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HVAC guys...need info--HELP, see pic
#2530475
07/17/18 02:49 PM
07/17/18 02:49 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,087 Chelsea, AL
straycat
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Chelsea, AL
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HVAC in basement with concrete slab. Is an emergency drain pan with overflow switch required by current 2015 code?
Last edited by straycat; 07/17/18 04:22 PM.
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.� Samuel Adams
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: straycat]
#2530516
07/17/18 03:46 PM
07/17/18 03:46 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,087 Chelsea, AL
straycat
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There is a condensate pump. Currently there is not a pan in place. This is in a basement.
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.� Samuel Adams
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: straycat]
#2530552
07/17/18 04:19 PM
07/17/18 04:19 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,087 Chelsea, AL
straycat
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Old Mossy Horns
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Here is a photo of the setup. I'm not an HVAC guy really, but I have this as part of a case I'm working on and need to figure out the code. Primary equipment pan goes into condensate pump. Check. Secondary drain? or Primary pan cutoff installed? Don't know. Question 1: Waht is the the short second elbow? Is that the secondary drain to the primary drain in the required conspicuous place? Question 2: Is a secondary pan, or an auxiliary device or level cutoff switch method --as a backup--required in this basement set up?. Finished rooms are in the area. What happened. Homeowner unplugged the condensate pump, leaving it useless, so condensation leaked out and messed up some floors. On top of some other issues in the case. Trying to figure out the HVAC part. Any help?
Last edited by straycat; 07/17/18 04:22 PM.
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.� Samuel Adams
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: straycat]
#2530557
07/17/18 04:26 PM
07/17/18 04:26 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 18,028 North AL
AU338MAG
Old Mossy Horns
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Old Mossy Horns
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North AL
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Same setup in my basement. No secondary pan with float switch for cutoff. If the pump is not working, basement will get wet.
Dying ain't much of a living boy...Josey Wales
Molon Labe
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: AU338MAG]
#2530565
07/17/18 04:35 PM
07/17/18 04:35 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,087 Chelsea, AL
straycat
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Old Mossy Horns
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Same setup in my basement. No secondary pan with float switch for cutoff. If the pump is not working, basement will get wet. But is a secondary drain, pan, switch required? House built in 2015
Last edited by straycat; 07/17/18 04:36 PM.
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.� Samuel Adams
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: straycat]
#2530571
07/17/18 04:50 PM
07/17/18 04:50 PM
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 3,797 Scottsboro Al
TravisBatey
10 point
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10 point
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Scottsboro Al
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I can't answer your question as I don't have a code book anywhere near by and am not on the new construction or install side of things but I can say this is a fairly common set up. I don't think ive seen many vertical AH in that application have a secondary pan and switch.
Fwiw, that pump has a float switch built into it and appears to not be hooked up. If the pump was installed correctly and safety switch wired, it would of killed the power once pump was full and prevented ruining some flooring.
The secondary port on the pan has the elbow pointing up just so the pan and drain can easily be tested by pouring water into it. That way it flows back into pan, then out primary drain into pump. Where is that vertical pipe out of the "T" going leaving the picture?
Last edited by TravisBatey; 07/17/18 04:57 PM.
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: straycat]
#2530579
07/17/18 05:04 PM
07/17/18 05:04 PM
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 7,403 Tenn
woodduck
14 point
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14 point
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Posts: 7,403
Tenn
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There is a condensate pump. Currently there is not a pan in place. This is in a basement. You probably already know this but add a little Clorox in that pump once or twice a year to keep it clear. I found out the hard way
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: straycat]
#2530914
07/17/18 10:00 PM
07/17/18 10:00 PM
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 15,314 Ourtown, AL
BCLC
Old Mossy Horns
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Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 15,314
Ourtown, AL
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Not sure about the HVAC question but that gas water heater should be 18in off the ground to meet code
We’re not dead. We just smell that way. Dayum. - AC870
Yessir! I’m always gonna shoot what makes me happy and I want everyone else to do the same! If you shoot one be proud of it and don’t worry what anyone else thinks. - SJ22
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: BCLC]
#2530987
07/17/18 11:41 PM
07/17/18 11:41 PM
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Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 6,451 Pelham Al
Tigger85
12 point
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12 point
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Pelham Al
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Not sure about the HVAC question but that gas water heater should be 18in off the ground to meet code That's what I saw right off the bat. Don't know where the line goes after the trap
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: Atoler]
#2530990
07/17/18 11:54 PM
07/17/18 11:54 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,087 Chelsea, AL
straycat
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Old Mossy Horns
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Chelsea, AL
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Don’t have a code book, but you are pretty much never going to see a pan on a air handler that sits on top of a return plenum or return duct.. for obvious reasons...
Right. Where would it go? So I've been reading the code tonight. From my limited understanding of the IRC mechanical code, a secondary pan OR secondary cut off switch OR secondary drain to a visible location is required if the unit is in an area where the structure or components of the structure could be damaged due to the primary drain mechanism becoming clogged or non operational. So in this case of a mechanical closet in a finished basement, with this specific setup, it seems that there is a requirement for some type of secondary cutoff switch or something to cut off the unit of the condensate pump fails or is ever unplugged. Y'all agree with that?
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.� Samuel Adams
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: Tigger85]
#2530991
07/17/18 11:54 PM
07/17/18 11:54 PM
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 4,597 Elmore county
GKelly
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 4,597
Elmore county
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Not sure about the HVAC question but that gas water heater should be 18in off the ground to meet code That's what I saw right off the bat. Don't know where the line goes after the trap not gonna matter either way there aint nowhere for it to drain anyway or the ac condensate wouldnt have a pump installed. i thought water heaters were ok to be on the ground as long as it was a ground level install and not on a second or third floor or in the attic
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: straycat]
#2530993
07/17/18 11:56 PM
07/17/18 11:56 PM
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 4,597 Elmore county
GKelly
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 4,597
Elmore county
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Don’t have a code book, but you are pretty much never going to see a pan on a air handler that sits on top of a return plenum or return duct.. for obvious reasons...
Right. Where would it go? So I've been reading the code tonight. From my limited understanding of the IRC mechanical code, a secondary pan OR secondary cut off switch OR secondary drain to a visible location is required if the unit is in an area where the structure or components of the structure could be damaged due to the primary drain mechanism becoming clogged or non operational. So in this case of a mechanical closet in a finished basement, with this specific setup, it seems that there is a requirement for some type of secondary cutoff switch or something to cut off the unit of the condensate pump fails or is ever unplugged. Y'all agree with that? your pump has a secondary cut off in it i see the wires now if its hooked up or not is another thing. the way that reads seems to me that since its ground floor and in a basement it doesnt apply to you you cant damage concrete with water if it was in the attic over sheetrock then it could damage structure. at the most you need a cutoff at the coil and at the pump pan to comply. they are cheap and wire in series to the red thermostat wire
Last edited by GKelly; 07/18/18 12:03 AM.
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: straycat]
#2530995
07/18/18 12:08 AM
07/18/18 12:08 AM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,087 Chelsea, AL
straycat
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Old Mossy Horns
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Gotcha. I realize I need to study the plumbing and mechanical codes more. We normally don't get involved with it much. But it's part of this case. Thanks. I'll check specs on the pump.
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.� Samuel Adams
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: Tigger85]
#2530997
07/18/18 12:10 AM
07/18/18 12:10 AM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,087 Chelsea, AL
straycat
OP
Old Mossy Horns
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OP
Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 19,087
Chelsea, AL
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Not sure about the HVAC question but that gas water heater should be 18in off the ground to meet code That's what I saw right off the bat. Don't know where the line goes after the trap 18" above the floor doesn't apply here because not in a garage or hazardous location for fumes. Allowed to be at floor level because its in a separate mechanical closet.
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
"Neither the wisest constitution nor the wisest laws will secure the liberty and happiness of a people whose manners are universally corrupt.� Samuel Adams
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Re: HVAC guys...need info
[Re: straycat]
#2531140
07/18/18 08:48 AM
07/18/18 08:48 AM
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 3,797 Scottsboro Al
TravisBatey
10 point
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10 point
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 3,797
Scottsboro Al
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Gotcha. I realize I need to study the plumbing and mechanical codes more. We normally don't get involved with it much. But it's part of this case. Thanks. I'll check specs on the pump. I'm fairly certain that's a little giant vcma-15 pump. 15' vertical pump max. It can pump 65GPH at 1', 50gph at 5', 30gph at 9'. It definitely has a cut off switch built into it. Anything hooked to the two little black wires? Hard to tell but doesn't look like it.That's the safety switch wires. Doesn't look like anything is hooked up. It should break 24v at AH. Like I said in a previous post. If the switch was wired up. It wouldn't matter if the pump came unplugged. It would of shut the unit off when full if not pumping.
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