Hay vs row crops

From a wildlife standpoint, turkey and deer hunting- which would you prefer.. fields of good grass year around or rowcrop while its there, but pretty much bare fields after its harvest until its replant?

We are pulling approx 100 acres of our farm out of row crop rotation for a year or so. Depending on things, it may or may not even go back into rotation. I’ve thought about putting it into hay, either doing it myself or just going the rent route. We have no use for hay since we don’t have animals so it would be to sell and to keep the fields looking good. Way back, the property was in hay and my wife much preferred the property when we had “pretty” hay fields than when its in corn or beans.

I’ve had people tell me they think a property is better when row cropped, I’ve had others tell me they think a property is better when it has good grass year around. Ya’ll have an opinion?

From a dollar standpoint, I don’t even know what hay sells for or how worthwhile it is or isn’t doing it yourself vs renting.

I dont think grass that's sold for hay has any real benefit to wildlife.

If you’re trying to capitalize on or maximize wildlife/agricultural value then hay is not a good choice. It’s actually at the bottom of the list of possibilities. I’d do rotational row crops.

100 acres is a lot of open ground. If it was me I’d rotate on 1/3’s or 1/4’s and burn, let grow, plant crops and leave standing etc.

Neither harvested row crop or hay provides much benefit in the winter

That was my problem with row cropping, it’s great when crops are there, but after harvest, those fields are somewhat of a Barren wasteland for the most part with the exception of what naturally pops up, or the areas I plant. But once its sprayed in the spring before planting, its dead again. Maybe next year if we get back into row cropping it I’ll talk to the farmers about doing a winter crop.

You don’t think it acts like a year around food plot?

Not grasses like bahia and bermuda .......deer dont really utilize those and I dont believe their good for turkeys either.......If you wanted something that would be good for wildlife then maintain it a natural prairie of early successional plants......

I’m interested, but don’t know what you mean by maintain it a natural prairie of early successional plants.
Can you go a little deeper about that? Or do you mean just let Mother Nature do what Mother Nature does with it?

Let me back up a little bit......You actually could still do the hay thing and utilize crimson clover in the fields.......Look beneath this deer at what's growing in this hayfield. This was a place where the cattle farmer had all his hayfields sowed in clover as well......I dont know what grass he was growing it with.

Also, when I use the term hay, I may not even be using the correct term since I don’t know what most people plant as “hay”. Let’s say I planted the whole property in Triticale and Clover. And cut and bailed it as needed.

Yes basically let mother nature do what she does but help her along with how you go about managing it and setting back succession…….Try to improve the fertility and diversity over time…… There's lots of options for things you could do in this scenario

I can promise you a hay field will hold deer all winter long with enough fertilizer and Marshall rye. Established clover. Will be a plus.
We drill rye for our first 2 cuttings and fertilize heavy with litter. Never have a problem with seeing animals in it. Especially deer.

Hay guys won't pay the landowner nowhere near what row crop will. Why not stick with row crop and plant some "cover/plot crop" after the crops are gathered?

That’s what I wanted from our current farmers, but they wouldn’t do it for whatever reason. I’ve had many people ask why we didn’t cover with something like winter wheat, I have no answer as to why it felt like it shouldn’t be done. We are postponing any farming for this year because of some legality things dealing with us finalizing the buyout of the other family member.

If I can talk our farmers into going that route, it would be ideal. If not, I may shop it around a little.

What my uncle does here around the house since he is in the bay business is cut the last cut of bahayia off of the fields around the first of October to the end of October. Then he will plant rye grass or drill wheat or oats in them so the deer have big fields to eat on and he will start cutting hay off of it again around the first to middle of march. A lot of stuff he green bales for farmers around here as well. Its year round deal for him

You could plant some of it yourself after they got the crop out. Then let them spray or plow it up in Spring to plant the normal crops.

I think its gonna come down to a matter of cost versus benefit in the end……With it being 100 acres then cost will add up quick……..$100 per acre puts you at $10K……..So you gotta ask yourself……”Is what I’m doing giving me $10K worth of value in results over what I could have done for $1K in cost ????......For someone renting farm land I suppose that money for a cover crop only represents cost to them since they don’t own the land.

Likely you lowest cost per acre for producing good wildlife habitat is to maintain it in “weedy clover” using fire, mowing, and spreading a little clover seed here and there as your means of managing it. Really all you’re doing is adding cheap clover to the “native prairie” to give it a legume in the mix for some N help and something else the deer like to eat.

The NRCS will pay dollars per acre for cover cropping. Check with your county office. It would literally be a food plot. Some folks around me do it.

Up here I have a deal with the farmer that rents my farm land to leave some crops in the field. It is a magnet every year.

All those big deer we had in the black belt years ago was due to row crops and more importantly, well fertilized cow pastures that were loaded with all verities of clover. Deer will feed all year long in pastures, but row crop is only good a few months a year and that’s if the right crop is planted.

Alfalfa hay

Why not broadcast clover into it? Seems like the added nitrogen would benefit it for hay production.

OK, if you rent it to hay guys , they won't pay what row crop will per acre, they will want to sow something their cows want ( prolly something deer won't eat) , they will want a lease for several years. If you sow it yourself and then try to get a hay guy to cut it , once again , he ain't gonna want "deer hay" . And you don't even want to think about going in the hay biz and buying a cutter , rake and roller.

Very expensive to grow down here for hay.

Just out of curiosity.......what is the going rate for leasing pasture land to run cows on?

I have no clue, but have zero interest in having cattle on this property.

I’ll probably just stick the route with row cropping, work a deal to leave some crops standing at harvest and utilize certain large portions of the fields as really well done food plots.

One thought I’ve had- Is there anything I could drill after their last spraying and before they drill their corn or beans into the ground that would grow until the corn or beans got tall enough to keep sunlight from it and then rejuvenate once sunlight hit it again after harvest of crops?

I would vote leave it in row crops and look into funding to plant all/most in cover crops for winter.

Unless, you have a lack of bedding on your piece of property/surrounding property. Are there other crop fields near by that the deer can still feed in? If yes, then I would vote on turning your 100 acres of field into early successional habitat and manage it with fire and discing. If you're the best bedding around you will have piles of deer on your place and still be providing food for them with quality early successional habitat.

I gotcha………I was just curious if there were folks who leased stuff by the month…….With many of these options you have the task ay some point of having to reset succession whether that means you mow, burn, bale hay, or have some guy pay you to run his cows on it some during the summer to take some stress off of his pastures

Carry on......

Good bedding now in the area and I have 120 acres of thick nasty bedding.Approx 600 acres of timber will be harvested starting sometime in the next few years. At that point the 100 acres of fields will be essentially surrounded by 700 acres of bedding. My ideas of what to do with the fields are somewhat in prep for the surrounding habitat changing and getting drastically better post timber harvest.

I guess in my eyes, the fields won’t need to serve as cover, but I would like them to provide as much food as possible year around.

Short term or for a singular year every 10 years or however often- I may not be opposed to that. I read it as you meaning to turn it to cattle farm 100 percent in perpetuity lol. All that fresh manure has to be good for the dirt.

I’m waiting for the day that my daughter asks why we don’t have horses on our farm like other farms…. Because I’m sure we’ll end up with horses 😂

Whatever works for you and the guy down the road with cows……You basically want to do graze/rest…..graze/rest cycles………The amount of time for each is something you’ll learn to eyeball based on the rate of stocking…… What you don’t want to do is turn so many loose and leave them in there so long they that they turn it into a worn out pasture. You just want them to keep the vegetation in early successional stages.

Talked to my FIL who rents a bunch of pasture land in Marshall Co..........Rent goes for $50-$60 an acre for a year long lease.

I’d keep it in row crops and start cover cropping with wheat. That’s what has been done before on my club, and the deer would pile out into them in the evenings.

I don't think you just start doing whatever if you have leased it to a farmer to plant. I'm not thinking you are going to start telling the farmer what he should be doing and what he can and can't do. Probably for hay as well.

I am only saying this because I've seen several tracts of land get put in pines recently where they had some type of dispute with a farmer about something pretty minor in my book. Depending on the farmer they aren't necessarily playing around with their livelihoods. For example one farmer got told he couldn't get his crop out when he felt like he needed to get in there and cut it.... He cut it per the landowner's schedule. Then he packed his crap up left and hasn't been back. Really nice fields with historically high yields. You throw the wheat - farmer might throw you a bill for having to spray.

I am not saying that's what this situation is... but be careful in that mentality where you think you are going to do this or that. Everyone better get on same page beforehand.

Maybe I missed some posts, or came across with the wrong tone. I’m not looking to strong arm anyone. Me and my farmers have had a great relationship, but I don’t see an issue with asking them about doing a cover crop or finding another outfit that’s views align with the landowner in terms of also wanting the fields to be useable for deer in the winter time.

As it is, once they harvest the crop, I come in behind and plant my plots. In the spring they spray them dead. They know I plant plots in my fields and I know they will spray them dead anytime starting about march 1st. It’s a clear understanding with no problem. But as the landowner and also as the farmer, everyone would benefit from having a cover crop wouldn’t they?

I don’t know what winter wheat produces in terms of money, but it would produce revenue for a farmer wouldn’t it?

Wheat would only benefit the farmer if he already had the equipment needed to combine the wheat. Also it comes off later and negates planting in corn. Wheat is usually followed by soybeans. What I would do is take the outer rows against the woods, say 10-12 feet and plant it in clovers, winter wheat or whatever. Usually that is the least fertile land due to trees sucking the nutrients out of the dirt anyway. It's a win win as your crops are out of the way of the farmer and you'll still get an attractant/ food source for animals. And it wouldn't be a big expense for you or the farmer.

Now there's an idea.

Its pricey, but the only thing I have seen that really excels there is durana clover. That stuff has filled in all the bare sports I struggled to get stuff to grow on.

The man who leases our open ground plants soybeans in spring and winter wheat in the fall.

We have a great relationship with him and that works out great for us. Only problem is when a neighbors cows get out and get in our fields.

I told my neighbor he owes me a case of shotgun shells. He asked me why, I told him bc I been puttin his cows back in the pasture, off of our rye.

CRP and let the government pay you rent.

Row crop (soybeans are the best for your deer’s antlers imho) and winter wheat cover crop. Have no idea why your previous leassors wouldn’t want to do that. Row Crop ground down here goes for big $$ ($150 plus per acre per year for a lot of it, minimum $100). Cattle pasture rent is closer to $25-50.

Winter wheat as a cover crop suppresses other noxious winter weeds and produces biomass to add back to the dirt. It’s really a no brainer. It provides more $ in benefits than it costs (according to what the farmers I know have told me). It can be carried to harvest if the price is good ($12 per bushel last year I heard) or sprayed and killed or cut and baled for hay. Only downside to harvesting it is if you want to plant cotton or peanuts behind it, they’re going to be planted later than they should. If you get an early frost on late planted cotton or peanuts it can be very bad.

I don’t know where you are or how many farmers there are in the area, but down here land to rent is fought for, almost physically sometimes. It’s dog eat dog. You should NEVER have trouble finding a renter you can work with. Advertise it and see how many people call you.

Durana clover is absolutely the best thing I have found for this. Every field I have planted it on, is has spread over into these area's, and I have tried to get other forage crops to grow there.

I would seriously consider doing a portion in crp and leaving a portion in row crop. From discussions I’ve had with landowners in Kentucky, they are making the same odd crp as they do share cropping.

I’d continue with the row cropping, but block out a really nice permanent clover plot or two. That way, you’re still getting most of your land rent and you can have you a couple year round plots and you and your farmer don’t have to juggle schedules around each other.

Cover crops which are also typical deer plot plants.

The NRCS pays a nominal amount per acre to cover crop if your farmer is interested. It’s usually brassicas and the like which would be great.

There's no money in hay, for the person who rents the land to someone, or the person who rents the land from someone.

I’ve been trying to give it away if someone would cut it haven’t had a taker yet.

I can testify to that ^^^^^^.