I’m fairly certain this has been posted here a couple of times, but ppl are continuing to ask what AL will do if we detect a positive case. If you’re interested please read below. It will prevent a lot of false info being shared and answer a lot of questions.
Does detection not rest solely on the hunter reporting it to you guys? Unless one of you guys catch it in advance or see it first hand? Considering the GC numbers and compliance, I wonder how many hunters would actually report it based on misinformation or lack there of not reading up on what's going on around us with something like this you posted? I know I would report it if something looked bad with the deer. I just wonder about others being so many could care less about our game laws.
No, we are testing several hundred if not a few thousand deer this year. The bulk of theses are road kill but some are sick deer we’re called out on and hunter harvested deer.
Supplemental feeding? I know quite a few non hunters who feed deer just to watch. Neighborhoods, back yard, whatever. They are not reading this or any other info on CWD. How will that be addressed?
Thanks for posting Matt. Hunters will have a big responsibility to thin the herd and thin it hard if we get it and our ground is in a zone. I’m curious if shooting them at night would be part of that response. I read first 10 pages fairly close. Scanned more. I may have missed it but what does the Department recommend as far as consumption? I don’t believe I want to eat a sick deer.
It talks about ending supplemental feeding if found. We talk about being proactive about deboning meat etc. why not be proactive and end supplemental feeding now??
It talks about ending supplemental feeding if found. We talk about being proactive about deboning meat etc. why not be proactive and end supplemental feeding now??
So a bag of corn from the store is dangerous but corn out of a corn field is safe?
It talks about ending supplemental feeding if found. We talk about being proactive about deboning meat etc. why not be proactive and end supplemental feeding now??
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
For what, and what makes you think that?? Killing a bunch of deer won’t do anything I don’t believe if it lives in the soil for long periods of time. If it’s here, it’s here to stay from what I have read. I believe there will be plenty of samples for them to study off of dead deer that died from the disease, roadkill, and hunters. I doubt they try to decimate the population until they know that it would benefit the future herd.
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
It talks about ending supplemental feeding if found. We talk about being proactive about deboning meat etc. why not be proactive and end supplemental feeding now??
The same reason the prohibition on natural deer urine was put off until 2019 by the Advisory Board.
1. I've read a stat that says it takes 33,000 gallons of infected deer urine to equal the amount of CWD that is in 1 oz of infected brain tissue. If that is a real stat are we really preventing anything by prohibiting urine?
2. If urine is bottled by Alabama deer would it still be prohibited? The estrus I buy is bottled by a guy in Grant with deer solely from Alabama. Couldn't there be a measure put in the rule at the CAB that allows for this?
It talks about ending supplemental feeding if found. We talk about being proactive about deboning meat etc. why not be proactive and end supplemental feeding now??
The same reason the prohibition on natural deer urine was put off until 2019 by the Advisory Board.
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
For what, and what makes you think that?? Killing a bunch of deer won’t do anything I don’t believe if it lives in the soil for long periods of time. If it’s here, it’s here to stay from what I have read. I believe there will be plenty of samples for them to study off of dead deer that died from the disease, roadkill, and hunters. I doubt they try to decimate the population until they know that it would benefit the future herd.
Did you not read the response plan that was posted?? If a deer is found with CWD a WHOLE LOTTA deer are gonna be killed in the surrounding area.
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
So all of you realize, if you live in an area with a population density of less than 10 deer per sq mile, as in many north Alabama Areas, if there is one positive, the DCNR will require that all deer within their control area be eradicated. With such a low density, hunters cannot logically take all of them the deer by legal means, so get ready for the DCNR to take over your land and get the job done at their discretion.
So all of you realize, if you live in an area with a population density of less than 10 deer per sq mile, as in many north Alabama Areas, if there is one positive, the DCNR will require that all deer within their control area be eradicated. With such a low density, hunters cannot logically take all of them the deer by legal means, so get ready for the DCNR to take over your land and get the job done at their discretion.
" Only with permission and full cooperation of private landowners. Landowner permission will be obtained prior to collecting/testing any deer on private property. "
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
And you didn’t read a word of the response plan.
Reading comprehension is not a strong point for many on here. One question I did have Matt was the most recent testing indicated that "After 2009, county level sampling goals were set based on estimated population levels, placing the statewide sampling goal at 299 animals each year" then it increased to 500 animals in 2016. According to the infinitely wise Chuck Sykes, the Alabama deer population is estimated at over 1,000,000 animals with others estimating it still being as high as 1,600,000. I personally do not think it is even 1 million animals anymore but for the sake of argument, let's split the difference and assume it is 1,300,000 animals.
I fully understand statistical sampling and regression model analysis as well as sample sizing. Testing 500 animals in 2016/2017 means that the state of Alabama is testing less than 4/100 ths of one percent of the herd (assuming 1.3 million animals) on an annual basis. In the sample design provided, I understand and completely agree that if you randomly test 299 animals out of 100,000 you have a 95% chance of obtaining a single positive animal if (and only if) you have a 1% prevalence rate of CWD evenly distributed across that 100,000 animal sample. I would challenge that the sample design is invalid for 2 reasons: 1. CWD is not nor would it ever be evenly distributed across the statewide population as evidenced by the charts included which show the known infected areas over the past 20 yrs in the continental US. It is very spotty in most states and certainly not evenly distributed by any means. 2. Not only is the 1% not evenly distributed across the population, but that 1% assumed prevalence rate being used in the sample design for Alabama would seem to be ridiculously high at 1 out of every 100 animals being infected, which in turn would yield an abnormally low and statistically invalid required sampling rate to achieve that 95% confidence rate that the state is relying on. I would venture to guess that the prevalence rate used on the sample design should've been more like 1/10th of one percent which would have required drastically more sampling to obtain that same 95% confidence that the state is relying on.
These are my initial observations in reading the response document. Would you say that I'm correct in my analysis and if not, please explain why. Was the sample size abnormally low due to the cost and labor of obtaining and testing samples or was it low due to the fact that CWD had not been found in surrounding states, or was a 1% infected rate the point at which the state would be concerned? Please dont take this as me being smart or throwing rocks, Just trying to understand the state's reasoning with regard to the sampling plan developed. I personally commend the state for already having a document and plan of action drafted to deal with the situation and being proactive in trying to stay ahead of it. I'd also like to publicly thank you for providing the document and for your support and the information you and others regularly provide on this site.
So all of you realize, if you live in an area with a population density of less than 10 deer per sq mile, as in many north Alabama Areas, if there is one positive, the DCNR will require that all deer within their control area be eradicated. With such a low density, hunters cannot logically take all of them the deer by legal means, so get ready for the DCNR to take over your land and get the job done at their discretion.
" Only with permission and full cooperation of private landowners. Landowner permission will be obtained prior to collecting/testing any deer on private property. "
How will it go?? Hey, you sorry azz landowners that s no better than welfare recipients with yalls entitlement program, will you help us out by letting us use your land?
[quote=Mbrock][quote=sluggun][quote=BOFF] According to the infinitely wise Chuck Sykes, the Alabama deer population is estimated at over 1,000,000 animals with others estimating it still being as high as 1,600,000. I personally do not think it is even 1 million animals anymore but for the sake of argument, let's split the difference and assume it is 1,300,000 animals.
That number is astronomically too high..... North of Birmingham doesn't even have 250k deer, period!! That would mean there's roughly 1M deer south of Bham.... there's no way! I don't know why we (the state of AL) keeps estimating the number so high but I've hunted Winston county for 10 years straight and Jackson, Madison, Lauderdale and Morgan within those 10 and dating back for 17. During that total 17 years of hard hunting I've never seen any evidence of there being deer numbers to rival what the state estimates our herd being. I understand it's much thicker down in South Alabama but if that's the case shouldn't the CWD response plan be segmented for the two areas since the density is so different?
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
And you didn’t read a word of the response plan.
Oh yes I read it. No approved live animal test.
Currently, there is no U.S. Department of Agriculture approved live animal test for CWD. Diagnosis must be made post-mortem by testing specific portions of the animal’s brain stem (i.e., obex) or lymph node tissue (medial retropharyngeal lymph nodes). Samples can be screened using enzyme-linked immunosorbent assay (ELISA) or immunohistochemistry (IHC) testing, but suspect animals must be confirmed using IHC testing.
8. Special CMZ specific regulations will be implemented (Appendix 7) to include, but not limited to, mandatory CWD testing with designated CWD check stations, extended deer seasons and/or increased bag limits to reduce deer densities, prohibition of deer rehabilitation and supplemental wildlife feeding, limitations on carcass transportation, and where applicable quarantine and/or depopulation of captive cervid facilities within appropriate CMZ’s to limit spread of the disease.
9. An initial sampling effort within the CZ will require collecting 60 samples within 60 days (from notification of a CWD positive index case) to accurately delineated the CZ. As more positive cases are identified, the boundaries of the CZ may need to be expanded.
10. If additional infected deer are detected in the CZ, a new five-mile radius will be extended from the location of the new positive(s) and subsequent sampling will be conducted from the newly expanded CZ. As new positives are confirmed and the CZ increases, the required sample size will increase proportionately to increase confidence that additional positive deer will be detected, if present. The way I understand it there is no approved live animal test and if a positive is found then 60 deer will die within a 5 mile radius. If another positive is found in the 5th mile it will extend 5 more miles and 60 more deer. That’s 120 in 10 miles. Nowhere does it say darting and testing. It says extending season and bag limits and control shooting. That means killing them. So what am I not understanding?
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
And you didn’t read a word of the response plan.
It's 35 ****ING pages! I ain't waiting 35 minutes to eat in any restaurant and I ain't reading 35 pages of anything! Want people to read it? Make it 5 pages of actual information.
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
And you didn’t read a word of the response plan.
It's 35 ****ING pages! I ain't waiting 35 minutes to eat in any restaurant and I ain't reading 35 pages of anything! Want people to read it? Make it 5 pages of actual information.
The part about who reports to who and the time frame to do so is useless to us.
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
And you didn’t read a word of the response plan.
It's 35 ****ING pages! I ain't waiting 35 minutes to eat in any restaurant and I ain't reading 35 pages of anything! Want people to read it? Make it 5 pages of actual information.
The part about who reports to who and the time frame to do so is useless to us.
Actually that is very important as it tells you a lot about how the state intends on responding. Look at the response matrix diagram it includes shooting teams, security forces, etc. That doesn’t seem like they intend on asking permission before proceeding, that matrix is laid out in a manner to impose the states will, why would they need security teams if they intend on having landowner permission?
So all of you realize, if you live in an area with a population density of less than 10 deer per sq mile, as in many north Alabama Areas, if there is one positive, the DCNR will require that all deer within their control area be eradicated. With such a low density, hunters cannot logically take all of them the deer by legal means, so get ready for the DCNR to take over your land and get the job done at their discretion.
" Only with permission and full cooperation of private landowners. Landowner permission will be obtained prior to collecting/testing any deer on private property. "
Just a caveat which may not matter to many here, but as I have posted before the state will shoot every deer in an enclosure if they have less than 100 and something like 295/300 until the confidence interval is satisfied. If you think the state is willing to do this only on high fence operations yet defer to landowner permission on private land you are a special kind of dumb. An enclosure is private land and the state has made it known they will depopulate them if in a CWD zone and the DCNR and Chuckie are writing their own rules in regards to this so you can bet they will do damn well what they please when it is found here on all private land.
Yeah that’s going to go over real well with a large population of this state. “Hi, I’m the government and I’m here to let you know we will be on your property eradicating your deer population.”
So all of you realize, if you live in an area with a population density of less than 10 deer per sq mile, as in many north Alabama Areas, if there is one positive, the DCNR will require that all deer within their control area be eradicated. With such a low density, hunters cannot logically take all of them the deer by legal means, so get ready for the DCNR to take over your land and get the job done at their discretion.
" Only with permission and full cooperation of private landowners. Landowner permission will be obtained prior to collecting/testing any deer on private property. "
Just a caveat which may not matter to many here, but as I have posted before the state will shoot every deer in an enclosure if they have less than 100 and something like 295/300 until the confidence interval is satisfied. If you think the state is willing to do this only on high fence operations yet defer to landowner permission on private land you are a special kind of dumb. An enclosure is private land and the state has made it known they will depopulate them if in a CWD zone and the DCNR and Chuckie are writing their own rules in regards to this so you can bet they will do damn well what they please when it is found here on all private land.
Did I say I agreed with what I quoted from the CWD Response Plan ? NO
When testing a deer for CWD, will the testing itself kill the deer, even if it is a healthy deer without CWD?
God Bless, David B.
They can only test dead animals. There’s no test for the living. If CWD is found in Alabama the deer herd will be decimated, not by CWD but by our game and fish department.
Shotts, I stopped at the first diagram thinking I was at the end. Security team?? What's that for?? I believe we will find out a lot about this because, like others have said, it's probably already here but it is just now starting to be looked for at a high level.
Some of y'all are killing me, he posted a link to the response plan. If he does he gets blasted because it's to long, if he doesn't he blasted because the state is behind, if something gets left out the state is hiding something and y'all wonder why they don't respond to certain questions.
Some of y'all are killing me, he posted a link to the response plan. If he does he gets blasted because it's to long, if he doesn't he blasted because the state is behind, if something gets left out the state is hiding something and y'all wonder why they don't respond to certain questions.
I can assure you I don't know enough about it to hound anyone. But I can't shoot a gun, be on a tractor or dozer, or even drive a vehicle now. I have gone to the end of the internet. Bored and this forum is more active than any other I've found. I still don't understand the purpose of a security team. What's the threat??
Yes the test the test the state wants to do is kill 96 percent of the deer then test There is live test that can be done not all deer die from CDW there are deer in research places that are 18 years olds with collars and still having fawns Killing 96 percent of the deer in a 50 area Thousands of deer die each year from E H D and Blue Tongue and they say they don't care about the deer Hunters and cars kill more deer every year very very few deer have been found dead that died on their own they are road kill and killed by hunters then tested
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: CWD Response Plan - 12/19/1811:58 PM
What I dont understand is on the map of KNOWN CWD it shows NW Illinois, Western KS, Eastern Colorado, Southern Wisconsin, Western Nebraska, Wyoming etc.
These are some of the best deer hunting areas in the country. Are the Fish and Game depts sending out shooting teams in these states too? And are they Eradicating huge amounts of the deer there too?
I dont think other states are sending out teams to shoot and kill large amounts of deer in those areas, but they seem to be dealing with it there. Maybe I missed something, and they are, but I havent seen anything about it.
I think the idea of killing huge amounts of deer to "save the deer" might be a little too much.
Also, the whole "Security Team" thing? That seems a little much as well.
If it were the feds doing things like this, with "security teams" protecting the "shooting teams" who will be going onto peoples personal property to do what they think is right, people would be freaking out over BIG GOVT Over reach.
It just seems like a little over reactionary as well as definitely governmental OVER REACHING, but thats just my opinion.
Govt OVER REACH doesnt apply to just the Feds..it also applies to state govt. You cant be against Federal Over reach but FOR state over reach IMO. It is all the same.
Im a little Leary anytime anyone from either state or federal agencies show up and say: " I'm from the Government, and I'm here to HELP!".
Go back and look at Wisconsin they killed 117,000 and spent 32,000000 dollars texas has wipped out farms 600 or more look at Missouri farms killed out Do you think those states want to tell about it Look it up
I’m just glad we’re spending all this money on plans and enforcement to save all these deer from CWD. Especially since each hunter can kill over 150 does per year.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: CWD Response Plan - 12/20/1812:14 AM
Originally Posted by hvfs1118
Go back and look at Wisconsin they killed 117,000 and spent 32,000000 dollars texas has wipped out farms 600 or more look at Missouri farms killed out Do you think those states want to tell about it Look it up
I still couldnt find anything like that. can you post up any sources? Id be interested to see.
I don't think asking what the perceived threat is where security teams are needed is too much.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: CWD Response Plan - 12/20/1812:48 AM
Im interested in learning so I dont understand why responding is bad.
I know Matt , and if Matt thinks it is a good idea, I have to think there is something to it.
Id like to know more about how other states are handling it. It seems heavy handed to kill a bunch of deer to me over one deer being found. But Im open to learning.
Love to see some of the stats and how other states have handled it.
I know they seem to kill them in fenced areas but I havent seen where they were killing free range deer large scale over it. Id love to see some sourced info on it. I dont know why it isnt WORTH IT. Some of us have questions and would like to learn more.
I guess asking for info now is bad???? We are supposed to just blindly follow like sheep??? Sorry, not me. I like facts. Ive found asking someone who knows is the best way to learn.
Yes the test the test the state wants to do is kill 96 percent of the deer then test There is live test that can be done not all deer die from CDW there are deer in research places that are 18 years olds with collars and still having fawns Killing 96 percent of the deer in a 50 area Thousands of deer die each year from E H D and Blue Tongue and they say they don't care about the deer Hunters and cars kill more deer every year very very few deer have been found dead that died on their own they are road kill and killed by hunters then tested
Did you say that there are does that are 18 years old having fawns?
I’m just glad we’re spending all this money on plans and enforcement to save all these deer from CWD. Especially since each hunter can kill over 150 does per year.
It was joke guys. I’m glad y’all are being proactive.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: CWD Response Plan - 12/20/1804:16 PM
Originally Posted by NightHunter
Never mind...
Originally Posted by therealhojo
Originally Posted by NightHunter
Never mind...
Good idea
Originally Posted by Hogwild
Originally Posted by therealhojo
Originally Posted by NightHunter
Never mind...
Good idea
Yep.....not even worth it.
I have to tell you those quotes are offensive to be honest. I OWN land, my neighbors OWN their land. It is OUR land and we have a RIGHT to know what happens on it.
Im also a dam tax payer and WE pay for this. Hate to clue you all in but WE have a RIGHT to know, and to ask freaking questions to clarify things that concern us.
You people act like we must just blindly follow the Government plan and ask no questions. Kind of like Obamacare right?....and how is that working for yall??
I spoke to 2 of my neighbors last night about this after seeing this response plan. They had the same questions I did. We manage around 5000 acres in our co-op. We have a very low deer density, however it is the best it has ever been as far as numbers. 15 years ago you'd be lucky to SEE a deer in North Alabama.
We fully cooperate with Al. Fish and Game department. I just spoke to the local warden a couple days ago about a problem I saw with night hunters spotlighting a local piece of property.
It will take co operation from landowners JUST LIKE US to address any CWD. But after seeing the plan and then some of the responses here we all had the same thought last night. Dont report any dang deer you find dead. If you do the state might come in and kill them all.
So unless you clarify for the TAX PAYING PUBLIC and LANDOWNERS who actually funds people like Nighthunters JOB, then Id guess youll get very little co operation from people like me...who I guess ARE NOT allowed to question the State agency or what happens on our land.
Because I guess the Government is always right and we peons just need to sit down and shut the "F" up.
I mean the" kill all the doe thing" has worked out so well for us too right?
I guess the govt always knows what is best. And we tax paying, land owning concerned citizens dont even get to ask for some better understanding on what the GOVERNMENT ( State or Fed dont change a thing...it is still the Government) plan is, possibly on our PRIVATE PROPERTY, because I guess "its Not even worth it" to respond to tax paying land owners?
You guys need to step back and see how hypocritical that response is from a bunch of people who post non stop on here about FEDERAL over reach. I guess its OK if its state..especially if YOU work for the state.
Im sure all the federal employees feel the same way about their over reach too. Im pretty sure the Nazis "brown shirts" did too. I mean their actions were sanctioned by the Fuehrer himself!
I asked a simple freaking question or two about how it will work as a land owner with concerns.
Im sure if the Federal Government were doing something and it included "Security Teams" operating on YOUR private property you wouldnt have any questions?
So again...can someone explain just WTH these "security teams" are, and why we might be PAYING for them. I think we deserve some kind of dam answer other then "Never mind" or its " Not worth it" .
I have to tell you those quotes are offensive to be honest. I OWN land, my neighbors OWN their land. It is OUR land and we have a RIGHT to know what happens on it.
Im also a dam tax payer and WE pay for this. Hate to clue you all in but WE have a RIGHT to know, and to ask freaking questions to clarify things that concern us.
You people act like we must just blindly follow the Government plan and ask no questions. Kind of like Obamacare right?....and how is that working for yall??
I spoke to 2 of my neighbors last night about this after seeing this response plan. They had the same questions I did. We manage around 5000 acres in our co-op. We have a very low deer density, however it is the best it has ever been as far as numbers. 15 years ago you'd be lucky to SEE a deer in North Alabama.
We fully cooperate with Al. Fish and Game department. I just spoke to the local warden a couple days ago about a problem I saw with night hunters spotlighting a local piece of property.
It will take co operation from landowners JUST LIKE US to address any CWD. But after seeing the plan and then some of the responses here we all had the same thought last night. Dont report any dang deer you find dead. If you do the state might come in and kill them all.
So unless you clarify for the TAX PAYING PUBLIC and LANDOWNERS who actually funds people like Nighthunters JOB, then Id guess youll get very little co operation from people like me...who I guess ARE NOT allowed to question the State agency or what happens on our land.
Because I guess the Government is always right and we peons just need to sit down and shut the "F" up.
I mean the" kill all the doe thing" has worked out so well for us too right?
I guess the govt always knows what is best. And we tax paying, land owning concerned citizens dont even get to ask for some better understanding on what the GOVERNMENT ( State or Fed dont change a thing...it is still the Government) plan is, possibly on our PRIVATE PROPERTY, because I guess "its Not even worth it" to respond to tax paying land owners?
You guys need to step back and see how hypocritical that response is from a bunch of people who post non stop on here about FEDERAL over reach. I guess its OK if its state..especially if YOU work for the state.
Im sure all the federal employees feel the same way about their over reach too. Im pretty sure the Nazis "brown shirts" did too. I mean their actions were sanctioned by the Fuehrer himself!
I asked a simple freaking question or two about how it will work as a land owner with concerns.
Im sure if the Federal Government were doing something and it included "Security Teams" operating on YOUR private property you wouldnt have any questions?
So again...can someone explain just WTH these "security teams" are, and why we might be PAYING for them. I think we deserve some kind of dam answer other then "Never mind" or its " Not worth it" .
DAYUM MAN!!! Tell it like it is! As a land owner also the the lack of answers, especially about the need for security and perceived threat, leaves me wandering what is not being told to the public. Not about CWD but about what the DCNR has planned that's not in the Response Plan.
Son of a bich, I hate to actually agree with outdoorobsession, BUT he is exactly right! We demand answers and resent the attitude expressed so far by the 'authorities'.
CWD is a lot of hype. No we don't want it and we need to do what we can to keep it away but eventually it will find its way to Alabama too. And killing all the deer first isn't going to help in the long run. That just means we have no deer left at all. The response plan is JUNK. And it could be really bad for Alabama if implemented. And it's going to get UGLY if the state really tries to carry it out.
How is anyone going to stop it? Some kind of armed revolution? Landowner going to beat up or shoot a state agency official about a bunch of deer? The "tyrannical government!" effort?
This plan is similar to many other plans in many other states. If someone wants to sue, fine. That's a remedy. It likely will be expedited and I'll bet a nickel won't hold up in court between Joe Landowner who's hunted deer "all my life" vs. biologists. Sorry, but it just won't end up easy-peasy with landowners tripping merrily down the ScrewGubbermint! yellow brick road.
Two, three years ago there was a situation with a high fence owner down in south Marshall County or Blount County. Can't remember which. But they killed all his deer. Right? Did the guy go apeshit and have a tank or pitchfork mob in front of his property? Where was the outcry then about killing all his deer? A few here and there but it wasn't any kind of tar-and-feather revolution.
Personally, I don't believe the "shoot 'em all" action plan like has been tried in Wisconsin and is underway in Minnesota is a solution. And while shooting 50 or 60 deer in a 5-sq mile zone doesn't sound palatable, it's not "eradicating" all the wild deer in that zone. A 5-mile radius is a pretty big zone.
CWD is a real deal and it's not "fake" or bulldoodoo or anything else. It's a serious disease. Been around for decades. Probably poses the closest threat to a species crossover due to similarities with BSE. But will it kill all the deer? Nope. Look at Wisconsin and two dozen other states. It's just a bigger issue with IMO more tentacles into other things -- being spread by predators? spread by the gazillion gallons of urine? -- and it requires attention.
Yet the public knee-jerk hysteria, lack of knowledge or desire to learn, massive distrust (this, mostly), and "You ain't goannnaaaaa do that!" will create more problems than anything else. It's going on in Tennessee right now and it happened in Mississippi. Y'know what? Their deer are still around, hunting seasons got changed a bit and life goes on. The same will happen here when it's found.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: CWD Response Plan - 12/20/1805:28 PM
Clem, I highly doubt people wanting to know more about the plan and to know more about why WE have to PAY for some security force will create MORE problems. That is a load of BS.
It is OUR land, and our tax payer money funding this plan. We actually have a RIGHT to know. Maybe you dont care, but I surely want to know a lot more. A lot of us do.
No one is talking about a revolution but YOU.
What we WILL do is NOT report any dam dead deer and then the problem will get BIGGER because people do not like the unknown.
Heck, two of my neighbors have track hoes. We can just bury the dam deer on our own and not say a freaking word. Take us maybe 10 minutes.
THAT is what NOT informing the public or answering their concerns will get.
Because sure enough, unless WE hear some answers that is how we will deal with it. On our own and NOT tell Fish and game a dam thing about any dead deer.
5 minutes with a trac hoe and a couple bucks worth of fuel. No problem..problem solved.
Heck they dont want to inform the public over their legitimate concerns? Then why should the public inform THEM of problems of their concerns? It will take the public helping to address the problem...but they wont with unanswered questions.
Im sure a lot of folks will take the same approach as well.
1. A "security force" would need some more explanation. I agree. Never disagreed about that.
2. SwampHunter said this: "And it's going to get UGLY if the state really tries to carry it out."
That's not an invitation for potted meat and a Coke. If it's not at the worst a suggestion for a revolution then I don't know what it is.
I never said that no one doesn't have a right to know. Nor did I say it's something folks should just roll over and take. Nor did I say I didn't care - so don't assume about that. You're smarter than that, I know, and I know you and others care a lot about all this.
Asking questions is great. Even suing if you believe that's the right course of action is fine. Hell, marching on Montgomery and at the CAB meeting in January and whatever might be needed. I ask questions and want to know more, too. Just because I'm not pounding a fire-spouting pitchfork into an internet forum doesn't mean I'm not asking folks things.
But it's not like this initial protocol hasn't been done in other states and is still being done. And it will be done in Kentucky and Georgia and the Carolinas and any other state where CWD is found there.
Clem, I highly doubt people wanting to know more about the plan and to know more about why WE have to PAY for some security force will create MORE problems. That is a load of BS.
It is OUR land, and our tax payer money funding this plan. We actually have a RIGHT to know. Maybe you dont care, but I surely want to know a lot more. A lot of us do.
No one is talking about a revolution but YOU.
What we WILL do is NOT report any dam dead deer and then the problem will get BIGGER because people do not like the unknown.
Heck, two of my neighbors have track hoes. We can just bury the dam deer on our own and not say a freaking word. Take us maybe 10 minutes.
THAT is what NOT informing the public or answering their concerns will get.
Because sure enough, unless WE hear some answers that is how we will deal with it. On our own and NOT tell Fish and game a dam thing about any dead deer.
5 minutes with a trac hoe and a couple bucks worth of fuel. No problem..problem solved.
Im sure a lot of folks will take the same approach as well.
I haven't read all of the responses thoroughly, but have you tried contacting AL WFF/DCNR directly and not a couple of employees that are members on a hunting website? If that fails, contact your State Reps/Senator, the news media, ...
Heck, I see things on here all the time related to my line of work and I dang sure ain't responding in any kind of official capacity (or even acknowledging that I know anything about it). We have folks, as does the State, that get paid to be official spokesmen/women for the company/organization.
How many people went to the Meetings that were held all over the State about this????
The Plan, as drafted, is in the original post!!!
Why all the questions on an internet forum???
Because a DCNR employee posted it here.
As a courtesy and convenience so that you don't have to take the time to go try to find it yourself. Say thank you and if you have issues with what it says, schedule a meeting with Chuck and take it up with him.
How many people went to the Meetings that were held all over the State about this????
The Plan, as drafted, is in the original post!!!
Why all the questions on an internet forum???
Because a DCNR employee posted it here.
As a courtesy and convenience so that you don't have to take the time to go try to find it yourself. Say thank you and if you have issues with what it says, schedule a meeting with Chuck and take it up with him.
Yeah you stupid idiots and ugrateful a-holes, just shut up and say thank you for the brilliant mind that is Chuck and show your appreciation for the hired armed Security Force that comes along and wipes out the deer on your property.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: CWD Response Plan - 12/20/1806:39 PM
I thank Matt for posting it. I LIKE Matt. I appreciate him posting it up.
And yes, I emailed Chris Blankenship and Chuck Sykes over it.
Im pretty sure no one knew that at these meetings they were planning all this. I highly doubt there was any mention of Security Forces at the meetings as well, but maybe I was wrong.
They were called "Hunters Night Out" and it seemed that they were discussing the validity of CWD but I didnt hear they were laying out this plan while at those meetings. It seemed much more just a way of getting hunters to understand CWD and discuss it.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: CWD Response Plan - 12/20/1806:53 PM
Originally Posted by hallb
Originally Posted by abolt300
Originally Posted by centralala
Originally Posted by Hogwild
How many people went to the Meetings that were held all over the State about this????
The Plan, as drafted, is in the original post!!!
Why all the questions on an internet forum???
Because a DCNR employee posted it here.
As a courtesy and convenience so that you don't have to take the time to go try to find it yourself. Say thank you and if you have issues with what it says, schedule a meeting with Chuck and take it up with him.
Yeah you stupid idiots and ugrateful a-holes, just shut up and say thank you for the brilliant mind that is Chuck and show your appreciation for the hired armed Security Force that comes along and wipes out the deer on your property.
I dont think the "Security Forces" are going to kill the deer, they are just going to "Protect" the "Shooting Teams" doing the shooting from any angry landowners and/or neighbors.
Possibly arresting them or even using FORCE against them on their OWN Property, in case they get upset over the large scale killing taking place on THEIR PERSONAL PROPERTY because that is a very American way of doing things! The STATE Forcing it on the land owners on their Own Property for the "Greater good".
Im sure the federal "Gun confiscation teams" will also have "Confiscation teams" AND "Security Teams" guarding them when they come for conservatives guns when the libs take over. And no one sees a problem here?
Oh..if it was the feds coming for your guns at your house, YOU ALL WOULD have a problem with it.
Funny how people see things from different perspectives. I mean..this "Response Plan" is for "the greater good".... But wait!..Isnt that what the libs say about gun confiscation.
Im pretty sure no one knew that at these meetings they were planning all this. I highly doubt there was any mention of Security Forces at the meetings as well, but maybe I was wrong.
They were called "Hunters Night Out" and it seemed that they were discussing the validity of CWD but I didnt hear they were laying out this plan while at those meetings. It seemed much more just a way of getting hunters to understand CWD and discuss it.
I was there and that is a correct assessment.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: CWD Response Plan - 12/20/1806:55 PM
Originally Posted by jhardy
Originally Posted by outdoorobsession
Im pretty sure no one knew that at these meetings they were planning all this. I highly doubt there was any mention of Security Forces at the meetings as well, but maybe I was wrong.
They were called "Hunters Night Out" and it seemed that they were discussing the validity of CWD but I didnt hear they were laying out this plan while at those meetings. It seemed much more just a way of getting hunters to understand CWD and discuss it.
I was there and that is a correct assessment.
I know others that went and that was their feedback as well....
One thing about it, if the state does need to kill some deer for sampling, there is no shortage of them along the highways of our area and every one they kill will be one less $5,000 to $15,000 comp claim in my office!
Where to start.... as most know from my previous post here I follow this pretty close and I purposefully posted the “security force” to stimulate exactly this public discussion. The state DCNR and CAB have serious issues about how they are handlthing this even in the “response plan” planning phase. Their are a couple of PACT groups forming up to push for changes to the plan now, how successful they will be is yet to be determined but for those of you who truely care about the future of hunting even if it is in a post CWD Alabama maybe you should get involved in the discussion.
As for the revolt centralala mentioned I hope it doesn’t take that but I can assure you there are certain parties who will go exactly to that extreme if it comes to it. I know that sounds ludicrous considering it’s just an animal but if the state comes out without any judicial process and decides to destroy something you have worked for, your vey livelyhood in some cases what extreme would you go too? In regards to the high fence operation depopulated that is a different circumstance all together as they were actively breaking state and federal laws by transporting deer across state lines. The case went to court and the high fence owner lost the depopulation was part of the legal process and there for there was due process.
As for wanting to know what the state is thinking anyone of us are free to file a FOIA request and gain access to the DCNR’s “papers” regarding this matter. I am honestly surprised it hasn’t been done yet and suspect it will happens soon, along with the papers on the SOA. Why not that is one of our rights as tax papers to keep public servants honest. As for the state boys sure would hate for some of them to go “Clinton bleach bit” crazy after reading this and end up breaking the law.
DR Kroll AKA Dr Deer wrote a story on Wisconsin and stated the facts Not something I dreamed up Go to utube and watch Keith Warren In Texas They killed over 600 on a farm there and I think the farm owner now is in a law suit for the cost of all the deer I hope they ream their @$$ Threre was a deer farm in Missouri they killed everthing after one trophy buck was shot and texted for cwd they killed everthing
If CWD is found inside a fenced deer farm then I'm all for Chuckie going in, killing them all, and torching the place. However, I don't see mowing down an entire wild population as being a reasonable way to deal with it.
The plan states that it would be with permission and full cooperation of private landowners. I took that as the landowner says "no" they just move on until they get a "yes". By the plan, it's voluntary. So, there is no threat from private landowners. I was just curious at the perceived threat. Now with no answers, I'm growing skeptical.
There are deer in research centers I think Wisconsin has some Go to ted nugent on cwd on face book and listen to him and you will see what iam telling you
Have you listen to Ted Nugent on face book Look it up Ted Nugent on CWD Security teams What does that mean Secure the shooters what happen if the Security Team is not secure ???????
How about asking ‘Uncle Ted’ to let all the Scientists, Biologists and Veternarians know about this test that is available for testing live white tali’s, too.
I wonder just how many of these Badazz, Ultra-Conservative, Anti-Government Anarchist are going to EXPECT the ‘State’ to test their deer for them before consumption once CWD is detected in AL????
If CWD is found inside a fenced deer farm then I'm all for Chuckie going in, killing them all, and torching the place. However, I don't see mowing down an entire wild population as being a reasonable way to deal with it.
Wow talk about playing both sides of the field, guess when they find one within 25 miles of your place you will invite Chuckie in to kill every deer on your place too?
If CWD is found inside a fenced deer farm then I'm all for Chuckie going in, killing them all, and torching the place. However, I don't see mowing down an entire wild population as being a reasonable way to deal with it.
Wow talk about playing both sides of the field, guess when they find one within 25 miles of your place you will invite Chuckie in to kill every deer on your place too?
No. More like deer farms/transport were the root of this issue in the first place and I wouldn't give half a damn if they all got depopulated and shut down.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: CWD Response Plan - 12/21/1803:15 PM
Originally Posted by Hogwild
I wonder just how many of these Badazz, Ultra-Conservative, Anti-Government Anarchist are going to EXPECT the ‘State’ to test their deer for them before consumption once CWD is detected in AL????
A better question is: I wonder how youll feel If CWD is found near your new place and Fish and Game comes out and shoots all the deer ? Hmmm....
If CWD is found inside a fenced deer farm then I'm all for Chuckie going in, killing them all, and torching the place. However, I don't see mowing down an entire wild population as being a reasonable way to deal with it.
Wow talk about playing both sides of the field, guess when they find one within 25 miles of your place you will invite Chuckie in to kill every deer on your place too?
No. More like deer farms/transport were the root of this issue in the first place and I wouldn't give half a damn if they all got depopulated and shut down.
They might be the issue, might not. I'm still in the studying stage on this and I spent a night reading on CWD in Norway. They think it's only been there about 10 years and they have no clue how it got there. They are thinking on hunters boots or possibly urine. One thing of interest i saw mentioned there that I have not seen here (not saying I haven't missed it) is their concern of spread from salt licks. Maybe DCNR considers salt licks to fall under supplemental feeding when looking at possible spreading ways.
Yep, DCNRs all over the country didn't get out front quick enough and in Alabama it's out of control and has tentacles all over Montgomery. Our Lt. Guv owns Dream Ranch.
Yep, DCNRs all over the country didn't get out front quick enough and in Alabama it's out of control and has tentacles all over Montgomery. Our Lt. Guv owns Dream Ranch.
Ok, may be just a play on words but deer farming and high fence operations is 2 different things to me. You can buy elk, bison, and venison that are raised for consumption just like beef and pork. To me, that's farming. High fence is mostly trophy oriented and is not intended to feed the masses. But I know what y'all are referring to.
I wonder just how many of these Badazz, Ultra-Conservative, Anti-Government Anarchist are going to EXPECT the ‘State’ to test their deer for them before consumption once CWD is detected in AL????
A better question is: I wonder how youll feel If CWD is found near your new place and Fish and Game comes out and shoots all the deer ? Hmmm....
Dont come crying on here when it happens.
Remember, Its all for the greater good OK?
I have seen ZERO evidence that leads me to wide such a wild assumption. I have read that Plan from beginning to end several times over AND have had conversations with people in our DCNR concerning it. It has had my interest for quite some time now.....I suppose because of my experience from farming and being pretty familiar with Scrapies Eradication Policies. Our DCNR has stated several times that depopulation has not proven to be effective and that it was not an option that they saw as feasible.
Perhaps if others took the time to educate themselves and ask questions to our State's Biologists instead making erroneous claims and huge jumps in conclusions along with wild accusations on Hunting Forums, this thread would not contain so much blasphemy??
But, then again, it would not be the 'new and improved' Aldeer if that happened!
Eradicating deer to save them doesn't make sense to me either. I don't think the biologist know enough about it to make that conclusion. I sort of think natural survival will have the species show the resistant animals carry on the species. Has there been any state where the herd had over 90% kill from CWD?
WOW!!! The part about animals and fish being appropriated legally are private property in the legal sense. Is that a Missouri legal sense or a United States legal sense??
If I'm reading it right the Missouri DCNR took it on the chin and had their wings clipped.
Seems Indiana also thinks high fenced deer are private property. Harrison County Circuit Court Judge John Evans found the DNR overstepped its authority and that deer at facilities such as Bruce’s “are privately owned and not the property of the people of the state of Indiana.”
“Therefore,” the judge wrote, “the animals are not subject to regulation by DNR.”
There has been deer farms in the state of alabama for 33 years It has never been found They test every deer one year old or older and have never been a positive case Just saying it would take a dumb @44 to wish they would kill everything on deer farms If they do that then they will kill the deer where you hunt COOSA1
WOW!!! The part about animals and fish being appropriated legally are private property in the legal sense. Is that a Missouri legal sense or a United States legal sense??
If I'm reading it right the Missouri DCNR took it on the chin and had their wings clipped.
Seems Indiana also thinks high fenced deer are private property. Harrison County Circuit Court Judge John Evans found the DNR overstepped its authority and that deer at facilities such as Bruce’s “are privately owned and not the property of the people of the state of Indiana.”
“Therefore,” the judge wrote, “the animals are not subject to regulation by DNR.”
WOW!!! The part about animals and fish being appropriated legally are private property in the legal sense. Is that a Missouri legal sense or a United States legal sense??
If I'm reading it right the Missouri DCNR took it on the chin and had their wings clipped.
Seems Indiana also thinks high fenced deer are private property. Harrison County Circuit Court Judge John Evans found the DNR overstepped its authority and that deer at facilities such as Bruce’s “are privately owned and not the property of the people of the state of Indiana.”
“Therefore,” the judge wrote, “the animals are not subject to regulation by DNR.”
WOW!!! The part about animals and fish being appropriated legally are private property in the legal sense. Is that a Missouri legal sense or a United States legal sense??
If I'm reading it right the Missouri DCNR took it on the chin and had their wings clipped.
Seems Indiana also thinks high fenced deer are private property. Harrison County Circuit Court Judge John Evans found the DNR overstepped its authority and that deer at facilities such as Bruce’s “are privately owned and not the property of the people of the state of Indiana.”
“Therefore,” the judge wrote, “the animals are not subject to regulation by DNR.”
Sorry to tell those with such high hopes.......but, it did not hold up.
High hopes for what??
If you will pay attention, there is a huge resistance to this by owners of High Fence Operations. Read and ask questions for yourself.....to the RIGHT people, not me on a hunting forum. A lot of the misinformation is originating from the Special Interest of High Fence Owners to help garner support for their cause. The Response Plan is posted. I have seen zero evidence within it of this huge Conspiracy Theory that is floating around of 'killing all the deer'. If someone else has, PLEASE point it out to me. Because I am missing it!
Which I am not sure why??
According to many, our DCNR is Controlled by High Fence Owners. LOL
I ain't siding one way or the other. I'm just find some thing I'm seeing as interesting. The salt licks mentioned in Norway i found interesting since I haven't seen them mentioned here. That doesn't make me pro or anti salt licks. Deer in an enclosure not available to the public i didn't like the DCNR spending time and money on. But if what they are doing in an enclosure protects the deer on the outside, I could be swayed the other way. I am not anti DCNR. I am anti Chuck Sykes and that's no secret. You see me posting on this thread a lot because I've been studying on CWD a lot (plus I'm laid up after another neck surgery and can't do anything).
In my reading i am finding some discrepancies between DCNRs on CWD. I'm not talking Alabama. More like Virginia vs. Tenn. or Texas vs. Michigan and so forth.
As far as killing free deer in a 5 mile radius, by the plan is only 1 deer per +- 850 acres. Not bad. By the plan it will be with landowners permission and cooperation. I still can't see the need for a security teams if there is permission and cooperation.
As BhamFred has said, kill'em to save'em. What happens if nothing is done? What has actually happened in an unchecked wild herd? It's been around ,what 50 years? It hasn't killed off a herd that I can find.
If nothing else, CWD has taken the focus of the failure known as GC.
I ain't siding one way or the other. I'm just find some thing I'm seeing as interesting. The salt licks mentioned in Norway i found interesting since I haven't seen them mentioned here. That doesn't make me pro or anti salt licks. Deer in an enclosure not available to the public i didn't like the DCNR spending time and money on. But if what they are doing in an enclosure protects the deer on the outside, I could be swayed the other way. I am not anti DCNR. I am anti Chuck Sykes and that's no secret. You see me posting on this thread a lot because I've been studying on CWD a lot (plus I'm laid up after another neck surgery and can't do anything).
In my reading i am finding some discrepancies between DCNRs on CWD. I'm not talking Alabama. More like Virginia vs. Tenn. or Texas vs. Michigan and so forth.
As far as killing free deer in a 5 mile radius, by the plan is only 1 deer per +- 850 acres. Not bad. By the plan it will be with landowners permission and cooperation. I still can't see the need for a security teams if there is permission and cooperation.
As BhamFred has said, kill'em to save'em. What happens if nothing is done? What has actually happened in an unchecked wild herd? It's been around ,what 50 years? It hasn't killed off a herd that I can find.
If nothing else, CWD has taken the focus of the failure known as GC.
You just addressed my biggest issue with all this cwd talk. It’s been around a long time in some areas, what are some examples of a major negative impact it’s had on local herds in cwd areas? I guess I just don’t see cause for all the fear, but would love to see some examples. Admittedly, I’m not very well researched on the subject.
I honestly think that the greatest concern is cross-species transmission. As in, ‘is it Safe to consume venison from a CWD infected animal?’
While everyone is wailing away about hypothetical Security Teams holding them hostage while Shooting Teams go out and kill all ‘their’ deer; no one is stopping to consider the astronomical cost of testing EVERY deer harvested before consumption. Who is gonna pay for that??? We will, the Alabama Outdoorsmen! It may funnel through DCNR, or maybe USDA. But, they operate off of Tax money that comes from us. So, while it is fine to scrutinize the Plan; I feel it is absolutely ludicrous and completely selfish to resist efforts to impede the spread of the disease.
No one wants any disease to spread. No one wants a deer to be hit by a car. There is no way to know the answer to my question: What will more deer die from in, let's say a 5 mile radius where CWD has been found, EHD, CWD, or coyotes? Too many variables to answer that question but it is interesting. All hypothetical but I'm not convinced if I HAD to make a choice, I would choose having CWD over coyotes. Maybe I'm just prejudiced for my hate of coyotes.
Every “effective” effort should be made to stop the spread of CWD however with it showing up in some of these places with no traceable path it is clear the disease is not fully understood. Further, those efforts must be balanced against the rights of individuals as that is what this country was founded on. As for the high fence guys being active they are as they have a vested interest. The hypocrisy here is appalling when you consider how so many rant and rave about government over reach, individuals rights, and due process as long as they agree with the cause. However when it pertains to something they don’t agree with like the high fence guys then you are all for government imposing its will. The part about permission when compared with the plan and mobilization matrix does not pass the litmus test. I hope it’s a long time before we see this play out but until it does its all conjecture. It might be prudent for the state to take a different path and work with the high fence guys as there is on going research examining immunity and natural transmission rates in some locations (not Alabama). Further, as has been stated every deer that is one year or older that dies on a deer farm has to be sent to the state and tested at the farms expense. I have no idea how many samples this results in each year but I think there are about 200 farms across the state so it provides a steady cost effective means for the state to gain high quality samples at the farmers expense.
Many are acting as if deer are sacred and are never killed. I mean, folks seem mad are talking about an uprising or revolt about this!
But, many of those people (probably their fathers, uncles grand dad’s, actually) were all for the liberalization of antlerless harvests instead of site specific antlerless tags. If you have shot a doe this year, but complaining about the State Testing 1 per 850 acre in the CMZ Zone, then you need to just stop and think about things for a little bit before making any Judgement on the feasibility of the Plan.
And, also, I wonder do y’all not realize that all of these ‘State’ folks are real people? Most of them got into their field through a love of the Outdoors, Hunting and Fishing. Many of them also own land that they manage and enjoy, also. And, what about Chuck? He deer hunts. His family owns land. He has based his entire livelihood on Managing Wildlife. Why in God’s name would he want to ‘kill all the deer’? That would be like cutting his own throat!!
Guys, it is a ‘PLAN’. Failing to Plan is Planning to Fail!!!
From my conversations with those ‘in the know’, it is a Living Document that will be amended to stay current with Science/Biology to protect us and our Wildlife Resources.
CAB is appointed by the Governor and is not always in alignment with the ideaology of the Biologists. Albeit the result IS the same, there is a fundamental difference.
CAB is appointed by the Governor and is not always in alignment with the ideaology of the Biologists.
keep this FACT in yer front pocket for any future reference about the CAB. Not only are they not always "in alignment" with the biologists, the CAB can pass its own regulations over the objections of the biologists.
CAB is appointed by the Governor and is not always in alignment with the ideaology of the Biologists.
keep this FACT in yer front pocket for any future reference about the CAB. Not only are they not always "in alignment" with the biologists, the CAB can pass its own regulations over the objections of the biologists.
I agree,buddy. I feel that change was for the worse.......really de-valued the efforts of the Depts Biologists and created an entirely Political Platforn for decision-making.
CAB is appointed by the Governor and is not always in alignment with the ideaology of the Biologists.
keep this FACT in yer front pocket for any future reference about the CAB. Not only are they not always "in alignment" with the biologists, the CAB can pass its own regulations over the objections of the biologists.
I agree,buddy. I feel that change was for the worse.......really de-valued the efforts of the Depts Biologists and created an entirely Political Platforn for decision-making.
100% agree.
Just like last year when the CAB took spring turkey days away from us and Fred Harders, the assistant director of Wildlife and Freshwater Fisheries had this to say about the change....
“It’s a day that just about everybody has off,” Harders said. “If it comes in on a Thursday and you’re in a hunting club where you’re the only person who can get off on Thursday, it gives you a big advantage over everybody else.”
NO biological reason..... just because they wanted to.
Centralala You ask what will more deer die of where CWD is found I think hands down it would be E H D and blue tongue Last year every county in the state of Alabama lost deer to E H D and Blue Tonuge I would think the numbers would have been in the thousands Which on farms you find the dead ones in the wild you never see all the dead ones And don't let Matt Brock tell you that there is a cure for E H D and Blue Tonuge I have heard him tell a group of people that was a top dressing for the feed to stop this A load of BS There is not a cure for C W D either and its something we need to watch not run out and kill everything because you find one sick animal That is about as dumb as saying if a family member has cancer kill all the rest of the family and test them for cancer Wait if you kill them and they are not sick its to late for a live test
there have been vaccines developed in Texas for EHD that do work. Problem is that EHD is a virus and as such it mutates pretty often, like the flu in humans. And there are at least five known varieties of EHD and a vaccine for one won't work on the others.
And don't let Matt Brock tell you that there is a cure for E H D and Blue Tonuge I have heard him tell a group of people that was a top dressing for the feed to stop this
Huh??
No sir. If you walked away from any presentation I’ve given thinking that’s what I said then you heard wrong. It’s very frustrating when ppl twist words and post it publicly trying to make it appear I said something I did not. There are products ppl are working on that have shown very conflicting results, and that’s what I said. There’s a room full of folks who heard it.
Posted By: Anonymous
Re: CWD Response Plan - 12/24/1812:19 AM
Originally Posted by Mbrock
Originally Posted by hvfs1118
And don't let Matt Brock tell you that there is a cure for E H D and Blue Tonuge I have heard him tell a group of people that was a top dressing for the feed to stop this
Huh??
No sir. If you walked away from any presentation I’ve given thinking that’s what I said then you heard wrong. It’s very frustrating when ppl twist words and post it publicly trying to make it appear I said something I did not. There are products ppl are working on that have shown very conflicting results, and that’s what I said. There’s a room full of folks who heard it.
Dont let it bother you Matt. Pretty sure thats Rock again....just saying.
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