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Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: WmHunter] #3312717
01/04/21 04:23 PM
01/04/21 04:23 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
Originally Posted by WmHunter
80 acres as a minimum

Land locked land that requires a deeded access - no way whatsoever.

If it has a deeded ROW, it ain't landlocked.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: ford150man] #3312725
01/04/21 04:33 PM
01/04/21 04:33 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,574
Tuscaloosa
H
hawndog Offline
8 point
hawndog  Offline
8 point
H
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,574
Tuscaloosa
All you need is enough land to park your truck... and a good pair of boots.

Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: ford150man] #3312871
01/04/21 06:21 PM
01/04/21 06:21 PM
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 2,070
Alabama
strikeu Offline
8 point
strikeu  Offline
8 point
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 2,070
Alabama
30, and not no, but Hell NO

Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: ford150man] #3312944
01/04/21 07:15 PM
01/04/21 07:15 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,513
limestone al
scrape Offline
10 point
scrape  Offline
10 point
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,513
limestone al
5 acres minimuim

Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: 2Dogs] #3313037
01/04/21 08:30 PM
01/04/21 08:30 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
Originally Posted by 2Dogs
I just don't see a problem with a unrestricted, deeded ROW , that runs in perpetuity with the property. I've got one and have granted them , no problem.


Several are strongly against a deeded ROW, but nobody has given good reasons why.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: 2Dogs] #3313047
01/04/21 08:39 PM
01/04/21 08:39 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,414
Scottsboro, Al
J
jbatey1 Offline
Lucky Bastage
jbatey1  Offline
Lucky Bastage
J
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 10,414
Scottsboro, Al
Originally Posted by 2Dogs
Originally Posted by 2Dogs
I just don't see a problem with a unrestricted, deeded ROW , that runs in perpetuity with the property. I've got one and have granted them , no problem.


Several are strongly against a deeded ROW, but nobody has given good reasons why.



Right, if anything, it’s more of a downside for the person who has to allow access across their property. Father in law bought 120 just to keep from anyone else having a ROW across our property. There’s a few parcels below us that is landlocked. We’ve kicked around the idea of making an offer on it. Dogs, is there a route for someone with landlocked land to gain ROW’s? And if so, how would they ever decide which route into the property becomes a ROW?


The fool tells me his reasons; the wise man persuades me with my own.
Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: ford150man] #3313052
01/04/21 08:43 PM
01/04/21 08:43 PM
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 22,129
blount county alabama
jwalker77 Offline
Pumpkin
jwalker77  Offline
Pumpkin
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 22,129
blount county alabama
Deeded right of ways are pretty common. Its on the deed. Its already there, probably has been for some time. What exactly is yalls problem with a deeded right of way. By yalls responses you would only want to hunt a small piece of property if its by a road? I think thats dumb my self.

Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: jbatey1] #3313072
01/04/21 08:55 PM
01/04/21 08:55 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
Originally Posted by jbatey1
Originally Posted by 2Dogs
Originally Posted by 2Dogs
I just don't see a problem with a unrestricted, deeded ROW , that runs in perpetuity with the property. I've got one and have granted them , no problem.


Several are strongly against a deeded ROW, but nobody has given good reasons why.



Right, if anything, it’s more of a downside for the person who has to allow access across their property. Father in law bought 120 just to keep from anyone else having a ROW across our property. There’s a few parcels below us that is landlocked. We’ve kicked around the idea of making an offer on it. Dogs, is there a route for someone with landlocked land to gain ROW’s? And if so, how would they ever decide which route into the property becomes a ROW?


Yes, there are provisions to secure a ROW through the courts. It can be a long and costly process. It is usually the closest and most accessible route to a public road. If a road already exists and has been in use it would likely get the nod. The route is determined by the court.
And you are correct, it could be more of a burden on the grantor of the ROW and the property affected.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: ford150man] #3313074
01/04/21 08:56 PM
01/04/21 08:56 PM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 15,313
Ourtown, AL
BCLC Offline
Old Mossy Horns
BCLC  Offline
Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 15,313
Ourtown, AL
I’ve been on both sides of the deeded ROW situation and they always go south if you own the property long enough. Reasons deeded ROW’s are not ideal for me:

1) reduced resale value (Albeit at a lower buy in but still reducing the number of potential buyers by 50% or more)
2) lower timber values because logging companies hate dealing with the hassle of multiple land owners
3) not being able to tell somebody not to drive thru your property in the middle of the rut or the middle of the night
4) can’t control who owns the property in the future
5) Road maintenance for twice the vehicle travel
6) Hard to keep up with everybody coming and going - owner, leasee, lessor, friend, family, poacher, trespasser, etc
7) they will shoot deer off your property, if they won’t their loggers will
8) they will catch fish out of your pond
9) they will steal your cameras
10) they will steal your stands
Etc etc etc

If you share deeded access and it hasn’t happened to you.....yet. Consider yourself lucky and blessed. All that changes if the other land owner ever sells and you aren’t the buyer.


We’re not dead. We just smell that way. Dayum. - AC870

Yessir! I’m always gonna shoot what makes me happy and I want everyone else to do the same! If you shoot one be proud of it and don’t worry what anyone else thinks. - SJ22
Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: BCLC] #3313084
01/04/21 09:02 PM
01/04/21 09:02 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
Originally Posted by BCLC
I’ve been on both sides of the deeded ROW situation and they always go south if you own the property long enough. Reasons deeded ROW’s are not ideal for me:

1) reduced resale value (Albeit at a lower buy in but still reducing the number of potential buyers by 50% or more)
2) lower timber values because logging companies hate dealing with the hassle of multiple land owners
3) not being able to tell somebody not to drive thru your property in the middle of the rut or the middle of the night
4) can’t control who owns the property in the future
5) Road maintenance for twice the vehicle travel
6) Hard to keep up with everybody coming and going - owner, leasee, lessor, friend, family, poacher, trespasser, etc
7) they will shoot deer off your property, if they won’t their loggers will
8) they will catch fish out of your pond
9) they will steal your cameras
10) they will steal your stands
Etc etc etc

If you shared deeded access and it hasn’t happened to you.....yet. Consider yourself lucky and blessed. All that changes if the other land owner ever sells and you aren’t the buyer.


Your reasons sound like a reason not to grant a ROW across your property not to have one to your property. That's not what the OP asked about, he wanted to know about a buying a property with a deeded ROW to it.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: ford150man] #3313085
01/04/21 09:02 PM
01/04/21 09:02 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 3,532
Lower Alabama
Andalusia Offline
10 point
Andalusia  Offline
10 point
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 3,532
Lower Alabama
If the ROW has very specific language to address all reasonable possibilities so both parties know what they can and can't do then they are OK. I would still prefer not to deal with a ROW if possible due to the issues mentioned below.

But there can be issues which may lead to legal problems depending on how the parties interpret the ROW or how they behave. Here is just one of many articles on the internet outlining areas of concern:



Tread Carefully: 10 Considerations for Right of Way Agreements
May 25, 2015

Every party to a Right of Way has some idea of what that Right of Way is – but many times, those ideas are different. This failure to clarify what both parties actually intended can be a road to lengthy, costly, and acrimonious disputes between the current or subsequent owners of the road, and people who think they have certain rights to use the Right of Way. A written Right of Way Agreement signed at the front end is a relatively easy way to avoid this. You just need to put your mind to the issues up front.

Right of Way Gone Wrong

A private Right of Way typically gives one land owner the right to use another’s property, usually a road of some kind, to get to and from her land. This right is usually given in the form of a deed, much like a deed to property. Every party to a Right of Way thinks she understands how the Right of Way can be used – but many times, each party’s understanding is very different.

The deed granting a Right of Way is often vague, and doesn’t help clarify things. For example, the deed granting one person the right to use another person’s road will often say something like, “together with a Right of Way over the existing road to access and egress the [property]”, and any subsequent deed to the road say “subject to a Right of Way over the existing road”. Often, there’s no other written documentation giving further details about what the parties (the owner(s) and the user(s) of the Right of Way) actually intended – and understood – the right of way to mean.

This failure to clarify what both parties mean can be a road to lengthy, costly, and acrimonious disputes between the current or subsequent owners of the road, and people who think they have certain rights to use the Right of Way, about what the original parties to it actually intended. Unfortunately, those disputes sometimes lead to lawsuits. What could have been easily settled up front may now be left, years later, to a court to decide – and neither party may be happy with the result.

An Alternate Road

An alternate road: a well drafted Right of Way Agreement – one that carefully and completely sets out the intentions and expectations of both the person who granted the Right of Way and the intended user of it, signed by both at the time the Right of Way is granted and binding on their heirs, successors, and assigns – will benefit the original owner and user, and any subsequent owners and users.

The specific issues owners and users should consider when drafting a Right of Way Agreement are different in every situation. Here are 10 basic considerations to get you started:

Location. Where exactly is the Right of Way? Is its location properly defined? What are its boundaries? How wide is it intended to be? Is a survey required?

Use & Purpose. What use can be made of the Right of Way? Is it for pedestrians only? For cars only? What about trucks or heavy equipment? Is the use of the Right of Way restricted to access to and from the user’s (that is, the person to whom the Right of Way is granted) land? Can the Right of Way be used, for example, to service, maintain, repair, renovate or construct existing or new buildings on her land? Can they temporarily block the Right of Way for this purpose, and if so for how long?

Users. Can guests use the Right of Way? What about others, like contractors, clients, and delivery people? Can commercial vehicles intending to service/maintain the user’s land make use of the Right of Way?

Parking. Can anyone park on the Right of Way? If so, when and for how long? Guests only? Contractors?

Maintenance & Repair. Who’s responsible for maintaining and repairing the Right of Way? Who’s responsible for paying to snowplow it? Who decides when maintenance or repairs are required, and who’s responsible for paying for them?

Improvement. Can either party improve the Right of Way, such as by grading, paving or installing new drainage systems? Who can decide when and what improvements? Who’s responsible for paying for any improvements?

Change. Can the use of the Right of Way be changed if there’s a change in the use of the land that the Right of Way benefits? Can either party increase the use of the Right of Way at anytime?

Restrictions. Can either party restrict the use of the Right of Way by others? Can either party install a gate on the Right of Way?

Compensation. Who’s responsible if someone suffers loss, damage, or injury while using the Right of Way? Should one party be required to compensate the other if a user is harmed?

Termination. Can either party terminate the Right of Way in the future if it’s not used at all, or if it’s used in way that violates the Right of Way Agreement?


"If you are the smartest person in the room, you're in the wrong room"

"How you do Anything, is how you do Everything"

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it"
Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: Andalusia] #3313097
01/04/21 09:14 PM
01/04/21 09:14 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
Originally Posted by Andalusia
If the ROW has very specific language to address all reasonable possibilities so both parties know what they can and can't do then they are OK. I would still prefer not to deal with a ROW if possible due to the issues mentioned below.

But there can be issues which may lead to legal problems depending on how the parties interpret the ROW or how they behave. Here is just one of many articles on the internet outlining areas of concern:



Tread Carefully: 10 Considerations for Right of Way Agreements
May 25, 2015

Every party to a Right of Way has some idea of what that Right of Way is – but many times, those ideas are different. This failure to clarify what both parties actually intended can be a road to lengthy, costly, and acrimonious disputes between the current or subsequent owners of the road, and people who think they have certain rights to use the Right of Way. A written Right of Way Agreement signed at the front end is a relatively easy way to avoid this. You just need to put your mind to the issues up front.

Right of Way Gone Wrong

A private Right of Way typically gives one land owner the right to use another’s property, usually a road of some kind, to get to and from her land. This right is usually given in the form of a deed, much like a deed to property. Every party to a Right of Way thinks she understands how the Right of Way can be used – but many times, each party’s understanding is very different.

The deed granting a Right of Way is often vague, and doesn’t help clarify things. For example, the deed granting one person the right to use another person’s road will often say something like, “together with a Right of Way over the existing road to access and egress the [property]”, and any subsequent deed to the road say “subject to a Right of Way over the existing road”. Often, there’s no other written documentation giving further details about what the parties (the owner(s) and the user(s) of the Right of Way) actually intended – and understood – the right of way to mean.

This failure to clarify what both parties mean can be a road to lengthy, costly, and acrimonious disputes between the current or subsequent owners of the road, and people who think they have certain rights to use the Right of Way, about what the original parties to it actually intended. Unfortunately, those disputes sometimes lead to lawsuits. What could have been easily settled up front may now be left, years later, to a court to decide – and neither party may be happy with the result.

An Alternate Road

An alternate road: a well drafted Right of Way Agreement – one that carefully and completely sets out the intentions and expectations of both the person who granted the Right of Way and the intended user of it, signed by both at the time the Right of Way is granted and binding on their heirs, successors, and assigns – will benefit the original owner and user, and any subsequent owners and users.

The specific issues owners and users should consider when drafting a Right of Way Agreement are different in every situation. Here are 10 basic considerations to get you started:

Location. Where exactly is the Right of Way? Is its location properly defined? What are its boundaries? How wide is it intended to be? Is a survey required?

Use & Purpose. What use can be made of the Right of Way? Is it for pedestrians only? For cars only? What about trucks or heavy equipment? Is the use of the Right of Way restricted to access to and from the user’s (that is, the person to whom the Right of Way is granted) land? Can the Right of Way be used, for example, to service, maintain, repair, renovate or construct existing or new buildings on her land? Can they temporarily block the Right of Way for this purpose, and if so for how long?

Users. Can guests use the Right of Way? What about others, like contractors, clients, and delivery people? Can commercial vehicles intending to service/maintain the user’s land make use of the Right of Way?

Parking. Can anyone park on the Right of Way? If so, when and for how long? Guests only? Contractors?

Maintenance & Repair. Who’s responsible for maintaining and repairing the Right of Way? Who’s responsible for paying to snowplow it? Who decides when maintenance or repairs are required, and who’s responsible for paying for them?

Improvement. Can either party improve the Right of Way, such as by grading, paving or installing new drainage systems? Who can decide when and what improvements? Who’s responsible for paying for any improvements?

Change. Can the use of the Right of Way be changed if there’s a change in the use of the land that the Right of Way benefits? Can either party increase the use of the Right of Way at anytime?

Restrictions. Can either party restrict the use of the Right of Way by others? Can either party install a gate on the Right of Way?

Compensation. Who’s responsible if someone suffers loss, damage, or injury while using the Right of Way? Should one party be required to compensate the other if a user is harmed?

Termination. Can either party terminate the Right of Way in the future if it’s not used at all, or if it’s used in way that violates the Right of Way Agreement?





They don't have to be that complicated to get the job done and be fair to both parties.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: 2Dogs] #3313099
01/04/21 09:15 PM
01/04/21 09:15 PM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 15,313
Ourtown, AL
BCLC Offline
Old Mossy Horns
BCLC  Offline
Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 15,313
Ourtown, AL
Originally Posted by 2Dogs

Your reasons sound like a reason not to grant a ROW across your property not to have one to your property. That's not what the OP asked about, he wanted to know about a buying a property with a deeded ROW to it.


1 & 2 are specifically for tracts that are granted access but if you’re so naive as to think the others can’t happen in both situations you’re sorely mistaken. I won’t post any more in your pro-ROW conversation with the OP.


We’re not dead. We just smell that way. Dayum. - AC870

Yessir! I’m always gonna shoot what makes me happy and I want everyone else to do the same! If you shoot one be proud of it and don’t worry what anyone else thinks. - SJ22
Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: ford150man] #3313105
01/04/21 09:22 PM
01/04/21 09:22 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 3,532
Lower Alabama
Andalusia Offline
10 point
Andalusia  Offline
10 point
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 3,532
Lower Alabama
Ford150man: Good luck with your property search. Finding that right property should be fun and exciting!

Last edited by Andalusia; 01/04/21 09:23 PM.

"If you are the smartest person in the room, you're in the wrong room"

"How you do Anything, is how you do Everything"

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it"
Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: ford150man] #3313123
01/04/21 09:38 PM
01/04/21 09:38 PM
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 16,822
Banana Republic
jb20 Online shocked
Old Mossy Horns
jb20  Online Shocked
Old Mossy Horns
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 16,822
Banana Republic
My suggestion is find some land to buy that has landlocked land behind it with an owner that has money...


They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
Ben Franklin
Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: BCLC] #3313140
01/04/21 09:49 PM
01/04/21 09:49 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
Originally Posted by BCLC
Originally Posted by 2Dogs

Your reasons sound like a reason not to grant a ROW across your property not to have one to your property. That's not what the OP asked about, he wanted to know about a buying a property with a deeded ROW to it.


1 & 2 are specifically for tracts that are granted access but if you’re so naive as to think the others can’t happen in both situations you’re sorely mistaken. I won’t post any more in your pro-ROW conversation with the OP.


1. Landlocked property is worth more than one with a ROW?
2. Loggers will walk away from a good tract of timber because it has a deeded ROW?
Naive perhaps, I've been grantee and grantor to temporary easements to remove timber. Likewise I been both grantor and grantee to Deeded ROW that run in perpetuity. I've also granted water rights. Never had any problems.
Sounds like you entered into a bad situation.

Last edited by 2Dogs; 01/04/21 10:04 PM.


"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: ford150man] #3313181
01/04/21 10:53 PM
01/04/21 10:53 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,498
Gadsden
D
desertdog Offline
8 point
desertdog  Offline
8 point
D
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,498
Gadsden
2 Dogs do many tracks of land come available in your area. In the 40 to 80 acre range?

Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: desertdog] #3313202
01/04/21 11:06 PM
01/04/21 11:06 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
2Dogs Offline
Freak of Nature
2Dogs  Offline
Freak of Nature
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 34,402
Boxes Cove
Originally Posted by desertdog
2 Dogs do many tracks of land come available in your area. In the 40 to 80 acre range?

Tracts of all sizes sell. Dang land is getting high up here, even mountain land . The sorriest, roughest limestone and cedar ridges are 1,000 per acre minimum.



"Why do you ask"?

Always vote the slowest path to socialism.







Re: Land buying spin-off [Re: ford150man] #3313205
01/04/21 11:11 PM
01/04/21 11:11 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,498
Gadsden
D
desertdog Offline
8 point
desertdog  Offline
8 point
D
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,498
Gadsden
That's what I was thinking! It seems to be a sellers market right now to.

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