How close are we to actual tag system

I just wonder where this state sits as to being ready for an actual tag system where you phone/online check in and an actual tag put on the deer? There are still so many printing out duplicate sheets for more than 3 bucks, this we got now seems like it is getting abused more every year.

Won't happen.

I have heard lots of rumors about next year. A 3 buck honor system is useless.

never happen.

I don't think that tag system is the answer. I think that we need a telecheck system (phone check in). I also think it is time to limit doe harvest. Too many numbers hunters out there.

I think telechek is closer to reality than any kind of paper tagging system. For near future, online registration of kill data at outdooralabama.com is as close as we'll get to legitimate data collection.
Also believe state hopes renewed interest in updated, comprehensive FREE DMAP program will result in more data with better accuracy.
Since Gunter Guy took over, I know wildlife biologists have been required to do more with data collection than they ever have.
In southwest part of the state, a greater focus on mean conception date determination is a priority.
That obviously comes in the wake of the push to extend the deer season into February, but at least the state is spending the resources to collect the necessary information.
Main issue I see with a tagging system as some of you may be familiar with from hunting in other states is that participation is relatively low, even in some northern states where it's mandatory.
I have hunted in Pennsylvania, Ohio and Virginia. All have tagging and/or mandatory check-in requirements.
Truth is, if I didn't want to check in the deer I killed, there was nothing but my conscience to keep me from doing so.
Fines are stiff if caught with an unregistered deer, but apparently folks are still willing to risk it.
Alabama's argument has always been why should the conservation department risk resources such as money and labor in a system that does not guarantee the expected rewards of greater returns of data.
Bottomline for me is that individual hunting clubs are going to have to commit to providing more harvest data to the state either through participation in DMAP or by convincing members to use the existing online portal. Both will achieve the desired effect of helping the state better manage the herd without creating another layer of expensive government.
Just my .02 cents.

Because there is little honor left in people.

I've been an outspoken critic of the DCNR's efforts to manage deer on privately owned and leased lands through mandatory regulation and restrictions from the start. It's not authorized by law, and it's one step among others in the wrong direction in recent years.

I sat with Chris Cook and the president of our club/lease one day recently and shared with him more than 12 years of a combination of official DMAP logs and identical logs we have kept since pulling out of DMAP. We have cooperated with state biologists and followed their reccommendations for our lease as long as I have been there, and before.

Deer management should be site-specific and flexible, and it should be a cooperative effort. What we need to do in NE Tuscaloosa County is far different from what should be done in Marengo County for example. DMAP is the proper way to do it, and such cooperative programs are exactly what the law encourages.

There is no reason why the Commissioner cannot issue buck tags under DMAP the same way that doe tags are issued. An individual statewide buck limit is worthless and infringes on the right to hunt. Property-specific buck tags issued under DMAP would preserve the hunter's rights while properly protecting the species in a cooperative effort. Fellow hunters would do a great job of policing the other participants in the program without much if any need to tie up game wardens when they need to be working on real and critical threats to our game and fish. I've never shared a hunting lease that didn't provide their own fines and penalties when the club/lease rules were broken.

DMAP for both sexes of deer is the right answer.

I also think it is time to limit doe harvest.


I agree 100% there.

In some areas, like mine, if the state doesn't step in soon, they're going to be restocking deer again in a few years.

The perception is the risk isn't too great.

When I was with a crew hunting in Iowa a few years ago, we were pretty mindful of reminding each other to tag the deer before moving it. Not at the hotel or farmhouse or processor ... had to be tagged before moving, with the physical tag.

I wouldn't say we were poopin' in our drawers about it, but we were concerned about the ramifications of dealing with the possum po-po if we were negligent. We were reminded by our hosts to not forget to tag the animal. They don't mess around there, or that was what we believed.

In Alabama? I don't think anyone worries about it, especially when you could print three, five, 10 "harvest reports" and keep right on going along.

Just as a side note and not to derail this thread, but I am really interested in what Auburn finds over the course of the research on coyote impacts on fawn recruitment that is set to begin in early spring 2013.
I think it's safe to say there is a great impact and if/when the research bears that out, it will be interesting to see how the state takes it into consideration when setting seasons and bag limits.
I do agree with 49er in that any management based on results of this coyote research should be site-specific.
I don't think anyone would want to be penalized if coyote predation is not a problem where they hunt but blanket rules are enacted just because coyotes are killing a disproportionate number of fawns in the county next door or several counties removed.
I have no doubt that coyote predation on deer and other animals will soon be part of the discussion when setting our seasons and bag limits.
Perhaps as part of the new DMAP, coyote info such as number of sightings, hunter kills, known predation incidents and other related info should be included.
I'll have to call Gary Moody and check on that.

I hope we're close to some other system. Not many folks have any conscious nowadays.

In Alabama the 5 bird turkey limit has been on the honor system as long as I can remember, yet I've never heard of a push for a turkey tagging system. I guess they are more honorable turkey hunters than deer hunters in Bama.

The turkey hunters that I know police themselves/each other. Anybody shoots one over and they'll get turned in or a good ol boy butt whipping.

Most common refrain I've ever heard is "Stuck on four, still trying."

+1 on both counts.

I do not want to have to take my deer to a check station or worry about checking them in online. How many people honestly want to drive an hour one way to the nearest check station at 6pm after a hunt to check in a deer? How many people have access to the internet at the hunting club? If people are cheating on the 3 buck system in the club you hunt then deal with them. Public land should be dealt with by the wardens. Not sure I know of anyone who has killed more than 3 bucks on public land in a long time.

The problem is not guys in clubs that the members don't deal with its the guys that kill 3 in a club and more on private land that is never talked about. Some kind of hard tags are needed

You have a neighbor near you that needs limiting for sure. The son is finally seeing the light, I doubt dad ever will.

Are the people that are so hell bent for leather on a tag systems the same ones that posted on the scared in the dark thread? It sure seems like the same drone year after year that all of those evil other hunters are just slaughtering bucks and the gubment better do something about it. You know I was talking with a fellow just the other day that said his father's cousin's uncle's ex-wife's husband's son's girlfriend's brother had already shot 12 bucks with his bow and only shows one on his 3rd printed out card. I don't know about you, but that's gotta stop or there won't be any bucks for me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Get a grip folks! 1-800-272-GAME or email GAMEWATCH@DCNR.alabama.gov

Self policing is the best way, but I guess that means taking some responsibility!

I agree there needs to be a limit of some kind per hunter probably different for each county or section of the state From 1 to 3 depending on county.

Those that are in favor of the tag system that are complaining about "people" they know killing too many bucks, do you question them? Is it a real problem through out the state? Seems most clubs are managed more now then in the past. I hunt public land several times through out the year. Not too many opportunities for three bucks a year. I believe there will always be outlaws no matter what laws or restrictions are in place. Lets just not make it harder on the rest of us.

What if you have a large amout of acreage per number of hunters? In the moutains of NA, many situations 3 is nowhere near enough.

I'm with ya!
What if you are doing good management, creating excellent fawning habitat and killing all your coyotes and the State limits you to 1-3 does as some are suggesting? Should you just let your population overgrow the habitat? What if you truly don't want very many deer?

Between my post and yours, we are describing my place. Hope "the State" don't tie my management hands. I can shoot what's NEEDED in season, or the farmers can shoot everything they see in the Summer.

Deer hunting just seems to bring out the worst in some folks it seems the laws are always for the other guy to some people, just like a true hunter see your camera your stand he just walks on by ......some just can`t resist they have to take whats doesn`t belong to them. Just like shooting that fourth buck he doesn`t belong to you................Honor system does work in most clubs.........

he's not he only one, we got several bragging about 15-20 a year, some brag they never quit hunting them, pretty sure they're not blowing smoke

GWs are aware just haven't been able to do anything as of yet

same goes for deer

The real question is is there a reasonable efficient way to check the tags in somewhere. Like was said before I am for sure not going to want to drive a long way to check one in. I am going to want to show it off to my wife and kids and take it to the prossesor. Would all processors have tocheck them in when they get the deer in? And alot of people do their own processing. And some processors might turn a blind eye to a buck for friends. There has to be a culture change in the state if you want to change the deer management. To many brown it's down people (including folks in my family).

I've killed 15-20 does several years but never over 3 bucks, even when there was a buck a day limit. Each property is different.

Too close.

Well, so far, getting turned in hasn't made any difference. As far as I know, the state has NEVER prosecuted anyone for killing more than 5 turkeys in a season. That's over a period of nearly 50 years. If you can't make even one case in 50 years, I'd say the law is likely unenforceable.

With that example already in place, how could anyone have thought that a buck limit would be any different? I've yet to hear of anyone actually prosecuted for killing more than 3 bucks in a season. They've got some poor guys who forgot to do their paperwork, but I've yet to hear of a case against someone where they had actual proof that he killed more than 3 bucks.

There is no tag system that will not be easy to get around by those who want to do so. The one-buck limit in KY is a joke to many of the locals; they kill all they want.

preacher,


I doubt if it would be near as easy to get around a buck tag system issued under DMAP. If the hunters deer managers who share the property agree to participate, they will be more likely to be there to hear a shot or see someone trying to sneak a deer out without tagging him.

Not fool proof, but much better than trying to lay it all on the game wardens who need to be doing the serious conservation enforcement that petty feel-good rules take them away from.

preacher, I've never hear of anyone being arrested for killing over the season limit in Al on turkeys. Enforcement offers have for years and years asked for a tagging system on turkeys to at least try and curb the illegal killing. Those requests go in the circular file in Montgomery....

Ga had a tagging system when I lived there in the 70's and I knew of several arrests for having untagged or illegally tagged deer in possession. One fella had a buck with his wifes tag on it, fresh killed. Wife was still at home. Didn't fly....

49er, I agree a tag system would give the GW a better chance of catching somebody, but most of those who want to break the law are still gonna be able to do it without much fear of getting caught. But that's true with most any game law. To get many hunters to obey the law, you just gotta convince them its in their best interest to do so.


>>>preacher, I've never hear of anyone being arrested for killing over the season limit in Al on turkeys. Enforcement offers have for years and years asked for a tagging system on turkeys to at least try and curb the illegal killing. Those requests go in the circular file in Montgomery....<<<

I've asked several GWs and biologists, and nobody could ever name a case, so I've just started saying its never happened. Nobody has proved me wrong yet.

>>>Ga had a tagging system when I lived there in the 70's and I knew of several arrests for having untagged or illegally tagged deer in possession. One fella had a buck with his wifes tag on it, fresh killed. Wife was still at home. Didn't fly....<<<

I'm sure that kinda system will produce some arrests. I'm kinda ambivalent about tags. It would help the GWs make a few cases, so I'm not against them, but I don't think their impact would be biologically significant. The law-abiding hunters are gonna do right; the outlaws are gonna do wrong.

But just think how easy it would have been to implement the Barbour Co rule in most other counties. You've either got a legal deer or an illegal deer. No paperwork, no tags, no nothing, except near complete protection of the 1.5 class of bucks. But that ship has sailed.

Here we go again...Why don't you just agree with me and get it over with, you'll eventually get there anyway, don't drag out the pain

I think there should be a law against copy-n-paste.
Freaking killing me having to scroll through something I've already read.
I don't think I've done it once in 10 yrs!
Carry on!

They ain't cutting and pasting. They are using the quote feature. When they do that, it looks like this:



... and then when the guy replies using the quote feature again, it stacks up.


This is cut and paste:

(with emphasis added)

Don't be calling the quote feature cut and paste.

If I was a liberal, I might want get a law passed to make you quit calling the quote feature cut and paste. Since I'm a conservative, I don't think that's the legitimate purpose of government and I won't ask for such a law.

I enjoy reading new info. I guess it is quotes, not copynpaste.
I misspoke, but you get it.
Sorry for the hijack

Is the buck population near extinction and therefore needs a tagging system imposed on honest folks?? If it is then I say bring it on! However, if it is only to prevent someone from shooting a deer that someone else deems it antlers to be too small or too immature and just create more words on paper for people to feel good, then go forth and write up all of the rules regulations and laws for your own property and be the big sheriff in your own one horse town.

agree

Somebody had to say it.

The tag system does work. Badly needed in Alabama. Based upon what I saw harvested last year would make you sick. Several deer(Buck) that dressed out maybe 18 pounds brought to one processor that I saw from frequent stops on the way home from several daily hunts. Many Alabama hunter are not looking at the big picture and Alabama Wildlife Commssion has no clue of what's required to manage the herd. Alabama been down this road before. I have seen a tag system bring the best out in a hunter. It bring out honesty and responsibility and developes a good hunter unlike what I have seen in Alabama. I thought "if its brown it down" had grown out of the Alabama hunter's blood system but it is worst than ever. If the truth hurts do something about it.

Never! In fact, it's gonna be just the other way around, with you eventually surrendering. And then we will see Troy post this again:


>>>preacher has another convert.... <<<

I look forward to the day of your baptism as an AR proponent.

I take it that those "deer(Buck) that dressed out maybe 18 pounds" had visible antlers above the hair line? Or, maybe someone was out blasting does and did not genetically check to see which one would be the next world record buck and accidently shot a deer (buck), or was a hunter's first deer, or they wanted a deer to eat that I am sure the meat taste better than bones.

I still believe if you want the "herd managed", then manage it yourself and promote how well it works for others to willingly follow. That is the best of both worlds because you get to dictate what happens on your property and "your" herd and others get to manage their property and their herd. Or, should the State dictate a one size fits all management strategy and prevents you from managing your property the way you see fit? The knife cuts both ways and I have yet to see the government do a bang up job and managing anything!

You make some good points. The button bucks killed were a pair. Pissed me off big time. What a sick hunter. Killed for meat. Black man hunting on an elderly lady property. Both could careless about the herd per the processor. The processor knows his cutomers fairly well. These two bucks are just the starters that brings me to the bigger problem. There were many other deer that did not make age 1 1/2. I have been hunting a doe tag system in Florida for 35 years. You have to apply each year but we have never been declined. I started back hunting in Alabama 2006 and you clearly see the herd management problem. My place is next to Fort Rucker. Fort Rucker game manager came to his senses 2012 and made big changes. Too bad that the Alabmam Wildlife Commission are slow readers to see the obvious. Still to many back woods hunters putting presure on the commission. The commission is in the Hope and Change management system. Go to a comission meeting and hear all the non sence from hunters. The big word is "heritage" my family has been in Alabama hunting since before Noah and the stories go on and on. That's a big part of the problem!

This guy is absolutely nuts.

....Thanks for your kind words....My wife thinks the same as you.... I hear it daily. 42 years and she's still hanging around. She even let me buy a real nice track of hunting property and a nice new tractor, talking about huts. She thinks I have enough hut trees but I keep planting more hut trees. You have confirmed what I have been hearing and the need for me to seek serious professional help. My mother agrees with you as well. Happy Thanksgiving to you and your family.