Thanks for adding your wisdom preacher. You said it best.

Gomer I'm not getting into the baptism debate. It's useless for people who want to believe what they want. I will say this show me by scripture where baptism is not required and I can show you where in many verses it is. Now ask yourself this. Obviously both can't be right. It speaks on different things that are made clearer n other verses. True it mentions belief but never belief only. It mentions repentance but not repentance only. It mentions baptism but not baptism only. It mentions confession but not just confession only. So not one of the above will save you. The sinner's prayer didn't exist in the Bible and it doesn't today either. There is no example anywhere in an version of the Bible where a person said to themselves the sinner's prayer and were recorded as saved. Paul wasn't saved on the road to Damascus and he believed. He was told what he must do in Damascus. He was told why tarriest thou arise and be baptized and wash away your sins.

The new law was not in effect while Christ was alive. He was a sacrifice for our sins. Without dying there was no sacrifice. It had to be completed. So the thief was under the old law still and Christ was able to forgive while he was still alive. Just like he forgave the adulterous woman. As far as an outward showing if an inward work. Where did that come from? Where is it written in the Bible?examples?

The thief on the cross died under the old law. My Bible tells me Baptism is for the remission of sins... Saul on the road to Damascus was confronted by Christ himself and was blinded. He prayed for forgivness for three days yet according to the Bible he was still lost in his sins. No doubt he believed and repented for the awful things he had been doing to christians. He was told after 3 days to be baptized and wash away your sins.To leave Baptism out of salvation a person has to have outside help. Every confersion in the NT mentions it. I'm checking out on this thread we have beat this subject to death over the years.I challenge each whatever you hear from the pulpit or practice in worship go to the Bible and see if it's so.
Did you know that 150 yrs ago the Baptist church preached Baptism for the remission of sins and had no instruments in worship? God Bless I think it's good to talk religion it might be all some are ever exposed to.Apathy has gotten us to wear we are today in religion and so many other things.

So the only REAL way to salvation is to have some guy dunk me in water and yell some stuff at the sky? Sounds more pagan than spiritual.

We had the baptism debate months ago, with one of the examples being the thief on the cross beside Jesus - who told him he would be with him in heaven. Right?

That thief wasn't baptized. Dunked, sprinkled, anointed, whatever you want to call it or however you think "baptism" is to be done. He hung on the cross beside Jesus and died.

If you believe you're not saved until you're dunked then that's on you. I'll believe Jesus on his dying day saving a criminal hanging beside him.

The bible also teaches there are two baptisms: water baptism and the baptism in the Holy Spirit but a lot of denominations just gloss over those verses.

“When they arrived, they prayed for the new believers there that they might receive the Holy Spirit, because the Holy Spirit had not yet come on any of them; they had simply been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then Peter and John placed their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit.”
Acts 8:15-17

Agreed. I was raised Missionary Baptist. Small country church. Baptism was the symbolic initiation for becoming a member of the church. It was made very clear to us that baptism was not a prerequisite to salvation. Just a prerequisite to becoming a voting member of the church.

Do you know why you always take 2 Southern Baptists with you fishing?

So they don't drink all your beer up.

Amen

A perfect example of religion(which I detest)is for men to study a book and make up absolute laws from a finite book about an infinite God.Men start worshiping the creation rather than the creator.God just wants you to trust him.

Look to the beginning. There was no law,no baptism,no priesthood,only man trusting in God.It was only when men wanted to trust themselves that God gave the law.

The law was given to show men how sinful they were and that they couldn't be good enough,thus the priesthood became necessary so the men would know what to do when they couldn't live up to the standard of the Law.They would have to make sacrifices.Blood would have to be shed to atone for sin. They worked their system of salvation but it was only a teaching device to point to a perfect way.

God became a man,and paid for man's sin, as a man. As the man Jesus,God walked in perfect compliance with the Law,completely without sin,thus fulfilling the covenant of Law and abolishing it,replacing it with a new covenant of Grace.

All God wants is for us to trust and rely on him completely.We have come full circle yet we still strive to place ourselves back under the Law,which was never meant to be a way to live.We still are full of pride,wanting,needing to do our part of salvation,refusing to trust in God alone. Whole denominations are based on us doing our part.

If we would only trust God and understand that we are his children,by the blood Christ shed. If we could understand that we are one with Christ and right now seated with him.It would transform the way we live and act. Instead we are always trying ,through self effort, to become what we already are through grace.

And so we strive,and we bicker and we rail at each other,not understanding who we are,or what God has already done for us,while Satan laughs and encourages us to try a little harder,telling us that someday we will be what God wants us to be. So we keep looking to ourselves trying harder,when all the time God is just wanting us to trust in him and what he has already done.

Sad! Sad! Sad!

Dear Lord Baby Jesus, I want to thank you for this wonderful meal, my two beautiful sons, Walker and Texas Ranger, and my red-hot smokin' wife, Carley.

Great post

Good point that is essential to the discussion. Like most Greek and English words, baptism has more than one meaning. Remember when Jesus asked James and John if they were able to be baptized with baptism that He was baptized with? They said yes, but didn't have a clue of what He meant. Hint- it wasn't about water.

I have great respect for all the Christian denominations represented on aldeer. Obviously, we can't agree on every point, but I hate to see us arguing so strongly over theological questions that have been debated for centuries and will not be answered down here.

I'm going back to spraying chufas; y'all have fun.

Correct; Jesus "fulfilled" the Old Law & ushered in the New Law of "saved by grace through faith" (Eph 2:8-9). Read Hebrews 10 to understand that Jesus' one sacrifice "remits" you of your sins -- not water.

Paul received the Holy Spirit at Ananius' house , not the baptism pool.

Also , what do you make of Acts 10 / 47 ?

the first gentiles were already saved and Paul is reporting back to Jerusalem to see what to do ... he says

" Surely no one can stand in the way of their being baptized with water. They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have".

The baptism of the Holy Spirit by grace through faith is what saves, not the baptism water. These scriptures are clear as can be. Anything else is a works based salvation.

So Paul was saved prior to baptism. Really? Then how were his sins WASHED away when baptized. He still had sin until baptism . It's plain and in black and white.

Luke 23:39-43New American Standard Bible (NASB)

39 One of the criminals who were hanged there was [a]hurling abuse at Him, saying, “Are You not the [b]Christ? Save Yourself and us!” 40 But the other answered, and rebuking him said, “Do you not even fear God, since you are under the same sentence of condemnation? 41 And we indeed are suffering justly, for we are receiving [c]what we deserve for our deeds; but this man has done nothing wrong.” 42 And he was saying, “Jesus, remember me when You come [d]in Your kingdom!” 43 And He said to him, “Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.”

It is implied the other thief believed Jesus was also who he said he was. Why wasn't he saved by belief only?

You're a wise man. Took me quite awhile to realize no one was changing their minds except maybe the non believer sitting back watching the show.

I got no chuffas to spray. Reckon I'm gonna go to a few gun shops and argue with myself over wants vs needs.

It's symbolic. Actual water doesn't wash away sin any more than admitting your sins to some dude hiding behind a curtain and playing with a necklace.

Yes. He was. You can't posess the Holy Spirit if you're lost. The text says it. Not me.

His sins were washed away that momenthe repented and believed. Baptism is identification with Christ's death burial and resurrection. It's important, very important. But it isn't salvic.

Go into the Acts 10 verses as well. Those gentiles had already received the Holy Spirit as well. Hence, already saved.