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Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: deadeye] #190004
09/27/11 10:32 AM
09/27/11 10:32 AM
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I don't know Deadeye, we fishermen spend a lot of time and money trying to perfect fishing tackle. Some ancient tackle peddler might have made a fortune trading plummet stone weights. Kinda like all these tungsten weights we buy. Haha. I know skintback would have bought them instead of some plain old rock to weight his net or line.

Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: deadeye] #190428
09/28/11 03:45 AM
09/28/11 03:45 AM
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Originally Posted By: deadeye
My nephew found a museum quality plummet washed out of the bank at little lagoon near Gulf Shores. They have also found several very nice points there where a small freshwater creek flows into the lagoon and lots of pottery shards too. Seems like if it were a weight of some type, they would not have put so much time into making them. I think they are ceremonial type adornments.


Cool ! Take a photo of the plummet if you can, and post it, deadeye.

Sounds like your nephew found a Coastal village or something. He might find some nice shell items.

I think the better made plummets were ceremonial or Clan objects too. Some of the battered ones or poorly/quickly made ones were probably weights. They run the gamut from poorly made to works of art. I found 5 more...including two really nice types. 2 were of quartz and 3 were polished river pebble...really nice ones. Then I found the one above. It has some small pits from being used, but is a great one. I think it is some type of sandstone from the Gulf Coast area.

It's rained here all night. I'll probably look around the hill for artifacts. I found 2 more perforated pebble pendents/beads, yesterday. One is flat but is drilled in it's center...and thee other is drilled on it's edge. (I'll take pics asap)

Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #192378
10/01/11 06:27 PM
10/01/11 06:27 PM
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I searched wash-outs near the hill site today and found a few nice items. Machinery is grading it for a house place and these would have been lost or destroyed.


3 single perforated beads (or gorgets?), 1 double perforated black rhyolite gorget and 1 non-perforated/faceted greenstone charmstone:



L-R: quartz bi-face leather punch/scraper/knife w/rock's rind intentionally left in middle for better control; flint mid-Archaic knife; miniature size (2.5") celt/axe effigy pendent (presumed effigy)...ground from hard stone with sharpened bit and round poll...w/cordage attachment grooves:







Flint LeCroy dart found earlier at the site:



Quartz beveled Bolen point found earlier at the site:


Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #192443
10/01/11 07:02 PM
10/01/11 07:02 PM
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alabama
BhamFred Offline
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a beveled Bolen out of quartz...now that is way cool....

troy


I've spent most of the money I've made in my lifetime on hunting and fishing. The rest I just wasted.....

proud Cracker-Americaan

muslims are like coyotes, only good one is a dead one
Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: BhamFred] #192945
10/02/11 07:30 PM
10/02/11 07:30 PM
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Lee County
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RCHRR Offline
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Originally Posted By: BhamFred
a beveled Bolen out of quartz...now that is way cool....

troy

Nothing like a true craftsman. Pure skill.

Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: RCHRR] #193037
10/03/11 03:55 AM
10/03/11 03:55 AM
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Alabama
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Thanks, pardners. I'll post more if I find them, or I'll take some closer shots of more I've found. Glad everyone enjoyed the photos.

Troy (BhamFred), RCHRR (Richard), they had to be masters to knap quartz with fine tips and perfect notches and ears. I find, maybe, 30 quartz points around my farm to every flint point or tool. Usually it's the reverse as I understand. I've also found a lot of petrified wood...both natural and fire treated. I've never found a petrified wood made point/blade but I sure would love to.

Troy (anyone), I found on my land, a bi-face flake knife and sherds/ancient broken points of 2 types of flint. This type flint doesn't occur naturally around here. (quartz does) Flint artifacts are rare to findd, here. One type is a brittle whitish color originally which turns a yellowish-gold patina; and the other is a deep reddish-burgundy color which is shiny and slick...carrying a hazy patina.

Are these ^ fire treated flint ?...and where would it have likely originated; or where did the Native Americans find or trade for this flint? (I'm thinking from Tennessee, but I don't know.) I like to know this type info a lot !

Thanks, much !

Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #193062
10/03/11 06:11 AM
10/03/11 06:11 AM
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BhamFred Offline
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they could be Coastal Plains chert. It turns varying colors when heat treated.

Put up a pic....

troy


I've spent most of the money I've made in my lifetime on hunting and fishing. The rest I just wasted.....

proud Cracker-Americaan

muslims are like coyotes, only good one is a dead one
Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #193293
10/03/11 03:22 PM
10/03/11 03:22 PM
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Foley, AL
Vulkanman Offline
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Saw a lot of fired flint in Ohio-


Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: Vulkanman] #193528
10/04/11 04:14 AM
10/04/11 04:14 AM
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I'll post a photo soon, Troy. Thanks.

Vulkanman, a lot of very nice artifacts have been found in plowed fields in Ohio.

Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #194059
10/05/11 03:47 AM
10/05/11 03:47 AM
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Here are closer shots of the burgundy and whitish colored flint, BhamFred. I added a few closer shots of the better points and one of an unidentified artifact. Thanks.


Flint types:






Closer pics of best quartz points:







What is this artifact, please ??


Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #194060
10/05/11 04:24 AM
10/05/11 04:24 AM
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...cont'd...what is this artifact, please ??

Description: brownstone or river rock; 3" L x 1.5 " W; hood shaped; both ends are ground smooth, as is the entire stone; inside is channeled out from end to end...drilled and then ground out; shaped like a 'long "C" that is lightly taller at one end; inside hole is aprox. 1 1/16" across; very well made.

(all I can think of is a weight for an atlatl) ??










Handle of steatite (soapstone) vessel: I found 6 sherds...all w/gouge marks made when it was quarried and formed:



Cooking stones found pushed up by the D8...close to fire pits: one is really fancy made/decorated...others are plain:



Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #194064
10/05/11 05:17 AM
10/05/11 05:17 AM
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BhamFred Offline
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the drilled rock is probably an atlatl weight, I have one from the Moundville area that looks just like that.

the red points are heat altered river rock, Coosa chert, it normally is yellow. When heated it turns red and is easier to knap.

troy


I've spent most of the money I've made in my lifetime on hunting and fishing. The rest I just wasted.....

proud Cracker-Americaan

muslims are like coyotes, only good one is a dead one
Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #194087
10/05/11 06:32 AM
10/05/11 06:32 AM
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34°25'49.80"N 86°55'46.99"...
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Mission, you say that the d8 is pushing the artifacts up..how deep are they? This might be the coolest thread ever on aldeer. i've come across a few arrah heads thru the years. But to stand, obviously, where a village was hundreds of years ago and to hold the objects those folks worked with, made and used...that is totally awsome!


The harder I practice, the luckier I get.
Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #194127
10/05/11 08:08 AM
10/05/11 08:08 AM
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BhamFred Offline
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here is the atlatl weight I found near Moundville...




here is another one off the same site. It is not drilled, but gouged out like a canoe, called a boat stone...engraving on the ends and sides.




troy


I've spent most of the money I've made in my lifetime on hunting and fishing. The rest I just wasted.....

proud Cracker-Americaan

muslims are like coyotes, only good one is a dead one
Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: BhamFred] #194317
10/05/11 02:13 PM
10/05/11 02:13 PM
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Cool, Troy. Thanks much for the info and pics. I think you are 100% right...and it's a 'tie on' atlatl weight. My find is very-very similar to your find. (cool!) They're pretty rare to find as far as I can determine. It also resmbles a Boat Stone but the top of the hood isn't flat for standing up. It also has notches on either side and toward the presumed back...highest part of the hood...that would have allowed it to be secured to the atlatl proper. I'll research Coosa chert and see what I can find out where the probable quarry site of the Native Americans was located andd thus how far the Indians traveled to get it. I love this type info as much as finding the items. It all tells 'one' story of a great society of ancient American people. I'm truly glad I had the opportunity to save these artifacts from destruction or loss.

Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: gman] #194341
10/05/11 03:02 PM
10/05/11 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted By: gman
Mission, you say that the d8 is pushing the artifacts up..how deep are they? This might be the coolest thread ever on aldeer. i've come across a few arrah heads thru the years. But to stand, obviously, where a village was hundreds of years ago and to hold the objects those folks worked with, made and used...that is totally awsome!


gman, I'm very happy you have enjoyed the thread. Thanks for the kind words...and I feel the way you described when finding these items on my land. They were the original inhabitants of this land. Thank you !

The cat scraped the topsoil on average about 8" deep. The hilltop is (was) a very fallow, flat-top field which grew fine crops. Some small high spots were scraped down deeper for leveling-out and penetrated into the greyish subsoil (about 3" thick average); and often slightly into the red clay. I'd say this added another 3-plus inches of depth...or a total of approximately 11." Most of the items must have been unearthed from 7" - 9"...maybe 10" deep....called the "Archaic Level.' A few older Late Paleo items (eg., Dalton Chattahoochie point or the yellow patina flake knife) found in a smaller, specific area facing north by west, were the deepest artifacts. They were laying exposed atop the red clay...probably (originally) 12" down.

I'm still hunting 2 items on my place since 1968: 1) a crystal point which a particular ancient Native American knapper made. I've found one broken crystal quartz point (a Greenbrier base) and lots of crystal sherds/flakes from this ancient master's work places...but no intact point thus far. This man's points are perfectly clear as glass. 2) A Clovis fluted point. They probably predate the time of habitation of the oldest site here by 1-thousand years. I think I found 2 smaller 'non-fluted' Clovis points made of quartz but haven't had confirmation. I'm hopping for an isolated find; one either dropped and lost during a hunt, or, one stuck into a deer which got away.

Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #194364
10/05/11 03:44 PM
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Photo of Native American nutting stone for cracking hickory nuts and acorns; found in edge of my yard...100 yrds. from the site:




Edgefield knife or scraper from the site, found in a wash-out 2 yrs' ago:


Very old 'Indian Trail Tree'...75 yrds. from the site with 'nub' pointing due west: 123" around; Black Gum tree:



What I think are 2 Clovis non-fluted, quartz points:

(any help on ID would be appreciated)



Clear quartz base...assumed Greenbrier or Dalton Chattahoochie...found in my yard, 100 yards from the site:


Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #194713
10/06/11 07:00 AM
10/06/11 07:00 AM
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I've heard of the "trail trees" before. I've seen a couple disfigured like that on the farms I hunt. The ones I've seen aren't near as large...I just half assumed that it was formed naturally. May have to take a little closer look. I found a nutting stone or possibly a hammer stone this past summer scouting. Sent skinny a pic of it..


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Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #194726
10/06/11 07:38 AM
10/06/11 07:38 AM
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BhamFred Offline
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here's a small crystal quartz point I found in Georgia many years ago



don't see many of those points...

troy


I've spent most of the money I've made in my lifetime on hunting and fishing. The rest I just wasted.....

proud Cracker-Americaan

muslims are like coyotes, only good one is a dead one
Re: D8 cat revealed Indian artifacts [Re: mission] #194759
10/06/11 09:15 AM
10/06/11 09:15 AM
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Posts: 28
Skyline, AL
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Awesome thread! Thanks or sharing this with us.

I've been collecting artifacts since I was a kid and I have never ran across a site like you've got there. It will be a shame for someone to put a house on top of that not knowing what could be down there.

What county are you in? I've seen translucent quartz up here but never as clear as that dalton base you have. That is awesome.

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