Baiting vs Food Plots

Who’s just going to bait now versus food plots?

They're both a form of baiting. One's just more easily defined and excoriated as "unsporting."

Hell of a lot cheaper to do food plots, but yes I agree, there's no difference between the two, IMO.

If it's going to cost me $50 to hunt over a feeder, I won't.

All this is going to do is make it easier for people who already simply hunt to just shoot something.... that being mainly young deer that will ultimately show themselves at a feeder during daylight hours. In particular ammo sales will go up if we get some cold weather. Young Bucks and Does will be the victims. You won't be able to beat them off the feeder with 5 boxes of shells. Same deer that show up first to the food plots... first one that sticks it's nose out gets it blown off. Same group of hunters.

Kill more spikes. Kill more does. Still won't report their kills. Less Effort.

Result = Pretty much no serious impact.

I agree with most of your post but here in North Alabama we already don’t have a lot of deer, I think it will make an impact because of all the doe killing that’s going to happen

Agree... If you have low numbers and neighbors that like to kill anything with hair on it.... this should seal your fate.

wont hunt over the feeder, or wont pay? ha

For those who don't understand the difference, come to my house and I will explain it.

I don't know what part of North Alabama that you're talking about. The part of North Alabama that I stays in is covered up with deer. More than were around in the 70's, 80's or 90's. Kill em all.

Marshall County has areas virtually devoid of deer. Parts of Morgan County, too. By that I mean a huntable population that can withstand hunting pressure and mortality, even extremely limited, along with natural mortality.

I imagine the old guys I hunt with are going to go “corn crazy” if this bill passes we already have 2 feeders on our 300 acres. I imagine we’ll move those 2 feeders into a field or infront of a stand, or well put a stand 50 yards away from the feeders.

One of the guys has already talked about what greenfields he would like to put a feeder in if the bill ever passed. To answer tquestion though, we’ll definitely still plant greenfields.

And like Clem said food plots are just a legal, less frowned upon method of baiting.

I hunt Central Alabama. Deer density is average. We have some nice bucks on the place. We had 8 members last year. 4 of them used corn regularly. None of those 4 killed anything to write home about. One guy killed a basket 8 point. Maybe a doe or 2. Now they had a million pictures of nice bucks. But all they did, was turn a nocturnal animal into an even more nocturnal animal. Those shooters were showing up every night around 11:30 PM to wipe out the corn. Repeat the next night and so forth. They couldn't understand why they wasn't seeing the good bucks during their hunts. Jackwagons…

I bow hunted in Laredo, TX a few years ago. Corn is legal. You can pour the corn there, walk to your blind and by the time you zip it up, the deer start coming. I haven't seen it work that way where I hunt in Alabama. It hurt us this year. In my opinion. But to each his own.

Deer are crepuscular, not nocturnal. They move every 4-6 hours no matter what but mostly at dusk and dawn. Hunting pressure, noise and and unfamiliar smells are more apt to keep them from being seen than corn.

https://crepuscularstuff.com/are-deer-crepuscular-nocturnal-or-diurnal/


Like you, I've seen deer and hogs show up at a spincast feeder within minutes of it going off. They know what it is, where it is and when it goes off. Have seen this in Florida, Georgia, Alabama, Texas and 5-6 other states during hunting season or outside of it. They're highly trainable animals.

Won't hunt over a feeder.

Always do everything I can to stay legal. Now I guess you'll be able to follow the "area definition" rule and risk officer discression (from what I've read), or as a NR pay $51 and hunt where you can see it and not worry about a ticket? Seems silly to me. Easier not to bother with a feeder.

The one private place I can hunt over a feeder in Fl, the deer don't really seem that drawn to corn that much. I imagine it could very well be different in Al. I know they dont give a darn about salt in Fl, and they sure seem to in Al. I guess it will still be alright to have a feeder to get pics off of in the off season (without extra cost)? Would have been nice not to have to worry about a granule or 2 that didn't get consumed by season.

I believe corn and protein in Texas are different from here because they run feeders year round, not just during deer season.

There are no deer on the low fence ranch I hunted near Laredo last year that can remember a time with no feeders. I am aware of 11 deer over 5 years old killed in daylight hours on that ranch, 4 during the 4 days that I was there.

I killed two of those, and personally saw another 12-15 mature bucks, over 4 years old, at or near feeders. Some came to eat, and some came for the does.

Corn is legal in Georgia, and the feeder in my food plot was turned on last year when that changed. It will be filled and run at least a little year round as long as I own the property.

He who has the does, will draw the bucks from his neighbors.

I had an outstanding season this past year. 6 bucks total, 2 chasing does, 2 at/near feeders, and 2 on green fields, all low/no fence private land. Personally, I don't see the difference between feeders, food plots, and hunting near estrus does. They are all attractants, same as persimmon trees, fall apple trees, and good acorn crops. Whether you planted or scattered it has little to do with you hunting an attractant/food source.

I like it when our neighbors are running feeders. All the hogs disappear and we get to shoot deer for a change.

I keep reading how feeders make bucks more nocturnal. How so?

I have no real experience with feeders, so maybe I'm missing something. I just dont see why it would.

I don't buy it either, I wouldn't think any more than over hunting plots or over hunting a general area.

I concur , newbie should get out more. Maybe some pockets of NA don't have many deer , but they may have a young, expanding herd and can't support a lot of deer anyway. Can't paint all of NA with the same brush.

extra traffic to and from to fill and check cameras, the unnatural sound of sheet metal slinging corn, the fact that the food is always there so no need to show up in daylight. mature bucks are strange I've killed 130-140 class deer I've only had one or two pictures of and they were never at a feeder the younger bucks they ran with were all summer but the biguns almost have a 6th sense they were always 50 yards away and never at the feeder.

Sounds no different than too much pressure during season, over hunting plots, ripping and roaring on ATVs , checking cameras every other day. Too much human intrusion of any kind will make some bucks nocturnal. Some may still be on their feet in daylight, they just shy away from the high pressure areas.

The feeder I run holds 300 lbs, and will last 7-8 weeks at 5 seconds, twice a day, at 7:30 AM and 4:30 PM. There is no corn left for the nocturnal deer.

Last filling is 2 weeks before gun season comes in here (Georgia) in mid-October. I don't mess with it again until after Thanksgiving, then not until season closes in January.

I saw deer every time I sat, including a big 8 that I aged at 4.5+, and hoped my wife would get a shot at. She saw the same deer once, but couldn't get on him as he walked through.

I have heard this many times before but still don't get it. I can make a 50 bag of corn go for nearly 2 weeks on my feeder during the off season and still get more pics of deer eating than I care to look at some times. It's corn that folks like 257Weatherby have paid for equipment, fuel, herbicides, fertilizers and prayed for rain(or lack there of) to produce.
I just pay $7 and load that 5 gallon bucket with a spinny thingy up and check batteries on the camera.

What am I missing? If you already have the equipment and don't buy it special to food plotting maybe but most folks don't own a tractor nevermind the accessories.

With all that said, I like growing my own little plots and watching them produce but cheaper...I ain't so sure especially if you figure in time with growing bigger plots.

Is this why mature bucks don't show up at and around feeders in Texas, Kansas, Ohio and other states?

Or is the "big bucks are wary and "nocturnal" because of feeders" only happening in Alabama?

Except for that $15,000 tractor and disc.

Pressure (messing with cameras and looking for tracks) is the main thing that make deer nocturnal.

I think the primary difference between ‘baiting’ and planting a plot is that baiting, generally, creates an unnatural feeding instinct in the deer herd. Supplemental feeding out of troughs is the same thing. You take a wild animal which nature has created to walk around the forest and fields and nip and nibble it’s way through life, making use of what natural forage is appropriate for a given time of year. No where in nature does corn spill regularly from a metal drum. Acorns my fall from trees, for a while, but when they are gone they are gone until next season and the deer finds something else to eat. A planted plot, although man made, planted and maintained, mimics the old fields lost to pine plantation and the like. They certainly aren’t as important in places where large agricultural fields already exist as they are for people hunting thick forest areas. It’s plants growing from the soil, like any number of other growing things deer would normally nibble. Standing corn is also in a more or less natural presentation. Deer find it and feed when the corn is ready until it’s gone. Then move to another browse.
Baiting deer, with a recurring food source presented in a way unknown in the rest of their environment is not unlike encouraging bears to frequent your trash can. It isn’t good for the bears and isn’t really helping the deer.

What's your definition of bush hogged corn?

Bush hogged corn or soybeans or claypeas, etc, would be like any other offal from currently accepted agricultural practices. In my opinion if you planted, grew, and knocked it down in the same place that is no different than when I let winter wheat go the seed before mowing it back down.

Good explanation, sir.

Should the grain from perfectly good standing corn be defined as offal? I believe one should look at why the corn was grown and bush hogged, to entice deer. Is your mowed wheat to entice deer?

"The State" tells us we can clear a spot in the woods , plant a corn patch , bush hog it in fall , hunt over it and it's not bait. I call BS.

And "spillage" from harvesting grain is, well, y'know, "spillage" and that's OK.

But putting corn in a field is baiting.

Well there is a certain amount of spillage and knocked down rows in normal farm practices. Opening up the auger or the screens so perfectly marketable corn goes on the ground isn't normal farm practice, same as bush hogging .

State says opening the screens up on the combine, letting the grain go straight through out the back isn't baiting. They've done it on Skyline / Martin WMA. But that's not bait, I call a big ol' BS!

If the bill passes as it looks like it will, I will continue to plant food plots and put a feeder along the edge of the field. I've hunted with that combination a lot and usually the deer will come in and nibble around, go to the feeder and eat for 30 or so seconds and then go right back to the oats. A feeder by itself isn't a magic bean.

They only do this at night, though, right? Because feeders make deer nocturnal.

Yes

Well, if it does pass I hope all the DAs that put corn out in the woods to get pictures over will just put the damn corn and cameras in the foodplots. They will still get pictures of the same deer at the same time of the night and still wonder why they aren't seeing and killing the ginormous Midwest deer in the piney woods of Alabama. I said DAs didn't I??

Food plots do the same thing!

I believe both are beneficial if used right especially during off season.

We aren't there yet.....

Well keep in mind that this bill has been "an annual feature in the Alabama Legislature and has never passed both the House and Senate" and in so much as I have read and tracked the bill the approval of the Senate has not happened nor the approval of the Governor, who, I would guess, will most likely follow the path of the legislature. Last year the bill came up for vote 3 times and never passed the Senate.

This bill also only allows the use of baits on private or leased land. So baiting in the WMA and other public lands will remain illegal.

The bill contains the following verbage in regards to section 9-11-244 of Code of Alabama 1975.

the proposed subsection labeled (b)1 says this in regards to the preceding section that lays out baiting as illegal ("no person shall bait etc...").

"This section"... (the aforementioned section prohibiting the use of baits) ... "shall not apply to a person hunting whitetail deer or feral swine with the aid of bait on privately owned or leased lands; provided, that the person has purchased, and is in possession of, a bait privilege license issued by the Department of Conservation and Natural Resources as follows: " ......... and from there it goes on to outline the who, what, and how of the fees and goes on to talk about the commissioner may establish Chronic Wasting Disease management zones. Also goes on to state that "...no person shall use bait in any county containing any portion of a CWD management zone or other disease management zone..."

So take aways.... baiting is only going to be permissible on private to leased land is something of a take away.

"So take aways.... baiting is only going to be permissible on private to leased land is something of a take away." This is exactly why it should not be legalized! Given a choice the VAST MAJORITY of hunters would choose hunting PRIVATE land over PUBLIC land because it is BETTER hunting in the vast majority of places. If baiting is going to be legal it should be legal everywhere and the State public lands should be REQUIRED to set up permanent baiting stations and fees charged to ALL hunters the to pay for it.

However, if one believes that placed bait is the only way to kill a deer in Alabama, then maybe one needs to reconsider their hobbies.

I’m waiting for the “Why are there no deer at corn pile” thread

Nailed it

Well your only feeding one or two deer per day, whichever gets there first. A food plot will feed day and night 365 days a year(with rain). By only feeding one 5 gallon bucket of corn every 2 weeks your really just giving the deer a snack, which is fine, if that's what you want to do. You'll spend $7x26 weeks= $182 dollars. I can Feed deer year round on a food plot for that, plus I don't have to walk back in there every 2 weeks. Human intrusion is part of the problem in killing mature deer, but if your not interested in that, then carry on.

I don't use either to plant my plots.

Or how about a white oak that's the only one dropping in the area?

I can tell you the answer. Its the same for big boar hogs too. It doesn’t make them more nocturnal, they still move when they move but they get used to the food being there so they don’t have to rush to it like the young animals do and thus most times they choose after dark to come into the feeder. Many folk set there feeder in late afternoon or close to dark to put out so much that it doesn’t get eaten at once. I don’t use feeders because I rather it look like I’m not there. I think setting a corn feeder for just before daylight ONLY works best for having a big boar or buck pop in for a look see.

I know guys who get deer running in with only the sound of shaking of a bucket or a deer feeder on a predator call.

If you hunt over a well located green field or feeder and spend enough time doing so, the big boys will make a mistake sooner or later.

I haven’t tuned in to the new changes but I can tell y’all a trick that keeps them coming by. You take a block of Record Rack Wild berry and dig a hole to set it in, thats your feeder. They will tear the place up. You set it in the ground so they don’t roll it all over the woods. It’s natural color makes it vanish too so others won’t know. Once they get used to it you can just bring a chunk with you when you go to the stand then LOOKOUT !

https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/sportsmans-choice-record-rack-deer-block

Can you imagine the safety concerns, fights etc that would develop with corn piles on public lands? You could have 2 guys hunting the same corn pile and unintentionally pointing rifles at each other. There's no possible scenario where this could be safe or smart.

I agree, allowing baiting on public land would be extremely stupid and hazardous. Hell allowing baiting on private land is stupid enough as it is. Buncha dang lazy ass hunters in Alabama who just want to pour out there corn and kill a deer so they don't have to work for it.

I’m not a big bait person myself, usually its just to entertain myself or see what or what methods work. This debate will ALWAYS go on but in the end we must remember that if it gets more folk outside, its a good thing. The trophies killed over bait will still be slim unless the hunter really puts the time in and its a good location.

If it gets adopted like it is here in Tejas, you will be looked at terribly if you protest feeders.

"Given a choice the VAST MAJORITY of hunters would choose hunting PRIVATE land over PUBLIC land" Given a choice? Everybody has that exact choice right now. All you have to do is stroke a check if you want to hunt private. Therefore, the rest of your argument does not hold water. "Everyone in the state should have to pay so that there are bait stations on state land for public use to make sure that the people that make the choice to hunt state lands can hunt over public bait stations" ? Grow up man and look up the definition of Socialism. It dont fly with me. If better hunting is what you want, work a second job, marry someone with private land, friend someone that has land, budget better to be able to afford it. There's always options if you dont like your situation. For the record I'm 100% against baiting and think the fines should be 10x higher if you're caught hunting over it or it is found on the property you hunt.

If you don't want to hunt in an area with a feeder then don't. If the club/group you hunt with chooses to do so and you don't approve, then go somewhere else.

Fine job of missing the point and knowing nothing about me and I don't plan on educating anyone.

Thanks

I’ve personally come to the point I don’t care if its legal because its not the magic potion to taking a significant game animal.

I think if it passes all it’s going to do is increase hog sightings

I don’t see what the big deal is about the baiting. A ton of people already do it regardless of the law and I dont think it’s gonna change. If your in a club the rules in the club determine if you can put it out or not and the people that have their own land probably have been feeding for years. If your place is bad off with hogs like mine you will let your neighbors feed so all the hogs will be on them and the deer will be on our food plots. Then all the locals that pour corn out under the night light in the back yard to get them some meat will never be stopped and have been pouring corn all their lives. Just my opinion but I don’t really think it’s gonna matter people are still gonna do what they want when they want

They are literally banning feeding in Mississippi, county by county, as we speak. Once there’s a confirmed case of CWD in Bama, same thing will happen.

And there is no true scientific basis for banning feeding. Deer are social animals. I see more contact with the licking branch near one of my plots (which also has a feeder) than I ever do on a particular square foot of dirt. Literally every deer that can reach it, licks and rubs their face on it. I have also seen fawns stand on their back legs to try to do the same.

And they lick each other, regardless of the time of year or presence of bait/food. Banning feeding won't change that.

So, get married to someone for their land? That’ll last...
A “friend” that is “friends” with you because of what you have is no friend at all. If that’s really the way you think, I’m sure you’re a great friend and husband.

I personally don't care either way. In Washington and Choctaw county the majority of private land hunters are already baiting and hunting over it so i don't see a big change coming. I will not feed on my lease during deer season because all it does is attract hogs to the feeders and i don't shoot hogs during deer season unless they are in the woods away from fields to minimize pressure on the deer.

Right on

Just listing all the options for you slick. Didn't say I agreed or supported any of them. And I am a great friend and husband. Been married for 27 yrs.

Regardless of opinion, we're all gonna me master-baitin at the end of the day. And I aim to be this states best master-baiter.

Wait until the fights break out. There are gonna be those at certain clubs that are for feeders, they are gonna foot the bill for the equipment and bait then get ultra pissed when someone else hunts over it. This is gonna encourage a possessive entitlement mentality for supreme locations that would otherwise be free chase. It also forces everyone in the club to buy a permit whether they want to or not because they may have to hunt near bait or be cock blocked by feeding equipment.

They will use the excuse that “you have X-Amount of other acres to hunt, go hunt somewhere else”.

These type fights even break out on federal lands that I hunt with supposed civilized GI’s, Retired GI’s, Dependents, and Civil employees. Some folk don’t wanna share a shared spot.

And, when I’m hunting a shared spot I disable the feeders because I don’t want the noise.

A glimpse into the future

Wonder what % folks bait already. I would think this number is high. The Evergreen Piggly wiggly keeps a pallet of corn at the front door for $6.00 a bag and I will bet it ain't just for chickens.

I’m often accused of being cynical and not seeing the best in others but if I had to guess I would venture that at least 50% of every person that hunted in Alabama this year broke some kind of law WILLINGLY. The way people just non-chalantly talk about doing things like bait, or cross lines or shoot too late etc leads me to believe that.

Like most hunting clubs need another reason to squabble. If it wasn't that it would just be something else. To each his own.

jacannon.... there is no telling how many people were already baiting. I'd bet over 50%.

[quote=abolt300]
Just listing all the options for you slick. Didn't say I agreed or supported any of them. And I am a great friend and husband. Been married for 27 yrs. [quote]

I must’ve taken you’re post different than what you were saying then. Congrats on the 27 years!

Game check is only getting 35% participation, so your 50% is way too high right off the bat

You’re exactly right, so at a minimum 65% of hunters broke the law

Says who? Where does the 35% come from? I know Mr Sykes says it but is it accurate?

I stay within the law and if it passes I’m gonna put the feeder right under the skinning rack.

That's a dumb question. Dont you know everything Chucky says is accurate? Us peons have no business questioning him

Man, I'm really glad someone posted this. I was thinking we really needed to discuss it.

Im surprised no one has ever brought it up before.

The food plots I plant are FAR more beneficial to my deer herd than a corn feeder. I can grow more tonnage of deer food cheaper than corn.

There IS a difference!!

Give me food plots and I aint' talkin' ryegrass, either!!! "Oh, my food plots look so greeenn!!!" says a hunter. They're ryegrass, sir!! Anyway...

I don't plant ryegrass. Most people plant in the fall to "hunt" over... I'd like to think I do both. I feed my deer herd with quality food plots and I hunt over my food plots too.

Not real big into corn.

Ok

Would you hunt over a standing corn field? There is no difference, only in people's minds. Another elitist thinking their way is the only way. Food is food, period. Both attract deer, period.

Yer neighbor is gonna have all "your" deer, but they'll be nocturnal, so it won't matter.

I can't believe this thread is still going....

so now the real question Clorox brand vs. Dollar General brand bleach for your stumps?

Chlorox brand brings in the booners.

Stick with the good stuff. The cheap stuff grows cull bucks.

I would say that the difference is in the state laws and regulations instead of in people's minds. Your local GW would interpret it that way. I don't see anything elitist about that; it's just the law.

PCP, it's not against the law anymore, therefore there is no difference.

8/10

True.

Food plots were just legalized baiting. Now that baiting is legalized there's no difference.

Food plots = bait = not evil anymore = easy = "conservation!" = MONEY

Just curious, havn't read anything about it, but is there anything that is illegal to bait with? Brown salt, peanut butter, corn flakes, etc?

Only Tinks 69, .

Baiting is legal.....period. Give sweet potato’s a try. DeerLOVE the,!

CALD

Where, might I ask, do you get a truckload of sweet tat'rs in Alabama?

well, actually, there is a difference. One does not have to possess the "bait permit" to hunt a greenfield....so the State is saying that a greenfield is NOT bait.

High fence or a 4 ft barbwire

Yea, Fred, the state has been blowing that smoke up people's arses for years. I understand the legal difference, but i'm talking about reality.

Blumsden, I personally would not plant corn (unless I had acres of open, plantable land to "waste" on corn). Would I hunt over it? Yes, if it were there. But I'd rather plant something more nutritious and when done right, you can't tell me that, say, one acre of Triticale, Wheat, Oats, Brassicas, clovers, etc... is NOT better for wildlife than what the X amount corn that will be placed on hunting property by hunters. What's the comparison in nutrition and tonnage (given the food plot is fertilized, reasonable soil pH and a deer herd at carrying capacity) per acre of a higher-end food plot (I agree, rye grass ain't worth a dayum!) from late September - June vs. corn and what the average hunter is going to dump on the ground, feed from a feeder and keep in mind... most corn will cease to be made available to wildlife after Feb 10th!! And let's look at the ignorant feeding of corn where some hunters make an "ant bed style" corn pile that gets wet and produces alpha toxins.

You can call people like Antlerfluke (Antlerfluke and I work for the same company and hunt together on a rather large tract of land) and other dedicated hunters that believe in planting food plots in the fall to feed wildlife for several months AND kill deer over at the same time, an "elitist" group, because hunters like us don't put out food ONLY to kill over. We believe in feeding our deer herd the best way we can, in addition to putting out corn. Will we put out corn? Probably so, but it's not a big part of how we hunt. We "food plot" big time!

You say that "Food is Food" and coming from you after reading your posts, surprises me. That's like comparing a Hardee's double with cheese and bacon vs. baked chicken with steamed vegetables. Certainly you see the difference there!? So, "Food ain't food" when you compare the nutrition of a - say - brassicas vs. rye grass or corn.

No argument from me that "both" attract deer!!! I'm just saying that feeding corn and not planting food plots (with good cultivars) is not good deer mgmt. If you're all about the killing... then pour out corn! "Managing for the health of a deer herd" I supposed, when a majority of others are not, I supposed, if that's the case, I could be a proud elitists, as you say. But I don't think I am alone in my thinking.

If both the pouring of corn out and planting food plots were equal, why would Wildlife Mgmt Solutions, Biologic, Pennington Seed, etc... even exist? Hell, just go to Walmart and buy the "Deer" corn (no other corn will work, ya know?!) and pour "deer" corn out and stop doing it Feb 10th. (Most feeding stops on Feb 10th)

Both methods (poured-out corn vs. food plots) are the same, you say? Food is food, you say? In attraction, maybe. Mississippi State University didn't include corn in its deer preference study, which Berseem Clover won (I think Fixation Balansa may have placed high too), so I can't speak to the corn vs. Berseem clover match-up. But it appears that you and I look at deer mgmt or deer hunting differently. And that's ok. I'll stick with what I'm currently doing and I'll stay in-tune with what's best for the deer herd.

But NOPE, they're not the same!!! Properly planted food plots and corn poured out on the ground is NOT the same, and the saying of, "Food is Food", is NOT correct, IMO.

There IS a difference as far as the health of a deer herd is concerned.

There is also a difference in the bacteria of a deer's stomach in being able to digest a majority corn diet. Just what I read somewhere, so if there's a biologist that could touch on this subject.

Also, how much corn is actually broken-down and "digested" vs. corn that will leave the deer's digestive tract unblemished.

And, 1 lb of corn vs. 1 lb of brassicas and the respective palatability of both in deer. What's the nutritional value of each and of that nutritional value, how much of each is absorbed?

I don't know the answer to those questions but I supposed each of us can use our basic reasoning skills and come up with a ballpark answer in relation to one vs. the other.

Blumsden, I do love your T & M system and I will be implementing that approach this fall!

It is for me, as I don't intend to buy their baiting license. As far as I know, I can still plant on my land and hunt around whatever is planted without the baiting license, so the state must still recognize a difference between them.

Yep.

But just wait. Because someone eventually will say "Hey, that's not right. We're losing money because of those food plot guys" and will try something.

I have a sneaking suspicion about some other things, too. All the "It's just $15 bucks, don't be a selfish asshole" have been complicit to help open Pandora's box and don't care. One day, though, you will.

I plant summer and fall food plots, and I am well aware of the differences between the nutritional values of the two. Ask yourself this one question and be completely honest. If you didn't hunt, would you still plant foodplots? If not, well then you are baiting deer onto your property with food plots to help hold the deer. I'm sure some people feed deer and don't hunt, but 99.9% of us use foodplots to attract and hold deer on our property. Everything we do, such as habitat improvements, fertilizing natural forages, creating bedding area's, sanctuary's, watering holes, etc. is to make our property more attractive to wildlife. IMO, that is bait, not by definition of the law, but that's how I feel. I'm okay with that. Corn, pellets, mineral rocks, all serve a purpose. Everybody knows food plots are high in protein, but in the fall deer need carbohydrates. They get that from acorns. If there was one white oak acorn tree dropping on 200 acres, would you hunt it? Very similar to hunting over a feeder. People are going to feel however they feel, and that's fine. I just don't get hung up over a play on words. Before supplemental feeding come along, I didn't put anything out except food plots and mineral licks. I started putting supplemental feeders out to help hold deer on the property, because the pines are choking out natural vegetation. We lease this property, so we're limited to what we can do. When winter hits, and the acorns are gone deer will move where there's more food. They're supposed to start cutting next year so hopefully that will improve our situation. Now, we don't have to worry about putting a feeder outta site, we can put it where it is more convenient to keep full.

There is no difference in scattering it on the ground than bush hogging standing corn at the end of the day. But the idiots in Montgomery say there is. IMO anything , that is not natural and is hunted over is bait. That includes rye grass or the highest end plot mix. Some folks just can't handle the truth!

Corn = carbs. Mammals need carbs in the winter.

I think it’s just natural of people. I think people like to feel good about them selves so they make up things in their head.

They think they are better than people because they don’t shoot deer over bagged corn.

Then they even go a step further to say that they are tremendously helping the deer herd by planting 1/4 acre of winter wheat.

People naturally just like to feel good about themselves and usually put other people down to do so.

Well I mean let's be intellectually honest..... there are differences..... corn just provides carbs...... no other nutritional value while you can pretty much pick and choose what nutritional value you want your food plots to provide. Also food plots continually reproduce that value while corn is just eaten up and then needs to be replenished. Finally I think the one no one likes talking about is that its a lot more work to plant and maintain food plots than it is to just walk a 50lb bag of corn out to the woods and dump it. Those are pretty big differences and doesn't make one better than the other across the board but each better in certain situations. That's why when I encounter a situation which is better for a food plot i'm going to plant a food plot.... when I encounter a place for a feeder i'm going to use a feeder. I usually just do protein through the hot months and corn once they've shed velvet.

I believe the real point is that food plots, feeders, corn piles, fertilized briers and honeysuckle, apple orchards, mineral licks, etc. are ALL attractants, and if you are hunting over them, as I personally do, then your brand/style of attractant is NOT morally superior to someone else's brand/style as has been inferred in this thread and other threads on this forum.

Neither the amount of work that a hunter's particular type of attractant requires, nor the dollar cost of said attractant, gives that hunter any moral "high ground" to stand on when talking bad about the other types.

That is exactly the point that I and many others have been trying to make, but some folks just can't see the logic. What the state of Alabama says is irrelevant for anything other than a potential fine/license fee. If you are hunting over a food source or attractant that you or someone else planted/scattered/altered, then it is still bait.

And I am OK with that.

All that's true, if you completely ignore the benefit to wildlife aspect.

Really? I see squirrels, doves, songbirds, deer, turkeys, and all manner of other wildlife at my corn and protein feeders, which happen to sit in the middle of a large food plot, with a variety of grains, brassicas, and legumes planted annually and fertilized regularly, right next to the mineral lick. I even mix birdseed with the corn, to expand the benefit to more critters.

And the benefit to wildlife, deer anyway, for most of us, is killing a few of them so there is more food remaining for the survivors.

Still no moral high ground to criticize others for their particular method of baiting.

Respectfully, the "benefit to wildlife" attitude is exactly what I was referring to in my previous post. Maybe not directly to you, but to the others who talk about cornslingers as if they are worthless scum with no hunting skills, and how their kill plots are so much more sporting and better for the deer.

Except the ones that they shoot, of course. Those are still hammer dead.

UncleHuck, I agree and concur with every single point you made.

But let's be honest...this thread is about CORN FEEDERS vs food plots. You can attempt to make it something else, but that's what it is. If you're mixing other stuff that's actually beneficial to deer and other wildlife, then good for you. But, you're in the VAST minority. I would wager that 99+% of feeders will be filled with corn...and only corn.

I know absolutely no one who only plants rye grass as their food plots...and if there are some who do, they're not killing many/any deer off them. Even if someone planted only wheat on their plots, they've provided the deer with something that's highly digestible with 20+% crude protein, and a forage yield of better than 4000 lbs per acre from October to March. Corn only is somewhere in the 8% crude protein range. The "sporting" part of it aside, I'm not sure how anyone can argue that a corn feeder is better for deer/wildlife than a "killing" plot.

Hunterbuck, I've yet to read where anybody said a corn feeder was better than a food plot. What I've read is that you can use both and shouldn't be considered a low down, scum sucking, corn baiter!. Deer don't gorge on anything. They are browsers who eat a little of this and a little of that. In Kentucky,Iowa,Nebraska, or anywhere there are 1000 of acres of corn, you don't think the deer stand in that corn field all day long gorging on corn, do you? It's another tool in the tool box, simple as that.

wow...11 pages. In before the lockdown!


Just go hunt guys...dont worry about what others do...just do what you want. And oh yea...try to have fun.

Its hunting. It is supposed to be fun..so..go have fun.

Hunt greenfields, over corn, in the woods, over acorns, persimmons (all are attractants...youve got to find something to hunt and food works best) or from a shooting house, the ground or a dang treestand ( no one style is BETTER or more macho then the other...sorry to tell you), use a bow, a gun, a crossbow...heck even a fancy air gun and kill yourself a deer. It isnt any different no matter which way you do it in my opinion.

The key is it is supposed to be fun.

Actually, the original post insinuated that there is a difference in hunting over bait vs hunting over a food plot, and asked who would change to "bait". Food plots are bait.

I never said that corn feeders were more beneficial to deer than food plots. What I said was, that all planted or manipulated vegetation is bait, same as corn, salt licks, apples, sweet taters, jello, or any other food placed to attract animals.

If you hunt near a created, altered or placed food source, then you are hunting over bait. If you hunt over food or any other attractant, including doe pee, then you don't have any moral high ground to criticize others who may not own a tractor or have the ability to plant a food plot, or even own property where a food plot could be planted.

If you are stalking around in the piney woods with a flintlock or traditional bow, not using modern camouflage or attractant, then you can disparage folks who hunt over bait.

Amen.

yeah but a 1/8 or even 1/4 acre of winter wheat isn't making that much of difference to your deer herd. Neither is a corn feeder. Id say in most areas of Alabama there is plenty of natural browse for deer all year round. So yes, a food plot is more beneficial than a corn feeder.

But lets say you have that corn feeder on a ridge or some where a food plot is not an option I would then argue the corn feeder is more beneficial because having a corn feeder there is better than having nothing.

You are correct, Sir.

I was about to make a post about "what idot started this thread to begin with?". I went and looked at the first page and it was me, hahaha.

I think back and my original question was I was curious how many people were going to stop planting their plots and just start baiting. I guess in the course of all these comments we got a little off track.

If you have plots and hunt over them , you're already baiting.

To answer your original question we have 5 small food plots on our lease we will continue to plant them and hunt them. We will probably add a spin feeder to the 2 bigger ones. We also have plans to put a feeder on the back of our property where we can’t get a food plot to grow.

I bet some of you guys cry watching cartoons. No one is claiming higher or lower morals. It's just a question that I was curious about. If you can't see the forest for the trees then I can't help you.

If you're talking habitat management , high end food plots, basically growing whitetails in the mountains of Northeast Bama , I'd bet you can't .

Yeah, cause climbing into a shooting house over a green patch is some hard ass work. Whew, man I'm breaking a sweat just thinking about all the effort that takes. And good lord the skill level involved as well. I mean you have to work them plexiglass windows and learn how to use that little latch that holds the shooting house door closed. Don't even get me started on pointing the gun out the window to shoot. Hell that takes at least 5 years to truly master. Man that is some Daniel Boone level s#$t right there. Surely any man who has the stamina to sit motionless on his ass in a shooting house plus the knowledge to work the windows and door is a superior being compared to those who would hunt over corn. LOL!



This is like the Dracula of outdoor bull$^%t. No matter how many times someone kills it, it just keeps coming back fom the dead. What about corn makes a deer more nocturnal? What could a corn feeder do to make a deer nocturnal that a green patch doesn't do?

I heard someone say that by providing plentiful food that deer don't have to move around as much. Not sure there is any truth to that but doesn't a green patch provide just as much food? And a green patch is available all night long where as a feeder can be programed to only go off in daylight hours. So how does the feeder make them nocturnal but not the green field?

But that happens all the time here, and happened multiple times in this thread. Someone will get all high and mighty, talking bad about the skillset of any hunter that would "bait", while they hunt over a kill plot.

I have hunted over corn hog hunting, never deer, and rarely sit a greenfield. I prefer to either slip along in the woods or just pick a good spot and sit.

baiting and food plots aren’t the type of hunting I enjoy

Same. I've hunted a food plot maybe a half dozen times in the last 5 years, and where I hunt is known for some of the finest plots around. Just doesn't appeal to me...neither does hunting over a feeder. I've done it a few times in Florida, and it's the most boring thing ever.

Others are free to do it...it's just not for me at all.

Same here.

I think you need to qualify that statement in some way. The word "bait" has a legal definition, and planting a field doesn't fit the definition. They are not legally the same activity, and they obviously require much different types of work, so they are not physically the same activity.

If you wanna say that they are morally the same, I would agree with you, as long as you buy the Baiting Permit. Or maybe you mean they are theologically the same thing?

Both are used as a lure or attractant. Call it what you want to make yourself feel better, but that’s what they both do.

Yup, permit, no permit, legal , illegal , water it down, call it lure, attractant , or heaven forbid, bait , it all gets the same result. It's all something put there by the hunter to bring the game in.

Kinda like the harvest V kill debate , either way they both equal dead.

Not sure about that

let's put out a 1/2 acre clover field, 100lbs of corn in a pile, a bottle of tinks and a pile of acorn crush and see if they all get the same result. I bet some of those work better than the others.

Matter of fact I would bet the field is the least productive because the deer have to leave cover to come to them, therefore the whole reason the state had allowed them for so many years.... it didn't give that much of an advantage whereas baiting will. That's just my opinion. I think anyone who actually believes that a corn pile in the woods next to good cover and a creek isn't easier to kill deer off of than a green field don't know too much about hunting or they're just trying to make it sound tougher so they won't feel bad bringing in all these deer this next year.

I assure you that I feel just fine about my hunting methods.

It looks like to me that the baiters are the ones trying to make themselves feel better. I haven't written anything that could be interpreted as any sort of moral superiority; I just pointed out that food plots and baiting are not the "same thing" legally or physically. I have asked this question several times and nobody has ever tried to answer it, so I will ask again - in what sense are they the same thing?

I don't think we can communicate with one another if we redefine words to mean something different from what they have always meant.

It's been answered several times over. I answered it for you, as well. Just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean that it's not the answer to your question. If you refuse to see that, then I don't think anybody can help you.

Not all clover patches are a square half acre. One of the best “food plots” I ever hunted was a 8 yard wide 100 yard strip of clover/winter wheat that went right through the middle of some thinned pines. Literally right through the bedding area.

Hell the only thing that could of made that field any better was maybe a corn feeder, some Tinks 69 during the rut, and maybe some of that acorn rage stuff.

I think what 2 dogs is saying is that it is all baiting. And in your question you asked how many people where going to quit planting “food plots” and “just bait” he was simply saying food plots are a form of bait. But you interpret it how ever you want.

It’s just a fraking deer. Some folks may think making theirselves “hunt hard” means more. Just don’t pressure the stupid things and they will walk out in a greenfield and you can shoot them. Why make something pretty damn easy so tough?????

Yep , you get it, I and others have tried to explain this several ways , several times. I guess there's some that just can't be honest enough with themselves to grasp the fact that the high quality clover patch that was bull dozed out, limed and planted by them is a form of bait. I'm gonna say it again, the state has said for years you can grow a corn patch for deer , bush hog it down and that's not bait. I guess they think people really believe that. Well , I guess some do believe it, cause the Guvment says so.

[/quote]

It's been answered several times over. I answered it for you, as well. Just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean that it's not the answer to your question. If you refuse to see that, then I don't think anybody can help you.
[/quote]


I'm not the one who needs help; I don't have to pay the Sin Tax.

I don't have to buy a Bait Permit to carry out my management practices. There is no state in the union that defines planting a field as baiting. In fact, there is no place on earth that defines it that way. You can call them the "same thing" as many times as you want, but that doesn't make it true. They are practices that can be used for a similar purpose, but that doesn't make them the same practice.

It's mostly just a question of semantics. I would think that everyone saying that they are the same thing understands at some level that they are not. Apples and oranges are both foods, but nobody would say they are the same thing.

It's been answered several times over. I answered it for you, as well. Just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean that it's not the answer to your question. If you refuse to see that, then I don't think anybody can help you.
[/quote]


I'm not the one who needs help; I don't have to pay the Sin Tax.

I don't have to buy a Bait Permit to carry out my management practices. There is no state in the union that defines planting a field as baiting. In fact, there is no place on earth that defines it that way. You can call them the "same thing" as many times as you want, but that doesn't make it true. They are practices that can be used for a similar purpose, but that doesn't make them the same practice.

It's mostly just a question of semantics. I would think that everyone saying that they are the same thing understands at some level that they are not. Apples and oranges are both foods, but nobody would say they are the same thing.[/quote]

As usually, you try to change horses mid race. I never said anything about whether you do or should bait. I simply answered your question. You can take your ramblings and concerns and discuss it with the folks at Webster’s dictionary and tell them that you don’t like their definition.

As usually, you try to change horses mid race. I never said anything about whether you do or should bait. I simply answered your question. You can take your ramblings and concerns and discuss it with the folks at Webster’s dictionary and tell them that you don’t like their definition.
[/quote]


My apologies for offending you. Ramblings are all that I have and my intention was just to participate in the discussion. I will suspend myself from the forum for 12 hours as punishment. I hope you and are ok, as I have always valued your opinions.

A corn feeder is bait placed in a specific location by man to lure a game animal into gun or bow range.

A green patch is bait placed in a specific location by man to lure a game animal into gun or bow range.

It requires no more skill or effort to hunt over one vs the other.

With both legal I can see no moral or ethical difference.

Both could be used as a means to provide additional supplimental food for the deer on your land.

Here's a better question back at you. In what meaningful way are they different?

Honest and simple enough. Good luck getting an equally honest and simple answer.

My apologies for offending you. Ramblings are all that I have and my intention was just to participate in the discussion. I will suspend myself from the forum for 12 hours as punishment. I hope you and are ok, as I have always valued your opinions.[/quote]

No worries. Sorry if my comments came across as crass. We’re good, as far as I’m concerned.

Keep on trucking and happy hunting!

There are a lot of differences in the actual practices, but as I already said, they can indeed be used for the same purposes. The biggest difference is that one is legal and one isn't. Now that difference can be erased by buying a license, but the very fact that a separate license is required should be evidence that they are different practices. Don't you agree with that?

I agree that there is no ethical difference. And I agree that there is no more skill involved in any sort of deer hunting from a stand, whether woods or field. Actually, I don't think there is much skill in deer hunting at all, and that's the reason I've lost interest in it.

I plant a lot of land that never gets hunted at all, so my purpose in that has to be different than what you described above. I don't wanna see the definition of baiting be changed to include planted fields, or the state will decide to tax them too.

I've never answered the OP's original question - I don't plan to quit planting crops and switch to bait. Bait could not accomplish my goals. I don't care at all if others want to switch.

I think it’s ridiculous that they require a permit. Both are used to attract game, whether it’s hunted over or not.

There's something we can agree on. I would have much rather them just legalized it and have a system like FL. But that wouldn't produce extra money. And the ridiculous interpretation that children with a hunter must buy a permit makes it worse.

I prefer plots

This is a silly debate. Food plots do not meet any definition of bait.
The baiters always try to insult our intelligence, with this argument, because they are trying to justify their unethical behavior, bottom line.

So you just plant food plots without any intention of attracting deer? Whatever.

It was believed that corn was more attractive to deer, and somewhere down the road the state realized they could make more tax dollars off of fertilizer, lime and seed then they could a $5 bag of corn. Therefore they outlawed it because of money. The whole ethics thing is a wash. Now that both are legal they are hoping people will still pay for food plots and buy corn and feeders and charge $15 for the permit. The whole hundred yards out of sight law was a guinea pig to see how much tax sales in that category increased and allowed game wardens to write tickets.

That's a clever argument as well. Reminds me of the people who interpret the Bible to include gay ministers.

No. All that proves is that people in government will never pass up an opportunity to bleed a little more money out of the people under their control.

For example, we have to buy one Alabama license to fish in fresh water and another one to fish in salt water. Only difference in those two activities is the damn salt content of the water and yet two separate licenses are required.

bait
/bāt/

noun

1. food used to entice fish or other animals as prey.

2. anything used as a lure; enticement

Sure seems to describe clover, oats, minerals, peas, and other planted crops as well as corn feeders.

I never saw the difference before, and I don't see it now. Unless you don't hunt over your "food plots placed to entice other animals (deer)" so that you can prey on them (shoot, stab, etc) then they are also bait.

As I said before, what the State of Alabama says you need a permit to do has nothing to do with the definition of the word bait, and any non-natural food is bait, plain and simple.

I have killed deer and other critters in many states and by many methods. Food plots and co, soybeans and corn/protein feeders are just two of those methods.



The baiters (food plotters) always try to insult our intelligence, with this argument, because they are trying to justify their (same as corn) behavior, bottom line. Both are food, both are placed/planted/whatever to attract deer so they can be shot.

Whether you planted it or trucked it in, by the purest definition of bait, both are bait.

Anything used to lure or entice..... That's a might broad brush to paint with.
According to that definition an oak tree is bait

If you planted or fertilized it to increase acorn yield and attract deer, then sure it is. Same with apple trees that you planted or manipulated in some way to increase the yield and attract deer.

By some definitions here corn isn't bait if it's planted and bush hogged instead of trucked in or slung from a feeder. That's the biggest bunch of crap I ever heard.

I'm saying it's all bait, whether it's corn, mineral licks, food plots, etc. If you are hunting over something not 100% natural, then it's food used as an enticement, and it's bait.

Psst...it's not just Alabama that calls corn from a feeder or piled up "bait"....it's nearly every other state too, legal or illegal.

Zero states call food plots "bait".

You're working way to hard to convince everyone, or maybe yourself, that it's the same.

I didn't write the dictionary, just posted the definition.

Naaa, just dragging some green patch hunters (kicking and screaming) into the bright light of reality. The same people that have deluded themselves for years into believing that they weren't hunting over bait because their particular type of bait was green and had a root attached to it.

If people who bream fished with earth worms looked down their nose and berated people who used crickets for the same purpose that would be about equally as stupid as this green patch vs corn feeder bull$#*t. Same activity, same effort and same skill level involved. Just slightly different bait.

I'm with Todd and several others on this.

If you didn't believe that your food plot would attract deer so you can shoot them, then why would you plant a food plot? What does every food plot seed mix advertise?

Here's a few quotes I found while researching what to plant this fall -

Deer love the taste and will travel long distances to feed on Imperial Whitetail Clover.
We have combined some of our most attractive early and late season forages with sweet lupines and Sugar Beets to keep deer in your plots from germination time, until the end of hunting season.
Fall annual designed to attract deer to small, remote food plots for bow hunting
Broad range of 11 forages specially selected and combined to provide maximum attraction through hunting season
Whitetail Oats Plus – the PREMIUM oat planting for deer that establishes and grows quickly and contains high levels of sugar for maximum attraction
Have you ever needed a blend that would be attractive early in archery season but also still providing food in the latest part of the gun season? BioLogic’s Final Forage was designed to do just that.

How is that anything but bait?

I'll simplify it: food plotting IS a form of baiting, whether other states explicitly say this or not.

Yep, it is that simple. But only for those who are honest and use common sense.

I have a large plot , always planted with a quality mix, strategically located and surrounded by hardwood clear cut. It has a nice shooting house. It's legal bait. I don't need the government telling me how to use common sense.

I have three fall food plots I never hunt over or even near. Are they still bait?

Depends on whether you're a bream fisherman or a bass fisherman.

If I have a coffee can full of red worms , but am not fishing are they bait?

That's kind of what I was thinking. I have a feeder on my lake and a feeder in the woods behind my house. If I put feed out for fish it's feed..if I put feed out for deer it's bait not food ??

If I throw my red worms in the pond , I'm feeding fish, if I throw them in on a hook they are bait. If you put out feed , plant plots , etc. but don't hunt on or near it, it's food (potential bait though), if you hunt over them they are being used as bait.

According to this logic, a commercial fisherman who pays thousands of dollars for a boat, hires a crew, and sails a hundred miles off shore.... Is absolutely no different than the guy throwing a cricket from the bank.

So what are you trying to say.....Your cricket makes more noise than mine.... your cricket is blacker.... maybe its larger.... Man if we could only go back to fishing with a cricket....

If you had 3 corn feeders you never hunted over or near would they still be bait?

Does a zoo bear shucks on concrete?

That all ya got? There is one difference , one uses waaaaay more bait than the other.

Unfortunately we have an epidemic of laziness in this country.

Yeah I don't get the point either. Is he saying that if you spend more money, go farther out from the shore and use more bait that you are no longer fishing? The scale is larger to be sure. But how that applies to what is or isn't bait eludes me.

Has nothing to do with laziness , whether you sit astraddle a pile of corn or wouldn't be caught dead near one, it's about being honest that ANYTHING put out or planted by a hunter IS BAIT WHEN HUNTED OVER.
And what the state says , or permits, or anything else has NOTHING to do with it either.

And a pretty widespread problem of people who can't understand basic facts and simple logic.

Saying someone who hunts over a pile of corn is lazy is a fair statement. That’s all in your opinion. Just like people on here calling you an ass hole is a fair statement that’s just their opinion . Saying that a food plot isn’t a form of bait just makes you sound like an idiot.

Totally agree. I got a boy all tore up on here saying the same thing. He sent me PM's and what not. That being said, I'm gonna do both. Plant several food plots with feeders in the middle of them. With some mineral spots as well.

Finally, you understand. Money, effort, distance, difficulty, heavy equipment, tractors, boats, planters, tillers, chainsaws, or time, have nothing to do with the debate.

A cricket for bream=hardtail for amberjack=longline dead bait for swordfish=chicken livers for catfish=peanuts for skwerls=clover/pea/ryegrass/chicory/sugar beet patch for deer=corn feeder for deer=donut pile for black bear=cheese on a mousetrap

All bait, all the same. Food is food, regardless. You may believe that they are different, but you need to recalibrate if you do.

What I disagree with is your last sentence; I believe that the legal definition by the state is the only thing that matters. Like it or not, if we wanna hunt legally we have to use the definitions put out by the state.

I've never had a supplemental feeding program for deer, and don't plan to start one, so it's no issue for me regarding deer hunting. Dove hunting is a different story. A pound of wheat in the wrong place can turn a planted wheat field that is legal to hunt over into a baited field that will get every hunter on it a ticket. I don't want a ticket myself, and I surely don't wanna be responsible for others getting one, so I plan to listen to whatever definition the state gives us in all types of hunting.

But honesty is a double edged sword..... one of those "baits" by your definition takes a lot more work than the other.... it also doesn't concentrate deer as much as the other hence why its been legal for so long..... if you're truly worried about honesty you would openly admit that.

So we should agree with the Guvment , anything they say legal is fine?

You don't have to think it's fine or even agree with it but you have to follow it, if not you're an outlaw and no better than a trespasser or poacher.

Plots , feeders can require different degrees of effort , if they both attract deer and you shoot them while there, they are both B A I T! Honest!

You're so wrapped around the axle because you believe someone is implying some criticism of someone's hunting skills as has been mentioned like 50 times.... I for one am not saying that. What I am saying is to get the ground prepped, get the seed in it, covered, fertilized, etc. takes a lot more effort that just dumping a bad of corn out. I am also saying that deer traditionally use food plots at night whereas you can dump corn out right outside of cover and set timers on feeders to get them to trend use in daylight. It's two totally different ball games. The work required for one doesn't equal the other. It's extremely naïve to say or even imply that it is. They both attract deer. But they both do not equal the same amount of work to attract those deer.

Again, the amount of work expended by the hunter has no bearing in the discussion, nor does the time of day or the money that it costs to do so. If one of us does 200 pushups with a bag of corn on his back, and chews the bag open with his teeth before pouring it into the feeder, would that change your mind? That's a lot more effort than just cutting it open.


If it is food or any other attractant, and you hunt over or near it, it is bait.

The state got this wrong, just like so much else. If you cut your corn with a bushhog, that's legal to hunt over. If the deer eat all that corn, and you go throw some additional out, that's baiting. IT's all corn, and their regulations don't change that.

The govenments, state and federal, worry so much about the migratory doves in this country, but any shooter can go to Central America and kill thousands in a 2-3 day trip. It's the same flocks that were so carefully protected here, and they are shot over bait there, then fed to the hogs.

None of us are arguing that food plots require more effort than putting out a bag of corn. Food plots do require a lot of work and maintenance, and usually take hours of work. A bag of corn can be carried in on an atv and dumped 50 yards in front of your stand with in 15 minutes and requires very little effort. I totally agree.

But at the end of the day that food plots purpose is to attract deer and that 50 pounds of corn was put out to attract deer.

Once again we are not arguing that one takes more work than the other and anyone who thinks the way some one hunts is lazy is entitled to that opinion. I am a fan of food plots and we will continue to plant food plots because they are great tools to attract deer on to your property.

I don't think anyone should make the assumption that anyone is lazy because no one knows another person's situation. Just because a guy is pouring out corn doesn't mean he's lazy, just means he poured out corn. May mean he doesn't have the money to buy a tractor and implements, or even enough money to rent them or hire them. No one knows what another person is going through. I wasn't implying that anyone else is lazy, just that the two methods weren't the same to get to the point of actually attracting the deer.

I wasn’t referring to you when I said that. I was referring to other people like OutBack

If anyone thinks that a little time to spray some chemicals and then throw out some seed and fertilizer is more work than setting and maintaining feeders year-round, it simply shows how naive and ignorant to the situation that they really are.

Welcome back. I hope you're doing well.

Well I'll just stick to my plots and I'll keep referring to them as what they are............. B A I T ! I'm done, Dog's gone.

Now you know I don't believe that and didn't say that. But the legal definition is the only one that matters to me in how I manage my land. The state has changed the legal definition before, and will probably do it again. I have changed my practices in accordance with their definitions before, and might do it again in the future. That doesn't mean I agree with it or like it; just the way it is.

Based on all of your posts over the years, I don't really think we disagree on anything here.

My God, sir, are you trying to be the laziest most unsporting horrible terrible killer of wildlife ever? Food plots AND feeders in them? And MINERALS?


HAVE YOU NO SHAME, SIR?

Lmbo!

That's the truth right there. I am doing both and the plots take WAY less time and effort than the feeders. I'm not going to get into the ethics of one vs the other because I don't care. I just wish we would get some damn rain for these plots.

I guess because I do the throw and mow method versus conventional till and I plan to use a feeder , well then i'm the lowest of the scumbag anti till, corn feeding baiting SOB around. I'm ok with that. But really, ya'll are saying because it takes more money and time, that's the reason a plot is not bait? Holy moly.

Yes, that's what some (or many) believe. Because you take more time, exert more energy, spend more money and provide "nutrition" for "wildlife" EVEN THOUGH THE WHOLE INTENT IS TO GROW BIG BUCKS AND KILL DEER then you're a better person and are not "really" baiting but are providing "food" the deer don't have (even though they probably have enough already).

It's the same thing with anything.

If you fly fish, using a dainty 3- or 4-weight bamboo rod with dry flies makes you far better than the Godless heathens with the 9-foot 8-weight and colored line and nymph-streamer-droppers and GOD FORBID YOU USE A STRIKE INDICATOR!

If you play golf and play up a slot on the tees to, y'know HAVE FUN, instead of playing back or at the tips, you're not a real golfer.

It's all bullchit. Food plots are nothing but legalized baiting and have been for years, merely to make people feel better about killing animals instead of doing it with "bait" - corn for deer, carcasses for bears, a red Coke can on a stick in a field for turkeys, whatever.

This ^. A thousand times this^.

My family has both planted plots and ran feeders for decades. The year round feeders are way more work than a one day and done food plot. I just chuckle at the pitiful lack of knowledge demonstrated by the people who think all it would take to kill deer over corn is carrying a 50 pound sack and pouring it out on the day you plan to hunt. LOL! Corn is just food. It's not magic. It doesn't emit a telepathic vibe through the airwaves to draw deer. They have to find it, get used to it consistently being there before it starts to attract them. That means keeping a steady supply of it in a certain place for a long time. Let a feeder run out, break down, battery die, anything that interupts the constantly supply and they rapidly quit coming. Then you have to start all over at square one slowly drawing them back again. It's a year round proposition. How many people are still doing anything to a food plot in april, may, june, etc?

But all of this is irrelevant. Which one requires the most effort has no bearing on what they are. They are both sources of food that can be used as bait.

If I go to the store and buy a recurve bow, it's a bow. If I spend 3 months hand crafting my own recurve bow by hand when I get finished you know what I will have when I'm done? A f%&@ing bow!! How hard is that to understand?

Are y’all still talking about this?

Is a plot still considered bait if it's planted in rye grass with no lime or fertilizer?

🐻💩🌳?

Yes

No shame in my game. The best part of hunting is grilling!

I’m at Fort Campbell for work this week. There’s a guy up here selling 55 gallon food grade metal barrels for $10 a piece. I’m about to become the master baiter of all baiters

Welcome to the dark side. Once you become a masterbaiter, you'll never go back.