks a year. Yes I do believe they killed this many. They had not been killing any does and then they bought into the idea they needed to shoot plenty, and plenty it was. I have hunted this area all my life and have been in a hunting club in the area for 26 years now. I know the guys. It was all on private property that this took place. As I said this all sarted five years ago. At that time it was not uncommon for a buddy and I to go bowhunting for one morning and between us see 20 or more deer. That number as been goig down for the last five years. This year two of us hunted hard for three days and never saw a deer. We were hunting in places that should have produced deer sighting. I know this year was differnet due to the mass amount of acorns on the ground. What I was trying to get across is that I do believe the number of does/deer are down in our area. I also run from 4-6 trail cams on this property from Sept-Feb and have not gotten the number of deer as in the past. I have gotten about as many young bucks as does. As far as the amount of shooting going on I was just stating that to make the point that there are either fewer deer being seen or there are fewer people hunting. Also as stated before I have been hunting this area all my life and know most of the folks that hunt around our club. There is approx 10,000 acreas of hunting clubs in our area plus private land on top of that. I am just going by what I have seen and heard from other hunters.


Wow, sounds to me like killing all those does balanced your herd. I wouldn't be complaining about getting pictures of equal numbers of bucks and does. Isn't that the goal? If it's true that this place killed 70 deer in one year off 400 acres, then it had WAY too many deer. As for not seeing 20 deer every time you hunt, welcome to the real world and most likely better hunting if your major concern is a more intense rut and better bucks. In my opinion the area of the state I hunt in is as good or better than anywhere and we average seeing 2-3 deer per hunt. I'm glad we don't see 20 deer on an average day. Just my opinion.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Bucktrot] #271344
01/25/12 11:54 PM
01/25/12 11:54 PM
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Jay,Fl / Gulf Breeze
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Jay,Fl / Gulf Breeze
Originally Posted By: Bucktrot
At some point, hunters have to put their desire for a healthy deer herd above their desire to burn powder.


We have cut back on our doe harvest b/c of our huge increase of yotes. Packs of them in every direction sound off at dusk!


We DEFINITELY need to do that, along with taking care of a LOT of coyotes...

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #271390
01/26/12 06:31 AM
01/26/12 06:31 AM
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Thomasville, AL
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Thomasville, AL
What about the areas/Lands/Clubs in the State that had a good buck:doe ratio BEFORE the massive reduction in the herd????

Do you guys that are just now starting to see Rut activities in January think this is something 'new'???????

I love the way somebody can hunt one small area and then be able to make a blanket statement about the entire State!!!!

Also, do people really think that since they can now see pics of 15-20 really big deer from ALL OVER the State on the internet that there were none being killed BEFORE the internet???? I would wager a guess that there are LESS killed now than years past......they are just more visible due to electronic media and increased love of 'horn porn'.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Gotcha1] #271588
01/26/12 11:53 AM
01/26/12 11:53 AM
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Butler-Wilcox-Monroe Co's, AL
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Butler-Wilcox-Monroe Co's, AL
I'm no biologist but I do know how to research and read what biologists say regarding coyote predation rates on whitetail deer. The general rule of thumb is a minimum avg of 1-2 fawns killed per coyote per year. Most of which takes place within the first six weeks of a fawn's birth. Everytime I hear a large pack of coyotes howling at night, which is a regular experience here in south Alabama these days, I'm reminded of just how many of our deer their killing off each year.


There are two types of pain...the short term pain of self-discipline, or the long term pain of regret.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #271991
01/26/12 09:21 PM
01/26/12 09:21 PM
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Corner,AL
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HOYT 09 Offline
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HOYT 09  Offline
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Corner,AL
I know on our lease in north eastern fayette co just outside of carbon hill we have 1700 acres and we arent aloud to shoot any does with a rifle or any does what so ever in a green field and bucks if harvested must be mounted and we haven't seen hardly any deer this year we have planted some of this best looking fields I have ever seen our ph is right and we planted good stuff although this is just our first year on this lease we have been running trail cams since last febuary and have noticed that we have a very balanced buck to doe ratio and this is the fewest fawns I have ever seen anywhere if we had 100 pics of does we might have 10 that had fawns this summer. Everyone around is shooting the woods up every weekend. we also have a bad coyote problem and everytime we see deer tracks in the road the coyotes are trailimg them I shot 3 coyotes one am hunt they where trailing a doe. Also we have some very great quality bucks on our place several that would be a deer of a lifetime in this state. But I think all the shooting is idiots around us who just shoot what ever moves it takes about 4 days of hard hunting just to see deer on our place and we arent greenfield shooting house sitters either we hunt hard and arent affraid of a long walk. I think there should be a limit to the amount of does harvested in certain areas of the state.


There is no such thing as a Bad day in the woods or on the Water!
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #272068
01/26/12 10:17 PM
01/26/12 10:17 PM
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Land of the free because of th...
mike35549 Offline
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mike35549  Offline
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Land of the free because of th...
Hoyt:
Welcome to hunting in this part of the state since doe season went all year long here and the coyote population has increased. I predict it will get worse before it gets better.


If you're gonna be stupid you better be tough.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #272363
01/27/12 02:29 PM
01/27/12 02:29 PM

M
Matt Brock
Unregistered
Matt Brock
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I've hunted Fayette County my entire life, and have to say we killed FAR more does in the last 5 years than we did in the last 20 combined. We still can't keep up. The more we shoot the more we get. I killed 7 out of one stand this year, and I can bet you a month's paycheck if I go back in there this afternoon I could kill two more.

I hear so much doom and gloom about the deer herd, but when I get out and visit some of these places there is enough deer sign to make me wonder what some of you are doing to not see deer.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: ] #272448
01/27/12 08:13 PM
01/27/12 08:13 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
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bigt  Offline
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Gulfcrest
Originally Posted By: Matt Brock
I've hunted Fayette County my entire life, and have to say we killed FAR more does in the last 5 years than we did in the last 20 combined. We still can't keep up. The more we shoot the more we get. I killed 7 out of one stand this year, and I can bet you a month's paycheck if I go back in there this afternoon I could kill two more.

I hear so much doom and gloom about the deer herd, but when I get out and visit some of these places there is enough deer sign to make me wonder what some of you are doing to not see deer.



You are cordually invited to come to my lease in Mobile and show me all this deer sign and enlighten me on what I am doing wrong. Maybe you can do a better job than our biologist.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #272490
01/27/12 10:18 PM
01/27/12 10:18 PM

M
Matt Brock
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Matt Brock
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Bigt, next time I'm down that way I'll let you know. I may not be be able to help you none, but I would love to see what you have to work with.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #272614
01/28/12 11:19 AM
01/28/12 11:19 AM
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Hollywood2 Offline
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I hunt in Clarke County south of Grove Hill in the Bassest creek swamp on about 700 hundred acres. I have hunted the same land for the last 30 years and have seen a big change in how many deer we see now compared to 30 years ago with the increased amount of does killed each year. Also the increased amount of hogs in the area now drives alot of our deer out of the area. It was nothing to see 8 to 10 and sometimes up to 15 or 20 deer every time I went hunting. Now if you see 1 or 2 deer you feel lucky. I believe the hunting seasons on the does needs to be cut back to the one week during the Christmas holidays as it once was. I don't believe our biologist has a clue what the deer populations needs or don't need. Also we have coyotes real bad in the area and they can hurt the young deer bad. I have a friend who had a game camara on a coyota den for 14 days. In this time he had nine different deer taken into the den. If it is not one thing hurtin the deer its another. I myself would like to at least see more deer when I'm taken my kids hunting instead of nothing at all. Just my take on the doe killings.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #272664
01/28/12 03:21 PM
01/28/12 03:21 PM
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Thomasville, AL
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Hogwild Offline
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Sat not very far from you this morning from 5:50 am until 9:45 am and never saw a deer......

Matter of fact, I only heard 1 shot!!!!

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #272694
01/28/12 05:44 PM
01/28/12 05:44 PM
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Posts: 4,573
Petal,MS,USA
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SFC3  Offline
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Petal,MS,USA
Warm weather, plenty of food, natural and man provided...food plots corn piles galore...when you provide them easy food, they'll use it at night..tons of pressure...does arent stupid...like on the Texas ranches where they shoot them a lot...Theyre there...just better educated...and well fed...

bet I saw 50 on the highway yesterday afternoon driving down Hwy 55 in MS...and about 20 dead


Grumpy Old MS Bastage
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #272754
01/28/12 08:47 PM
01/28/12 08:47 PM
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colbert county
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Old Mossy Horns
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colbert county
I know of an area knocked back, pretty sure know the reason. Guys wanting a February Season might have instigated some yearly research.


“Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it.” ― Ronald Reagan
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #272810
01/28/12 11:03 PM
01/28/12 11:03 PM
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Kennedy, al
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globe Online content
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Kennedy, al
WELL i'll chime in. some people are not killing bucks so lets limit the buck harvest. NOW some people are not seeing the deer numbers they'd like to see so lets limit the doe harvest.
i'm not seeing deer on my greenfields either. i stalk hunted last monday and had two does killed by 8:00. get out and hunt, and don't change the laws to make it easier to sit on your butts and kill a deer! I feel better.


Everything woke turns to shucks
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: ] #272885
01/29/12 09:28 AM
01/29/12 09:28 AM
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Posts: 8,377
Gulfcrest
bigt Offline
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bigt  Offline
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Gulfcrest
Originally Posted By: Matt Brock
Bigt, next time I'm down that way I'll let you know. I may not be be able to help you none, but I would love to see what you have to work with.


Definitely! Be glad to show you around.


Life is too short to be small !!

http://crshuntingclub.webs.com/
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: ] #273712
01/30/12 04:22 PM
01/30/12 04:22 PM
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Posts: 194
Chattahoochee Valley,Henry Co
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Chatt Valley Offline
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Chatt Valley  Offline
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Chattahoochee Valley,Henry Co
Wow, Wish our deer were like that they are SO Spookie. We can have 20 deer coming to a field in eve and you shoot one it will take 2 weeks for a mature doe to poke its nose back out.No pressure on them either 3 guys on 2000 ac.Crossing,s are same way shoot one or two and they will not cross there anymore in daylight.But we do have a bad yote problem and big&small cats.

[=Matt Brock]The more we shoot the more we get. I killed 7 out of one stand this year, and I can bet you a month's paycheck if I go back in there this afternoon I could kill two more.


Stop'em and Drop'em!
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: ] #273725
01/30/12 04:42 PM
01/30/12 04:42 PM
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Posts: 6,539
Birmingham
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truedouble Offline
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truedouble  Offline
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Birmingham
Originally Posted By: Matt Brock
I've hunted Fayette County my entire life, and have to say we killed FAR more does in the last 5 years than we did in the last 20 combined. We still can't keep up. The more we shoot the more we get. I killed 7 out of one stand this year, and I can bet you a month's paycheck if I go back in there this afternoon I could kill two more.





We have the same issue. BSK made a good point one time and said the down side of killing does on property with good habitat is for every doe you shoot one will likely move in if your neighbors aren't killing their share of does. I can't imagine where it would be hard to kill a doe if you have low pressure and good habitat. Now reverse that and say you have a lot of pressure and the only food are the greenfields, then yea, I could see the does becoming nocturnal and hard to see and kill.

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Chatt Valley] #273840
01/30/12 08:18 PM
01/30/12 08:18 PM
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St. Clair County
Big Jack Offline
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Big Jack  Offline
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St. Clair County
Originally Posted By: Chatt Valley
Wow, Wish our deer were like that they are SO Spookie. We can have 20 deer coming to a field in eve and you shoot one it will take 2 weeks for a mature doe to poke its nose back out.No pressure on them either 3 guys on 2000 ac.Crossing,s are same way shoot one or two and they will not cross there anymore in daylight.But we do have a bad yote problem and big&small cats.

[=Matt Brock]The more we shoot the more we get. I killed 7 out of one stand this year, and I can bet you a month's paycheck if I go back in there this afternoon I could kill two more.


Thats a big difference between these ole Alabama deer and those in the mid west. Hell, you shoot one in a food plot in most, if not all, of the midwest, if any run they will be back in less than 30 minutes. BTW, thats how it was in the 70s and 80s in Wilcox county. Not that way now. Shoot and you porbably will not see one on that field for a few days.


Last edited by Big Jack; 01/30/12 08:19 PM.

"Its a damn weak minded person who can only think of one way to spell a work." Andrew Jackson

Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Big Jack] #273862
01/30/12 08:36 PM
01/30/12 08:36 PM
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Land of the free because of th...
mike35549 Offline
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mike35549  Offline
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Land of the free because of th...
Quote:
Thats a big difference between these ole Alabama deer and those in the mid west. Hell, you shoot one in a food plot in most, if not all, of the midwest, if any run they will be back in less than 30 minutes. BTW, thats how it was in the 70s and 80s in Wilcox county. Not that way now. Shoot and you porbably will not see one on that field for a few days.


So why is the deer here so much more spooky than places like the mid west is it just the hunting pressure from just a long season or what.


If you're gonna be stupid you better be tough.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: mike35549] #273898
01/30/12 09:09 PM
01/30/12 09:09 PM
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Posts: 6,539
Birmingham
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truedouble Offline
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truedouble  Offline
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Birmingham
Originally Posted By: mike35549
Quote:
Thats a big difference between these ole Alabama deer and those in the mid west. Hell, you shoot one in a food plot in most, if not all, of the midwest, if any run they will be back in less than 30 minutes. BTW, thats how it was in the 70s and 80s in Wilcox county. Not that way now. Shoot and you porbably will not see one on that field for a few days.


So why is the deer here so much more spooky than places like the mid west is it just the hunting pressure from just a long season or what.


IMO multiple reasons.
1. rut starts a lot earlier in midwest, so deer haven't been pressured for 2 to 2 1/2 months prior to the rut, as is the case in Bama.
2. most Midwest states have more limited gun season and some states don't even allow hunting with rifles. Also have always had much more restrictive limits, overall than Bama
3. more open country with woodlots. More huntable land over all. Easier to see deer, harder for deer to hide.

Then I think some deer are just more weary and cautious than other deer. No way to prove it but I think it's probably hereditary. For example bucks where I hunt rarely come out in foodplots during the day, even 2.5 year olds but in other parts of the state (same management, same amount of land, etc.) it's nothing to see several young racked bucks in a foodplot in the afternoon. Might have a lot to due with food available, etc. but I swear some deer are just smarter than others.

Last edited by truedouble; 01/30/12 09:13 PM.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: Big Jack] #273905
01/30/12 09:15 PM
01/30/12 09:15 PM
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South Alabama
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South Alabama
Originally Posted By: Big Jack

Thats a big difference between these ole Alabama deer and those in the mid west. Hell, you shoot one in a food plot in most, if not all, of the midwest, if any run they will be back in less than 30 minutes. BTW, thats how it was in the 70s and 80s in Wilcox county. Not that way now. Shoot and you porbably will not see one on that field for a few days.



Still plenty of places like that in AL. I shot one in a field this year and the other 8 or so never left the field completely and were back feeding in 15 minutes around the dead deer.


I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: gobbler] #273922
01/30/12 09:25 PM
01/30/12 09:25 PM
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Land of the free because of th...
mike35549 Offline
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mike35549  Offline
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Land of the free because of th...
I don't know if I would say plenty of places in Alabama like that maybe some. But plenty?


If you're gonna be stupid you better be tough.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: truedouble] #273963
01/30/12 10:05 PM
01/30/12 10:05 PM
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colbert county
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Old Mossy Horns
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colbert county
Originally Posted By: truedouble
Originally Posted By: mike35549
Quote:
Thats a big difference between these ole Alabama deer and those in the mid west. Hell, you shoot one in a food plot in most, if not all, of the midwest, if any run they will be back in less than 30 minutes. BTW, thats how it was in the 70s and 80s in Wilcox county. Not that way now. Shoot and you porbably will not see one on that field for a few days.


So why is the deer here so much more spooky than places like the mid west is it just the hunting pressure from just a long season or what.


IMO multiple reasons.
1. rut starts a lot earlier in midwest, so deer haven't been pressured for 2 to 2 1/2 months prior to the rut, as is the case in Bama.
2. most Midwest states have more limited gun season and some states don't even allow hunting with rifles. Also have always had much more restrictive limits, overall than Bama
3. more open country with woodlots. More huntable land over all. Easier to see deer, harder for deer to hide.

Then I think some deer are just more weary and cautious than other deer. No way to prove it but I think it's probably hereditary. For example bucks where I hunt rarely come out in foodplots during the day, even 2.5 year olds but in other parts of the state (same management, same amount of land, etc.) it's nothing to see several young racked bucks in a foodplot in the afternoon. Might have a lot to due with food available, etc. but I swear some deer are just smarter than others.


thumbup


“Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it.” ― Ronald Reagan
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: truedouble] #274277
01/31/12 10:57 AM
01/31/12 10:57 AM
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Posts: 194
Chattahoochee Valley,Henry Co
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Chatt Valley Offline
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Chattahoochee Valley,Henry Co
Imho, you are rite on the money. We shoot nothing but 4yr olds or older & a small amout of does, 99% of the time 1 yr olds are only ones to enter a field in daylight.

Originally Posted By: truedouble
[quote=mike35549IMO multiple reasons.
Then I think some deer are just more weary and cautious than other deer. No way to prove it but I think it's probably hereditary. For example bucks where I hunt rarely come out in foodplots during the day, even 2.5 year olds but in other parts of the state (same management, same amount of land, etc.) it's nothing to see several young racked bucks in a foodplot in the afternoon. Might have a lot to due with food available, etc. but I swear some deer are just smarter than others.


Stop'em and Drop'em!
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: FurFlyin] #274283
01/31/12 11:06 AM
01/31/12 11:06 AM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,180
Coffee Co, AL
J
jlccoffee Offline
14 point
jlccoffee  Offline
14 point
J
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 8,180
Coffee Co, AL
I have shot plenty of deer where the other deer around paid little or no attention to it.

Last year I shot a buck in a food plot with 6 other deer in the plot. The bullet zipped right by two does and hit the buck that ran off and crashed in the woods. The two does just lifted their heads and then went back to grazing.

I shot a buck in Georgia early this year and he ran into a ravine and fell. At the same time, a doe came out of the ravine and walked by my stand.

I shot a doe in a food plot in December and the other 3 does just stood around and went back to eating. A little later, more came into the field with the dead deer still laying there.

I shot a deer last weekend and as soon as I shot I heard a grunt and another buck walked up right underneath my stand.

In a plot behind my house, two does were regularly coming out in the evening. I shot one of them and now there is still one doe that regularly comes in the evening.....I guess the same one.

It is pretty common to me to shoot one deer and the other deer pay little attention to it.

Last edited by jlccoffee; 01/31/12 11:07 AM.
Re: Your personal observations on the effect of liberal doe season (POLL) [Re: jlccoffee] #274377
01/31/12 12:44 PM
01/31/12 12:44 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 194
Chattahoochee Valley,Henry Co
C
Chatt Valley Offline
3 point
Chatt Valley  Offline
3 point
C
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 194
Chattahoochee Valley,Henry Co
Lucky you, If you drive out of field after hunt in pm while deer are still out in field and spook,em 2 or 3 times they won,t come out till after dark for a week or so if you shoot one with them all out there,could be weeks before they return. Plz, keep in mind i am only talkin about mature deer.
Originally Posted By: jlccoffee
I have shot plenty of deer where the other deer around paid little or no attention to it.

Last year I shot a buck in a food plot with 6 other deer in the plot. The bullet zipped right by two does and hit the buck that ran off and crashed in the woods. The two does just lifted their heads and then went back to grazing.

I shot a buck in Georgia early this year and he ran into a ravine and fell. At the same time, a doe came out of the ravine and walked by my stand.

I shot a doe in a food plot in December and the other 3 does just stood around and went back to eating. A little later, more came into the field with the dead deer still laying there.

I shot a deer last weekend and as soon as I shot I heard a grunt and another buck walked up right underneath my stand.

In a plot behind my house, two does were regularly coming out in the evening. I shot one of them and now there is still one doe that regularly comes in the evening.....I guess the same one.

It is pretty common to me to shoot one deer and the other deer pay little attention to it.


Stop'em and Drop'em!
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